Lester Bangs - Classic or Carburetor Dung?

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i hope so, the bag i have just prepared is v.large

― mark s (mark s), Thursday, 31 July 2003 19:20 (twenty-two years ago)

mark you hurt me in my heart.

― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Thursday, 31 July 2003 19:22 (twenty-two years ago)

Hey Mark S, the 'S' wouldn't stand for 'Dahmer' by any chance?

― mei (mei), Thursday, 31 July 2003 19:24 (twenty-two years ago)

sinker isn't right abt things usually but he is here.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Thursday, 31 July 2003 19:27 (twenty-two years ago)

sinker is usually right abt things but he isn't here.

― amateurist (amateurist), Thursday, 31 July 2003 19:30 (twenty-two years ago)

amt is usually wrong abt things and he is wrong abt this here.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Thursday, 31 July 2003 19:31 (twenty-two years ago)

snap!

― amateurist (amateurist), Thursday, 31 July 2003 19:32 (twenty-two years ago)

julio should go play with mark and his v.big bag of dicks and leave vm circa aw alone or i will cry and then hurt you all

― J (Jay), Thursday, 31 July 2003 19:33 (twenty-two years ago)

crackle! pop!!!

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Thursday, 31 July 2003 19:40 (twenty-two years ago)

i thought we established that "eat a bag of dicks" was a reward not a punishment?

― mark s (mark s), Thursday, 31 July 2003 19:57 (twenty-two years ago)

Mark S? Sutherland?

― David. (Cozen), Thursday, 31 July 2003 19:58 (twenty-two years ago)

we did? i must have missed that.

― J (Jay), Thursday, 31 July 2003 20:04 (twenty-two years ago)

I've read that quote carefully several times and it doesn't make me want to hear Astral Weeks or read more of Lester Bangs.
Put crassly, some old guy liked some other old guy's music. So?
What's it to me?

-- mei (meirion.lewi...), July 31st, 2003.

Then why give a shit about anything?

― David Allen, Friday, 1 August 2003 01:28 (twenty-two years ago)

stupid pointless story: a friend of mine was being bugged by this crazy pseudo-stalker chick last year, and he asked me to do something weird to annoy her. so i IMed her the entirety of lester bangs's "astral weeks" review, with no explanation.

― Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Friday, 1 August 2003 04:21 (twenty-two years ago)

unfortunately she turned out to be a VM fan so it didn't work as well as i'd planned. i followed up with long excerpts from "concrete, so as to self-destruct," and that worked a lot better.

― Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Friday, 1 August 2003 04:22 (twenty-two years ago)

Because he has such an ENGAGING style of writing....Because it's impossible to not relate to him on some level, and want to love it just as much as he does, even if you've never heard it.

-- David Allen (en@senbm), July 30th, 2003.

Many reasons to give a damn, but LB doesn't convince me to.

― mei (mei), Friday, 1 August 2003 06:33 (twenty-two years ago)

er there is more to that piece than just the first paragraph yknow.

― Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Friday, 1 August 2003 06:51 (twenty-two years ago)

No, I didn't know.

― mei (mei), Friday, 1 August 2003 06:52 (twenty-two years ago)

time to go pick up a book then innit?

― Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Friday, 1 August 2003 06:57 (twenty-two years ago)

or: http://www.harbour.sfu.ca/~hayward/van/reviews/astral.html

― Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Friday, 1 August 2003 06:58 (twenty-two years ago)

I like bang's aw piece, but only cuz I know and like his other stuff alot more - it's good to see him get gushy, astral weeks is like his hailey mathers. I like the father (meltzer) and the holy ghost (tosches) alot more than lb, but I still love lb plenty, enough that it pisses me off that jim derogatis his the officially sanctioned keeper of the flame now; bangs cronies should spend alot more time bitching about let it blurt (particularly since it's gonna be the lester bangs bio) than continuing to harp on about griel marcus' agenda pushing in psychotic reactions....

