Revolt of the ILX Brigade: New Post-Fahey Folk For PPL that post in the Takoma & Tompkin's Square Threads

Also Tortoise maybe seems dated in ways or not as impressive once you found out more, bit they prepared me for a whole lot of arty instrumental stuff all across the board. I saw William Tyler played w Doug McCombs in Chicago & wasn't surprised to read that Tortoise was a big deal to him

tortoise also had a great drummer

Just throwing in that I, too, had a gateway via Chicago scene/Sonic Youth referencing. Loved Gastr del Sol, and followed along with the O'Rourke albums (played Cul de Sac on my radio show a bunch too, back in the day).

UMS, Bob Weir is my biggest barrier to listening to the Dead, and I pretty much tune out a lot(most) of his tunes, though Jimmywine listed some of his good ones above. That being said, if you skip the "Bob-ness" of Bobby (the jean shorts, pink polos, insane vocalizing in later-period Dead) and focus on some of his playing, you hear a dude who was one of the great improvising rhythm guitar players. Just some insanely good stuff from him, but whatever, there are so many reasons not to dig the Dead I get why it doesn't work for large chunks of the population.

Also, I gotta read that Fahey piece from How Bluegrass Music Destroyed My Life about working on the soundtrack for Antonioni's film, it's been too long.

Sorry, final one: La Lechera, Tortoise had two great drummers. I definitely dug Tortoise at the time, haven't listened to them in ages, but I love this one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLCgcp83Tfg&feature=kp

Yikes, wish I could edit the embed, sorry folks.

The more the merrier when it comes to not-boring drummers! I do think that rhythmic variety is part of what separates the bands that make interesting instrumental rock from yr avg jammers.

drummer idea is interesting, maybe it's that music like this that veers into "out" territory can really benefit from a professional pulse, and in fact that may be the thing that can make all the difference, regardless of the chops of the axe players.

hard to trace my own path into this stuff since my mom listened to Fahey and I grew up w/him and Flat & Scruggs, etc. it went kinda like high school art rock to high school punk to hardcore to Sonic Youth to The Ex & Fugazi to GBV/Sebadoh/Unrest/Pavement with a Current 93/NWW/Coil detour and then maybe I came back around to the Fahey stuff sometime in the 90's, definitely remember starting to pick the LPs up cheap around 1996 or so. but it was always part of my musical worldview.

one thing I wanted to throw into the conversation about band/audience commonality is the factor of labels, which giving some of this pretty varied stuff an aesthetic continuity it might not otherwise have, Drag City is a great example as it ties into the older stuff like O'Rourke and then the new like Rangda.

"give", not "giving"

Oh, I think labels are a huge part of it, from having a "Takoma" sound to the current nexus revolving around Tompkins Square (the most trad) and then Three Lobed/Paradise of Bachelors/MIE, which tend to snatch up most of the highest-profile of these releases coming out these days. I know so many people that basically latched onto Drag City and connected dots related from their releases over the years. Case in point is that a bunch of my friends love "Corky's Debt To His Father" by Mayo Thompson, and this is directly from the Chicago/Drag City tie-in to Red Krayola etc.

gamera is a classic w/ that vintage pajo playing. may have mentioned them upthread by the doub mccombs records w/ david daniell are some moody, smoky stuff worth yr time. it's definitely true how much drummers affects yr playing tho. this thread is making my miss my drummer friend who has moved away, it was so much fun to play together, the energy is incredible.

those labels have all been little hubs (strange attractors & bo'weavil too). I think grubbs was the big link w/ mayo thompson too, he definitely stanned for the records he did w/ art&language. also going back to plugged-in faheyisms, idk if you've all heard the red crayola concert where fahey comes on w/ an electric he can barely play & is accompanied by a 'drummer' which is a melting block of ice whose drips are picked up by contact mics, but it is probably the strangest fahey cameo of all time.

Bob Weir is the biggest choochbag that ever lived & I don't know how you ppl cab ever be transported anywhere with that dipshit mugging in dazy dukes and a safari shirt and 1980s shop teacher glasses

― sXe & the banshees (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, February 26, 2014 10:35 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Grandavis is otm about Bob as a rhythm player--put him in any other band and tell me he's not 'out.' Listen to what's happening during a Jerry solo (for the sake of this argument, try to just listen to Weir - I realize this is hard to do while Jerry is in the other channel). He somehow manages to completely stay out of the way (this has a lot to do with playing inversions and triads and stuff, but also the tonal quality of his guitar vs Jerry's, which was v much by design) but is also kinda going bananas up the neck. Not a lot of stock 'comping' or first position campfire bullshit going on. The closest rock player I could compare him to in this way is Dickey Betts (totally different style obv). Guy is a brilliant player, Daisy Dukes notwithstanding. But you're certainly not alone in your hatred of him - I've had this same argument with Deadhead friends (and even some of the players we're discussed in this thread) and Bobby does indeed seem to present the biggest impediment to Deadhead enlightenment (which is strange because we're talking about a band that also included Brent "Kenny Loggins" Mydland).

