robert ashley

this is a great interview

http://www.newmusicbox.org/article.nmbx?id=1194

ROBERT ASHLEY: Well, the problem in discussing hip-hop with somebody who doesn't like hip-hop is that they don't hear the melodies. There's no difference in the quality of the melody in any good hip-hop record now. There are so many I can't even name them. But there's no difference in the quality of the melody between that song and something like Billie Holiday for instance. It's just that the world has changed, the street language has changed and now you have to tune our ears to be able to hear that the very best hip-hop singers are singing exactly in tune. It might be going a little too fast; the melody might be going a little too fast for you to perceive it as melody, but there's no doubt that there's melody..

i've posted on ilm about five times, but i figured i'd chime in here--

got a promo for 'now eleanor's idea' this week and am enjoying it pretty well so far. as far as comparisons, it's not nearly as frightening as 'foreign experiences'; it's actually a lot like 'dust' in texture but more expansive, more desert-like (makes sense--the libretto is about a woman who finds her true calling in a low-rider community in new mexico). anyway, yeah, i've become near-obsessed with ashley in the past year and a half; this is pretty welcome right now.

the libretto is about a woman who finds her true calling in a low-rider community in new mexico

Haha, this sounds like it could be my soundtrack for 2008.

By coincidence, the first page of youtube hits for "Robert Ashley" turns up this story about a Robert Ashley in New Mexico, but it's not that one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAWl5ywT5ws

Now Eleanor's Idea is fantastic. An opera about a community of Mexican Americans who practice their relilgion through the design of elaborately painted low riders. The Mexican monologues floating through the mix talking about their lives in the 2nd section is new territory, and Joan LaBarbara goes off in the final section.

Not entirely new territory actually -- now that Now Eleanor's Idea and Foreign Experiences are out, it makes Yellow Man With Heart With Wings seem more like the crucial departure point for all the 90's work -- bits of the text from it actually turn up verbatim towards the end of Foreign Experiences -- it's good to finally have access to the larger picture. YMWHWW is the key album for anyone who's a fan of his 70's records looking to get into the later operas, it unlocks the other ones

Foreign Experiences is finally catching up with me as well -- it's much more of a Sam Ashley showcase. It seems to be a re-performance / remix of the original 90's version of the piece, with Sam & Jacqueline Humbert are the only two clear voices, much spacier electronic music by Sam, and completely bizarre fragmented samples of the original chorus creeping around in the mix. And the libretto is basically about Ashley's experience at Mills College in the 70's, so there are tons of familiar little hints if you've been to the campus.

Celestial Excursions had a great libretto but the music threw me a bit, the last two are definitely back on track (though I'd still go through the 70's stuff before going to them)

relilgion-ay

An opera about a community of Mexican Americans who practice their relilgion through the design of elaborately painted low riders.

oh i love that man.

fwiw my favourite of the operas is definitely "Improvement (Don Leaves Linda)" but that could be because the 2-10 minute sections allow for me to spread the listening experience out and to access it more easily, somehow. "eL/Aficionado" is another big favourite from the more recent stuff. i haven't yet been able to penetrate "Celestial Experiences" or "Dust".

In Sarah Mencken, Christ and Beethoven, there were men and women is so unbelievably beautiful.

I know, right?

I've yet to be disappointed by anything I've heard of his.

Very really grand men and women.

Very Titanically.

I listened to the 2nd half of Automatic Writing before bed last night, and brought Private Parts to listen to today. Those two are probably my favorites. SMC&B definitely comes close too--i was so happy the day i found that LP.

Three men have loved her. One a decade, on the average.

I really need to dig up a copy of YMWHWW. I also want to dig up the VHS tapes for Private Parts; I think some distributors still have 'em but I don't exactly have $75 to shell out right now.

they put out 'Private Parts' as a 2 DVD $50 set. if you're looking to spend, my favorite of his videos is 'Atalanta Strategy' though

Matmos is covering 'The Backyard' tonight at the Stone

seriously? damn, i should go to that.

wait, milton p, did you play at the stone LAST night??

nope, didn't play the stone last night

went to see Ashley's solo performance at Issue Project Room on feb 26th. it was an hour long reading of a paper he wrote in the late 70's about his work with involuntary speech that led to the creation of Automatic Writiing, implications, self-doubt, what it taught him about history. His voice was treated with heavy reverb that emphasized two resonant tones in the room, but it always stayed under the point of actual feedback. I hope he publishes that paper, as usual it was filled with incredible one-liners and epiphanies that you often miss while listening because his voice is so hypnotic and disarming, it can be difficult to hold your attention on the meaning, you're too busy listening to the sound

that was my reaction to Matmos' cover of 'The Backyard' as well -- Martin read the text in his own voice instead of attempting any simulation of Ashley's tone, and drew built more of an insistent but mellow rhythm out of that Tabla drum machine (same one they used on the title track of their new album, they're getting their mileage). their version isn't going for the same feeling of layered mystery, but the straightforward delivery of the text shows just how coherent & beautiful the story is, it clarifies things.

