Dave Matthews Band : Name Your Reasons Why They Are So Bad & Hated.

I'm talking about the actual EQ/mixing/micing of the drum. Listening closely is the exact opposite of what needs to be done in order to hear what I'd like to hear. I'm not saying there's anything inherently wrong w/the drumming (or any other aspect of DMB), just that it doesn't appeal to me.

Not all music requires in your face parts. The drums don't need to "kick" on all the songs, just as the bass doesn't need to "thump" on all the songs. It's called balance...give one instrument the lead part and everything else just helps them out.

True, although you kind of derided your point: I don't think something is balanced if one instrument has the lead. I listen to tons of mellow stuff--I don't need something to be loud and aggressive to affect me. What I'm saying is that the drums NEVER kicks, the bass NEVER thumps. There's no funk, no heavy rhythm, no swinging groove, no woozy psychedelia, no sublime harmonies, no nothin' that I like. It all just seems very watered-down.

Pretty much EVERY band's fans has negative stereotypes

Amen! And just to prove it, I shall name some of my absolute favorite musical artists and give you the stereotypes (all false, mind you) that come along with them:

Duran Duran, Scritti Politti, Tears for Fears:  I am some former teenybopper who's also a holdover from the '80s. I wear lots of pink, frilly things, like to read old issues of Smash Hits, and talk like a Valley Girl IRL.

The Cure, Depeche Mode, Belfegore, Siouxsie & the Banshees:  I am a goth (as opposed to a Visigoth, which is something completely different) who is nothing but sour and darkness. I wear nothing but black, look like the undead, write bad, melodramatic poetry, and spend my days moping about.

David Sylvian, Bryan Ferry:  I am nothing but creaking bones. I cannot handle "real rock & roll" (obviously wrong as I'm also a huge Nirvana fan), but rather listen to soft, mellow songs instead.

And yes, I love U2 as well. I'm in the minority here, obviously, but I do quite like U2's songs. But that doesn't mean I'm going to follow every little thing Bono says and agree with it. I mean, he's sung the praises of Destiny's Child, for Pete's sake, and I'm absolutely in no way even remotely inclined to try them out.

Oh yes, and to all the Dave Matthews Band fans who might still be reading this thread: You think YOU'VE gotten grief over being fans of the band. Huh. At least many music critics and most of the mainstream music press seem to take your favorite band seriously. One of my biggest obsessions has been with Duran Duran -- they've never gotten a single positive review ever, as far as I know. Not only that, they get lampooned by pretty much everyone in the music press (save for the ones who happen to post here). I've taken a lot of shit for being a Duran fan, but that hasn't stopped me from being a fan. In fact, it's strengthened my fanhood tremendously.

Presently, seeing as though I've matured a bit, someone can tell me they don't like any one of the artists I adore and I wouldn't have a problem with that. So long as the individual's not saying anything bad about ME, PERSONALLY (which I have not seen in this thread), I don't mind.

That's a bit rich, Sterling.

Heaven forbid some people think "DAVE" is shit! They obviously haven't heard him, or or or are jealous, or or or are arrogant and mean, they couldn't possibly just think his music is total fucking wank, oh no, there must be some outrageous ulterior motive, maybe a big corporation or nike shoes or george w or a foetus or heres whatever yeah dave matthews band rocks.

I'm sure I've said this here before, but whatever. Any zealous declarations of fandom (i.e. "Killing Joke Uber Alles!" or "DMB RULES!") will immediately render any opinion you could submit moot, as you're subtracted any semblance of objectivity from your argument. Moreover, statements like "DMB play REAL music and you're just jealous" is as effective an approach as "my Dad can beat up YOUR Dad!" It's pointless and devoid of any real merit in the course of a debate.

Yes, taste is indeed all relative, but you still have to be able to back up your arguments with more than that. Convince me that you've listened to a myriad other artists and still come back to DMB and you'll be waging a stronger campaign to win me over.

A rare occasion when I would urge you to listen to Bono, Dee.

*bongo solo*

You seems to be hedging your bets. Which is it: do the drums kick? or is it unnecessary for them to do so?
I still think you're misunderstanding me--I'm speaking purely from a engineering/producing perspective. And it's not just the drums; everything seems so tame. There's no sonic distinctiveness to anything. Again, there's nothing inherently wrong w/that, it's just not my--and I'm guessing many others'--cup of tea.

Millar OTM

And should bands be liked by everybody? I dont see how. Bands should be an acquired taste. They shouldnt be like Coca Cola where its marketed for everyone to like. I find the appeal of DMB is that its not marketed like that, it is out of the mainstream.
Most fans arent buying the albums and going to concerts because of mtv/radio hits. And also the fact the music is great and is different to anything else out there.

http://www.mtv.com/news/photos/l/limp_bizkit01/flipbooks/images/flip3.jpg

keep rollin', baby!

I will the the first to admit that I do not meet some of the ideals listed above, but I think some of them are worth striving for. Additionally, I think some of the problems faced in music criticism also apply to other artisitc and social arenas. The unwillngness to come to terms with a different type (of whatever sort), to rely on assumptions and stereotypes, and not understanding or experience, is, to me, a flawed process, one that goes on not only in music but also in interpersonal relationships, and social ones. Sterling, your fervent defence of antiracism over the span of many threads, for instance, creates the expectation, for me, that you are familiar with the process of the willful misunderstanding of others, which is certainly at least part, though not all, of the problem of racism. Again, though the context is different, the underlying logic is similar. The logic itself is problematic, and any views stemming from it are automatically flawed.

Lastly, I spent a lot of time on my post last night, which is maybe why it sounds pedantic, but it is also why I may seem to be missing the point. After a while, I figured it would be better to cover gaffes that may not have been specifically made, just because I happened to think of them while I was writing.

Limp Bizkit > Linkin Park > Foreigner > Smashing Pumpkins > Matchbox 20 > Nickelback > DMB > REO Speedwagon > Creed > Styx > Staind

No MP3's, we're in the process. It's (I know I said it wasn't a jam band, but it is a teeny bit "jammy")jam/jazz/rock/hard to explain type of music with a lot of freaky keys and meters. You'd have to hear it to understand what I'm saying. And no, it doesn't sound like DMB in the least bit.

Says you.

Killing Joke is perfect.

http://www.an-irrational-domain.net/images/band79-82/band81bed.jpg

yes all right Alex, you don't have to be snippy about it though :(

Alex, apart from Killing Joke. What other bands do you like?

Killing Joke will always be my absolute faves, but other than they....in no particular order: Cop Shoot Cop/Firewater, the Misfits, XTC, Devo, the Stranglers, Buzzcocks, the Ramones, Iggy & the Stooges, the Modern Lovers, Kiss, the Birthday Party, Julian Cope, Black Flag, The Wedding Present, Talk Talk, Joy Division/New Order, the Circle Jerks, Gang of Four, the Pop Group, Gavin Friday, Queen, Massive Attack, Motorhead, Anthrax, the Sisters of Mercy, Discipline-era King Crimson, the Velvet Underground, This Mortal Coil, the Smiths, Talking Heads, Bowie, the Cure, the Cult, Theatre of Hate, Kraut, Ch3, Black Sabbath, Iron Maiden, the Damned......and a bunch more.