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Friday, 1 August 2003 07:01 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah, it's not really his best, but it's the one that first made me realize how good a writer he was. my favorite's probably "i saw god and/or tangerine dream."

greil marcus's agenda pushing amounted to including two pieces on elvis and nothing on black sabbath. that and calling bangs "the best writer in america." gee, what a rotten guy. let it blurt, meanwhile, includes about a million "wow, what a slob lester was" anecdotes and next to nothing about his actual writing. conclusion: jim derogatis is a twat.

― Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Friday, 1 August 2003 07:16 (twenty-two years ago)

to be fair, lester bangs' elvis obit is probably pretty easily his most quoted piece (I remember seeing jane pauley quote it on something about elvis)

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Friday, 1 August 2003 07:26 (twenty-two years ago)

and I think it's the inclusion of 'the white noise supremacists' that really rankles the ranks

― nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Friday, 1 August 2003 07:27 (twenty-two years ago)

haha justyn i kill you with gun

― mark s (mark s), Friday, 1 August 2003 07:42 (twenty-two years ago)

well I agree with justyn. what's the 'agenda' here? Lester was a good writer (loads of US ILXORS may not agree bcz of the copyists but that's not my problem).

I still kill him with gun tho'.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Friday, 1 August 2003 09:02 (twenty-two years ago)

time to go pick up a book then innit?

I'm not going to read more just to check I'm as uninterested in it as I am in what I've already read.

I _am_ intrigued as to why he's so revered though.

― mei (mei), Friday, 1 August 2003 10:58 (twenty-two years ago)

I'm not going to read more just to check I'm as uninterested in it as I am in what I've already read.

I _am_ intrigued as to why he's so revered though.

Gee, so I guess you just want someone to explain it to you? If you're not interested enough to try and find out for yourself . . .

― J (Jay), Friday, 1 August 2003 11:05 (twenty-two years ago)

You're right in a way, I've read enough of him to know he's not for me, but I still don't know why he's so well liked.

I don't want someone to explian LB to me, but rather why they like him. In fact there are a few good answers like that above, so I think my question's answered.

While we're on the subject can someone explain the appeal of REM or U2?

― mei (mei), Friday, 1 August 2003 11:10 (twenty-two years ago)

three years pass...

Interesting mechanism at work whereby the Count Five were, in part, great precisely because of their inconsequentiality and yet:

"Paul McCartney makes lovely boutique tapes, resolute upon being as inconsequential as the Carpenters...You could hardly call him burnt out--Band on the Run was, in its rather vapid way, a masterful album. Muzak's finest hour. Of course he is about as committed to the notion of subject matter as Hanna-Barbera."

― Tim Ellison, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 17:05 (nineteen years ago)

Lester Bangs was an overrated drug-addled Mark Prindle-wannabe. He wrote maybe three good articles.

― Mr. Snrub, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 17:20 (nineteen years ago)

BUT WHAT ARTICLES THEY WERE

― Edward III, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 17:54 (nineteen years ago)

and I think it's the inclusion of 'the white noise supremacists' that really rankles the ranks

-- nnnh oh oh nnnh nnnh oh (James Blount), Friday, 1 August 2003 07:27

Why did it rankle?

― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 17:56 (nineteen years ago)

all blount's saying is that that article is what people have in mind when they accuse marcus of editing the bangs' collection with an agenda in mind.

― Edward III, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:05 (nineteen years ago)

i.e. if you expected the book to be a representative sample you might come away thinking he engaged politics overtly more often than he did?

― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:07 (nineteen years ago)

or that marcus is more interested in politics, even politics as banal as those in the white noise supremacist piece, than music?

― Tim Ellison, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:11 (nineteen years ago)

sorta, probably closer is that the book is more reflective of marcus' interests than bangs'.

or what tim said.

― Edward III, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:13 (nineteen years ago)

it's not the same anthology of lester's writings that richard meltzer would have put together, let's say that.