new Ashley album performed by another group: http://www.unsounds.com/releases/15uframe.html

& more evidence that Ashley's various lectures collected in one volume -- http://www.zsearch.org/text/ashley/ashley.html

milton, how is that jaqueline humbert record? I think I want to get that.

hey man

I love her voice so much & the idea of Tenney / Lucier / LaBarbara / Ashley all writing cabaret songs for her always sounded great but I still haven't heard it

i finally snagged the vinyl of "Private Parts" in near mint condition for $25 off ebay. postage was pricey (from the US) but it's great to have and i consider it a bargain. The recent remaster does seem to turn down the vocal and turn up the tabla and piano and i prefer the way that one sounds. much as i love Ashley's voice i think it's too loud on the vinyl i just got.

i also got "In Sarah, Mencken..." on vinyl from discogs.

the reading of the first act of the new opera "quicksand" at roulette a couple weeks back was phenomenal. one of the best stories yet. murder, private investigators, hotels.

Can we do a top 5 Ashley LPs survery?

1. Automatic Writing
2. Private Parts
3. In Sarah, Mencken...
4. Yellow Man...
5. Private Parts/Perfect Lives: The Bar ("We can have kids... and they will speak a seamless merger.. of poetry and sound...")

can't do top 5

1. The Wolfman (LP)
2. Automatic Writing
3. In Sara, Mencken, Christ and Beethoven there were men and women
4. Private Parts (The Record)
5. Perfect Lives (Private Parts): The Bar
6. Perfect Lives (Private Parts): Music Word Fire And I Would Do It Again (Coo Coo)
7. Yellow Man With Heart With Wings

& if sides 4 & 6 of Atalanta were one LP instead of a 3 LP set, that one would have to go on as well

1. Private Parts (The Record)
2. Music Word Fire And I Would Do It Again (Coo Coo)
3. Improvement
4. Automatic Writing
5. El/Aficionado

<I>6. Perfect Lives (Private Parts): Music Word Fire And I Would Do It Again (Coo Coo) </I>

^^ the Ashley LP for post-punkers.

Also, I still haven't heard Atalanta!

1. Perfect Lives
2. Improvement
3. Automatic Writing/Yellow Man With Heart With Wings
4. Wolfman/String Quartets
5. Tap Dancing in the Sand (!)

top 5 album titles:

1. Your Money My Life Goodbye
2. Yellow Man With Heart With Wings
3. Perfect Lives
4. String Quartets Describing the Motions of Large Real Bodies
5. In Sara, Mencken, Christ, and Beethoven There Were Men and Women (also probably the real #5 in my list above)

How essential is the Perect Lives DVD set?
I have never seen it.

I've watched it all the way through once, & seen episode 3 & 7 a few times. episode 3 probably the most action packed. it's slow paced & tranced out, very funny. low low low budget, early 80's computer animation & cable access video wipes & effects. bits try your patience and then suddenly completely pay off. relentlessly animated hand gestures that seem to express the exact opposite of what he's actually saying. gold glitter in his hair & smiles at weirdest times. you just kind of have to surrender. they charge a lot for those DVDs so I haven't upgraded from my old VHS dubs, but I hear they did a great job on remastering them.

my favorite 80's video is 'Atalanta Strategy'. that one is the one that really stands up. there's a 'Music Word Fire' video I haven't seen.

ubuweb has all of 'Music With Roots in The Aether' and I watched all 14 hours on Youtube over 7 nights. I can't wait for that to come out (though I shudder to think how much Lovely would charge). The interviews with Lucier & Oliveros are good ones to start with if you're nervous about giving over that much time but I loved all of it.

The DVDs are really nice quality in terms of sound. Nearly identical to a clean VHS image quality though. My only frustration is that I'm not sure this really had to be on two DVDs. It probably all could've fit on one, with Atalanta and Music Word Fire on the other... Sigh.

I think his voice is some secret trigger to my tear ducts. Even buried in effects on Automatic Writing I feel myself welling up inside. This is something I can't help.

it is unreal.

"More like home, etc. etc. very Abstract" just the way his voice tugs at the last syllable of abstract like "abstr-act", just that little hiccough in intonation, kills me everytime.

"More like home, etc. etc. very Abstract"

are you talking about private parts (the record) or perfect lives (the opera) ik,r?

i much prefer (the record) which is my favourite record ever when i'm listening to it.

the record, I've never heard the opera version except snippets of it, and based on them I'm inclined to agree with you. That whole section, though, where he's talking about the room ("a softer bed") is my favourite. I nearly nearly spent about two hundred dollars (I doubt I woulda felt better even after the euro conversion ) on stuff off the Lovely website about an hour ago, but luckily the website freaked out.

i got (the record) on vinyl on ebay for about £12, i think. a bargain!

there was something like the feeling of the idea of silk scarves in the air.
there was a kind of madness to it.

the kind we read about in magazines

ik,r? i sent you a message on facebook

sorry didn't see it, i've replied!

This thread is not as in love with Sarah Mencken Christ and Beethoven as it should be, y'know, very titanically.

