HAIM

I have to admit I'm disappointed that this is probably my favorite album of the year, because I don't think it's good enough to deserve that spot. Also, I don't generally like what I've heard of their vocals in live clips, but I think the vocals sound better than typical indie in the studio recordings.

(Still says more about the extent of my listening, my budget, etc. than anything else.)

Although this is ILM and I fully expect to be nailed to the cross for making allusion to some sort of "x-factor" or talent that can't be proven by science or labored argumentation.

i just find it curious that suddenly they are an indie band with all the attendant cliche'd dismissals of indie bands. this thread was started 10 months ago and the first post referring to them as "indie" was a quote from the dero review.

oh man I've waited all my life for a band doing Jennifer Paige's "Crush" with programmed tribal drums.

How are you using the term "gravitas", because both Brenda Lee and Little Stevie Wonder sound like children which is the exact opposite of what I think of when I think of "gravitas"

gravitas is rockist obv

I just wiki-ed it to make sure I was using it properly... "Gravitas was one of the Roman virtues, along with pietas, dignitas and virtus. It may be translated variously as weight, seriousness and dignity, also importance, and connotes a certain substance or depth of personality."

That pretty much works for me, especially the "connotes a certain substance or depth of personality"

I'm kind of a rockist. Sorry.

I wiki-ed "Chollopitas," one of the Roman virtues. It may be translated variously.

lol

brenda lee was 15 when she cut "i'm sorry". and she didn't sound like a child. stevie wonder was what 22 when he made talking book? not to mention everything else he did before his 20th birthday? just two examples.

It is kind of a moot argument anyway, considering the song it's not measuring up against in the gravitas stakes is "Girls Just Wanna Have Fun", possibly the least serious song in Cyndi Lauper's entire repertoire

hahaha haven't been keping up but the argument is seriously that 'girls just wanna have fun' is loaded with gravitas??

The people demand gravitas.

flopson (and Alfred I supppose): when you come at me for using "gravitas" in a rockist way, are you asserting that gravitas doesn't exist? That it's a useless term? I'm being serious!

x-post -- that is pretty hilarious, actually. Fine, "Time After Time" if you must.

gravitas are nice on a hot day. along with pita chips.

"Girls Just Wanna Have Fun", possibly the least serious song in Cyndi Lauper's entire repertoire

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/d/d1/Single85.jpg

I'm actually surprised you didn't go with "Hole In My Heart"

well, it goes all the way to China.

Goones theme = great, great song. To me, there's a sense of joy and abandon in her delivery that, if we're continuing this HAIM comparison, underlines the flatness and lack of conviction in their singing and playing. Cyndi comes across both more vulnerable and more confident/authoritative. She's just a far better vocalist.

I can't believe that's potentially controversial

gravitas as you used it ("connotes a certain substance or depth of personality") is an essentialist (& therefore rockist) and arbitrary quality. not saying presence & charisma don't exist but i don't think the difference you're trying to point out is stark enough to make the point

i can't believe we've set up cyndi lauper as a strawperson for all female vocals in pop

clarke, i guess the question to ask is, for you, is it possible for a band to be good, maybe even excellent, if their singer didn't have gravitas / vocal chops / w/e quality you're attributing to cyndi lauper?

ya i was gonna say... do u think neko case is a good a vocalist as cyndi lauper?

if you're not as good as cyndi lauper, it's back to the woodshed for you!

the hilarious thing is that most singers aren't as good as Cyndi Lauper, full stop; she's fucking incredible

yeah, that's what I'm sayin

clarke, do you like new order?

like, Cyndi Lauper is easily one of the top 25 singers of the past 30 years, so I'm not really going to fault the lead singer of Haim for not being as good as her, like I'm not faulting the lead singer of Haim for not being as good as Celine Dion or prime-era Whitney or Mariah, or Anita Baker, or Toni Braxton, etc etc etc

"clarke, i guess the question to ask is, for you, is it possible for a band to be good, maybe even excellent, if their singer didn't have gravitas / vocal chops / w/e quality you're attributing to cyndi lauper?

― 乒乓, Monday, October 7, 2013 2:59 PM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink"

Oh of COURSE, I like so, so, so many bands with crappy-to-fair singers. I just think this kind of very slick, precise, extremely sculpted music demands a singer with a bit more of that "whatever quality I'm attributing". And yes, I do like New Order very much. But that is SUCH a different thing from HAIM.

some of the earlier haim songs sounded kind of pitchy to me but it seems that they tuned it all up on the album thankfully. I do think that they're trying for some stuff a little beyond their abilities which is fine by me. I don't mean in terms of gravitas, but just that they've written some parts that are a little difficult to sing in terms of the control required to do that staccato stuff. record sounds good though so who cares?

http://rlv.zcache.com/i_love_gravitas_png_reusable_water_bottles-r49016bc259be482292873d76d775792b_vblp1_8byvr_324.jpg

That's what I drink out of when I'm washing down a hot plate of chollopitas.

I'm not really going to fault the lead singer of Haim for not being as good as her, like I'm not faulting the lead singer of Haim for not being as good as Celine Dion or prime-era Whitney or Mariah, or Anita Baker, or Toni Braxton, etc etc etc

yeah, and for me that's actually a large part of how creativity works and how new original things are created! reaching for prime-era whitney and falling a bit short is more interesting to me than settling for something safe or taking influence from people who suck.

line of complaint about HAIM's vocal performance is almost as weird/unanticipated as the collapseboard one about them being the cynical adoptee du jour of pageview fiending middle aged bloggers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZC04J1a7iVU

^Least serious song in the Cyndi catalog.

wk, I agree, and I'd generally rather hear over-reaching and slightly falling short than smug virtuosic phoning-in. I think HAIM would be better served if their music were a little more rough-hewn and live-sounding. (Cue "rockist!"...)

to take this from the other side, i think the vocals on this are leaps and bounds beyond the vocals on like, the lorde album or something.

just spent some time trawling through snippets of live performances going back to mid-2012 and I really have no idea what Clarke is talking about re: pitchiness

It was really just the first song posted on this thread where I thought I caught a little whisper of it.

check out the first video in the thread. the line "without involving me" on the first verse at around 0:35 seconds sounds a bit flat to me on that video but it sounds like they tuned it on the final album version. I may be crazy though.

I think that's a timbre issue; the delivery is pressed but it doesn't strike me as flat

yeah it might be a different take on the album version

xp Jennifer Paige is a good call katherine. I could see them covering Crush.

ok I just lined the two versions up in a daw. there are definitely pieces of different takes being used, but also the syllable "volve" in that line sounds about 30 cents flat to me in the original.

Surely Haim being more "rough-hewn" would do away with one of their most distinctive and attractive qualities.

I would love for Haim to tour with Savages