― Tim Ellison, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:15 (nineteen years ago)

not that meltzer's book would have been better! in fact, given a whore like the rest, there's perhaps reason to think it might have been worse.

― Tim Ellison, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:19 (nineteen years ago)

With time I've realized I actually like Mainlines, Blood Feasts & Bad Taste better.

― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:20 (nineteen years ago)

"Paul McCartney makes lovely boutique tapes, resolute upon being as inconsequential as the Carpenters...You could hardly call him burnt out--Band on the Run was, in its rather vapid way, a masterful album. Muzak's finest hour. Of course he is about as committed to the notion of subject matter as Hanna-Barbera."

I don't think this is a pan.

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:22 (nineteen years ago)

How can you tell?

― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:23 (nineteen years ago)

If I'm interpreting that piece right, Bangs does put McCartney on top of his list of the four Beatles in terms of descending credibility - meaning, I think, that he was the least offender at the time ('73-ish).

Whether it's an official pan or not, he makes particular criticisms. (Another is "If he was a little more gutsy, he might almost be Elton John." Lester must have written off Ram too easily.)

― Tim Ellison, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:31 (nineteen years ago)

(Because you can't hear "Monkberry Moon Delight" and say that, I don't think.)

― Tim Ellison, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:32 (nineteen years ago)

Or jeez, how about the vocal on "Let Me Roll It," which was on the then-current album?

― Tim Ellison, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:36 (nineteen years ago)

lester bangs is great if only for getting me interested in the stooges, the godz, velvets, tangerine dream and van morrison at the same time when i was 15.

― ian, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:40 (nineteen years ago)

"if only?"

― Tim Ellison, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:41 (nineteen years ago)

How can you tell?

You can't! The ambiguity's the most interesting element.

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:45 (nineteen years ago)

Right, I was being jokey.

― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:50 (nineteen years ago)

lester bangs is great if only for getting me interested in the stooges, the godz, velvets, tangerine dream and van morrison at the same time when i was 15.

-- ian, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:40

Me too! plus Black Oak Arkansas and Sir Lord Baltimore

― Stormy Davis, Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:54 (nineteen years ago)

Skipping 125 messages at this point... Click here if you want to load them all.

it’s more that the person posting thinks they’re posting a challenging opinion, isn’t it? Like, “there, I’ve said it”

― brimstead, Thursday, 19 October 2023 20:53 (two years ago)

re challops

― brimstead, Thursday, 19 October 2023 20:54 (two years ago)

i can't really read lester anymore. he's better when you are young and dumb and reading bukowski or whoever. and he's very dude. i do like that eno thing! but he could be really dense in a cringey way. or it seems like that now. like people have said, he was young when he died. i think i was older than 33 when i STARTED writing rockcrit. i definitely stole from him. couldn't help it really. i grew up with creem. and the voice.
cool thing: i read at nyu at one of those conferences and jim miller was the moderator and after he said to me "i used to edit lester bangs and i know how hard it is to do what you just did." !!!! i thought that was cool. (i didn't have the heart to tell him that it wasn't THAT hard. but i did work the thing i wrote pretty hard.)

― scott seward, Thursday, 19 October 2023 20:57 (two years ago)

And his drug of choice was fuckin' cough syrup, ferchrissakes.

― immodesty blaise (jimbeaux), Thursday, 19 October 2023 20:58 (two years ago)

OG lean addict! he probably would have been a big dj screw fan if he had lived.

― scott seward, Thursday, 19 October 2023 21:03 (two years ago)

I don’t know what it’s particularly a sign of, but someone has to cite or write their own version of the The White Noise Supremacists article every so often. I remember that happening 20 years ago, and recently a guy who was in a popular band at that time wrote his own! Carlos D didn’t even bother to mention Lester despite hitting all the same notes

― ɥɯ ︵ (°□°) (mh), Thursday, 19 October 2023 21:06 (two years ago)

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