I can still (over-)hear him saying "This is. . . sublime. . ."

fourteen dollars and twenty-eight cents is more attractive than fourteen dollars because of the twenty-eight.

ROBERT ASHLEY: Well, the problem in discussing hip-hop with somebody who doesn't like hip-hop is that they don't hear the melodies. There's no difference in the quality of the melody in any good hip-hop record now. There are so many I can't even name them. But there's no difference in the quality of the melody between that song and something like Billie Holiday for instance. It's just that the world has changed, the street language has changed and now you have to tune our ears to be able to hear that the very best hip-hop singers are singing exactly in tune. It might be going a little too fast; the melody might be going a little too fast for you to perceive it as melody, but there's no doubt that there's melody

LOL where's Geir when you need him most?

wow

a tendency toward, MOTION PICTURES

Recent developments: I bought myself the "Perfect Lives" DVD set as a birthday present, loving it. I think I do prefer the LP versions of both The Bar & The Backyard/The Park, but the DVD really is something to see. I think some parts of it make my roommates feel weird or strange. S. is pre-occupied with the hands playing piano, hates the glitter.

Also, I just got Atalanta in the mail today. It's going to take me months to digest.

Great way to treat yrself - well done!

also very excited to realise that the account that published that has many full performances of later operas from the kitchen (Dust, Celestial Excursions) so worth checking for anyone who like me didn't know filmed versions existed.

Yeah, between that (absolutely wonderful) "Improvements" and the previously unreleased realization of "Foreign Experiences" that came out last year, I've been pleasantly surprised at how much I've gotten out of hearing multiple realizations of these pieces.

Looks like there's a new version of "el/Afficionado" coming later this month as well. Never really connected with that one despite the "Eleanor" cycle on the whole being some of my favorite music of any kind, so I'll be especially curious to hear it.

looking at the timing my guess is that the new production of Improvements was intended to inaugurate a celebration of ashley that has been railroaded by the thing that's railroaded everything. excited about these new recordings as i haven't heard Foreign Experiences either.

Oh! "Foreign Experiences" is maybe an acquired taste but it's one of my favorite weird corners of that cycle, absolutely saturated in the 70's west coast milieu of "divorced guys reading Castaneda", which tbf may or may not be something you're up for. Both of the versions available from Lovely are great, but I have a special fondness for the 2006 CD version that's just Sam Ashley and Jackie Humbert bc Sam's delivery is just so relentlessly freaked out and seething, boiling over with bad vibes in a way that ratchets up the psychic claustrophobia of the piece to a paranoid fever dream.

And as for the more recent productions, no idea whether there was any larger plan there but I'm really happy to see that many of the people (e.g. Tom Hamilton) who were involved with his ensemble have taken an active role in ensuring the survival of the work and mentoring another generation of interpreters.

Matmos is covering 'The Backyard' tonight at the Stone

― Milton Parker, Saturday, February 23, 2008 3:41 PM (seventeen years ago) bookmarkflaglink

seriously? damn, i should go to that.

― ian, Saturday, February 23, 2008 4:39 PM (seventeen years ago) bookmarkflaglink

wait, milton p, did you play at the stone LAST night??

― ian, Saturday, February 23, 2008 4:40 PM (seventeen years ago) bookmarkflaglink

nope, didn't play the stone last night

went to see Ashley's solo performance at Issue Project Room on feb 26th. it was an hour long reading of a paper he wrote in the late 70's about his work with involuntary speech that led to the creation of Automatic Writiing, implications, self-doubt, what it taught him about history. His voice was treated with heavy reverb that emphasized two resonant tones in the room, but it always stayed under the point of actual feedback. I hope he publishes that paper, as usual it was filled with incredible one-liners and epiphanies that you often miss while listening because his voice is so hypnotic and disarming, it can be difficult to hold your attention on the meaning, you're too busy listening to the sound

that was my reaction to Matmos' cover of 'The Backyard' as well -- Martin read the text in his own voice instead of attempting any simulation of Ashley's tone, and drew built more of an insistent but mellow rhythm out of that Tabla drum machine (same one they used on the title track of their new album, they're getting their mileage). their version isn't going for the same feeling of layered mystery, but the straightforward delivery of the text shows just how coherent & beautiful the story is, it clarifies things.

new Ashley album performed by another group: http://www.unsounds.com/releases/15uframe.html

& more evidence that Ashley's various lectures collected in one volume -- http://www.zsearch.org/text/ashley/ashley.html

― Milton Parker, Friday, March 7, 2008 3:58 PM (seventeen years ago) bookmarkflaglink

i just ran across this on youtube! not a performance of the Backyard, but Private Parts:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFuBczVTCBw

Several years ago, our aging boston terrier Bella had a heat stroke that left her blind and cognitively impaired. She was like our first kid, it was a huge bummer. When we left the house I felt bad because I wasn’t sure what was going on in her head, if she knew we were gone, if she was lonely, or what. I would always play Private Parts so there would be a voice with her, hoping it made things better somehow. A lot of the time I would just let it play after returning because I like it so much. Bella is no longer with us and Private Parts bums me out too much to play it anymore.