Shifting gears, how do you guys rate that Three Day Band thing Fahey did with Ayal Senior? It's one of the only holes in my Fahey collection. I get that it's nonessential (no one ever talks about it!) but, if I'm one of those guys who views Red Cross as some pinnacle of human achievement, should I track it down?

I was maybe a little hard on the Dead there, I love American Beauty! What a great/great sounding country rock record - the general public got it right once again.... Also I dig Anthem of the Sun, partially because, at least the vinyl copy I have, is one of the Missy bizarrely mixed rock records ever

not got the ayal senior thing. I'm kind of trying to pace myself w/ the remaining fahey stuff now bc the thought of never having that first listen again is so sad, but the clips >here< are quite tempting

There was also this Renaissance Fairgrounds gig I liked.... What's the Dicks Picks to convince a skeptic?

Jimmywine seems to have the Grateful Dead game on lockdown, going to let him steer you on this one (I haven't spent serious time with the Dead for a long time), but the trick of listening to Bob is a good one. He is just a great player, especially when he mostly shuts up and goes at it.

I think Tyler went on a listening spree recently as well, maybe he has an especially fresh take on The Dead as well.

anyone let me know (also spottie don't add 250 volumes of Dick's Picks to the spotify playlist :) )

this thread is getting way too hip, i gotta bring it back to the roots w/some ponytail NPR shit...i'm pretty in love with this record...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnbYG2xiSE8

http://soundcloud.com/matthew-lee-helgeson/gabriel-ii

fucking around w/a drum machine & fingerpicking, feel like there's something there

decided on Dick's Picks Vol 4 - 2/13/70

figured early 70s was best...this had a long Dark Star which piqued my interest...they hadn't gotten really crappy sounding corny instrument tones yet. Casey Jones is p peppy so far, first tune.

lmao oh lord pac they are covering "Dancing in the Street" by Martha & the Vandellas...come home Jagger/Bowie all is forgiven

actually once they dispense with the formality of actually having to cover the song, this jam that goes on for another 6 minutes is p good

I'd recommend Dick's Picks 22 if you're up for another one after that one; that's my personal favorite so far of the 10 or so that I've heard. It's from 1968.

ha yeah, i feel like "dancing in the street" is the ultimate "omg just get to the jam section" dead song.
& yeah, I have listened to tons of live dead in the last 2-3 years after staying away from them for a long time. don't know if i have any major insight other than that the Dead rule. For the most part. but you could easily live your life w/o really going past 1974ish.

74 sounds like a good cutoff, i use a similar rule on zappa mostly, i don't get too far past the breakup of the original mothers

i mean, i find things to like throughout the 70s -- the 80s/90s are kind of fascinating in a trainwreck kinda way (and there is some good music, for sure). i'll probably end up being one of those dudes who's like "1989 was their best year, man!"

do any of you guys rate Blue Roses / Laura Groves? I've got the eponymous Blue Roses LP and it's pretty incredible stuff. A few cuts with some gentle, spare acoustic picking and multilayered background vox that seem to fit in this vein to a slight degree though it owes a bit to Kate bush and late 60s/early 70s UK female folk singers.

new to the site and the thread, so hello to everyone.

Lots of great stuff to be exploring. Not read *everything* so forgive if there's any repetition. A few things that come to mind:

- not sure if it's been mentioned but Bruce Langhorne's Hired Hand soundtrack, along with Sandy Bull seems like a precursor to a lot of this stuff. Such a great 'album'.

- This leads pretty much directly to Scott Tuma for me, who's quietly released 5 of the most beautiful records of the 00s. <i>Not for Nobody</i> reduces me to a gibbering wreck.

-Plus anything by Hallock Hill. Guy called Tom Lecky who works in a more improvisatory style, but whose work carries the ghosts of a lot of the primitive tradition. <i>The Union/A Hem of Evening</i> on MIE is a thing of wonder.

Hey Chinaski, welcome. This is a long thread, so a lot to absorb. Langhorne's Hired Hand got a good repping here, and has been brought up (was new to me, I really loved it). Tuma has come up as well I think, but I definitely have been meaning to dig deeper. Haven't had a chance to listen to much, but I see his name popping up a lot in relation to a lot of stuff I love, so it seems likely I will be into it.

Just listened to Hallock Hill recently, pretty cool. Read a bit about his methods, I like the approach in theory quite a bit. It got a little samey for me but I need to listen to it a bit more. A really nice sound for sure. Definitely been into pretty much every MIE release, becoming a go-to label for me.

Al, can honestly say I have never heard of Blue Roses/Laura Groves. What era is it from? Those aren't names I have seen pop up at all, which is intriguing in iteslf.

http://youtu.be/t5kaYN1wT2Q

this is one of the cuts that made me think she'd be enjoyed up in here though like I said she's maybe not 100% in the style of this thread. This is from 2009!

Cool, thanks. Will try to check it out in a bit.

- not sure if it's been mentioned but Bruce Langhorne's Hired Hand soundtrack, along with Sandy Bull seems like a precursor to a lot of this stuff. Such a great 'album'.

- This leads pretty much directly to Scott Tuma for me, who's quietly released 5 of the most beautiful records of the 00s. <i>Not for Nobody</i> reduces me to a gibbering wreck.

-Plus anything by Hallock Hill. Guy called Tom Lecky who works in a more improvisatory style, but whose work carries the ghosts of a lot of the primitive tradition. <i>The Union/A Hem of Evening</i> on MIE is a thing of wonder.

― Chinaski, Thursday, February 27, 2014 4:20 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Welcome, Chinaski! I thought I was the only one who drew a line from [Hired Hand (pretty much one of my all-time favorite pieces of music) to Tuma, who is a very overlooked dude imo. I think I brought it up earlier on this thread, but another piece of this puzzle is Head of Wantastiquet. Any fan of Langhorne, Tuma, et al owes it to him or herself to hear the album Dead Seas.

I think Tuma is sorta slept on mostly because he doesn't seem very ambitious. He rarely tours or plays outside of Chicago. I mean, he sorta makes Glenn Jones look like a social-climbing careerist or something by comparison.

What is the best Tuma release, or your favorite at least?

I really like Dandelion but Not For Nobody gets a lot of play around here, too. Some of his stuff sounds like Dead Man if someone brought the faders down on everything but the room mic.

"Some of his stuff sounds like Dead Man if someone brought the faders down on everything but the room mic." Hah sold man, sounds exactly like my kind of thing. Thanks for the recs.

welcome chinaski

tyler says it's John Fahey's birthday

happy birthday to the man wherever his spirit now resides

<3

Happy 75th!

I'm sure there's a couple here that follow Delta Slider; but the blog, for atleast the past 4 or 5 years, has always done a 'Fahey Week' on the days leading up to his birthday.

http://delta-slider.blogspot.com/

This year was pretty decent, mostly live shows that haven't been widely distributed. I really wish there was one fell swoop that people could grab live Fahey material. Ryan Leaf, a contributor to the Fahey Players Yahoo Group, used to manage a database of sorts that had a completionist leaning list to download all of Fahey's live material.

Anyone else really into the live material? It is really great to get to hear medleys of tunes strung together that you normally aren't exposed to when listening to the albums. Plus is amazing banter, the banter is almost worth the listens on their own.

That mighta been kind of confusing.

What I meant was I wish there was a public website you could easily find that hosts all the known live recordings of Fahey. Full set lists, date and venue info, maybe light on the commentary, just a neutral perspective in the completionist vein. Links that don't expire too :)

I will say that Syracuse '71 is amazing, pretty sure I have a good 73 recording as well but I'll have to check at home in a few

oh man, I went looking through old bookmarks and found Ryan Leaf's archive of Fahey live recordings.

please let it be known that this is not available via Google search. this list used to be active and he was asking for anyone to contribute recordings that aren't featured in the archive yet. I don't know if he is still doing this anymore.

sleeve I don't see your '71 Syracuse here though, I do see a '72 Syracuse boot, could it be that one?

there's a good 25+ bootlegs here, plus some Fahey rarities like the great (unofficial?) cassette called "Azalea City and Other Toxic Nostalgia"

https://www.onlinefilefolder.com/2fWlzJPwSmAPJh
password: fahey01

enjoy!

references:
he did publicly post the link back in 2012 on his blog,
http://www.thesepathswetread.blogspot.com/2012/03/john-fahey-live-shows.html

Cool stuff. The one Fahey boot I've listened to a ton is from early 70s, a California radio station I can't recall the call letters of but it's great

yeah Neal you're right, I have:

Jabberwocky Syracuse University July 15, 1972
September 1972 McCabe's Guitar Shop Santa Monica, CA
and 1984-12-07

all those came from D!ME, I think...

Went to the record store today and snagged a use CD copy of China Gate by Cul De Sac & a vinyl copy of the lady & the unicorn by Renbourne

the swarthmore version of 'some summer day' is bottomlessly deep. some nice tape warble going on? performances aside i think the ramshackle/variable methods of recording these shows add a really cool, eerie atmosphere to the songs.

imo that Swarthmore recording is a standout. his guitar looms so large as it's not, like, a close miced performance for radio... it sounds like it's from partway through the audience. it's immense. also, a lot of the well-recorded versions of 'dance of the inhabitants' one don't come close to this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0cTdPTrihlI

i think it's important that the piece has the natural reverb and space that's offered by a big concert hall

Yeah a bunch were traded on DIME previously and other tapers-trading boards. I can imagine the lure for tape/sound board collectors to keep this stuff covered in cobwebs on various hard drives. But all this stuff should be made as public as possible, for the sake of getting the most Fahey material out there.

Agreed global tet. That is a great version of "Dance.."
I love audience recordings. Especially of unaccompanied guitar.