This basically boils down to Control vs Rhythm Nation vs The Velvet Rope and the latter seems the height of her creative powers even if Control has the most jams per square inch.
― I would much rather listen to hard bop jazz and stfu (The Reverend), Tuesday, 17 February 2009 03:58 (fifteen years ago) link
Sorry. That sounded corny.
You forgot janet in your analysis, which really marks the beginning of Mach III Jackson.
― The Screaming Lobster of Challops (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 17 February 2009 04:03 (fifteen years ago) link
Yeah, but I don't think it quite congeals the way the others I mentioned do. Obv it is still part of her classic period.
― I would much rather listen to hard bop jazz and stfu (The Reverend), Tuesday, 17 February 2009 04:07 (fifteen years ago) link
20 B.O. congeals, alright.
― The Screaming Lobster of Challops (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 17 February 2009 04:12 (fifteen years ago) link
I avoided that one. (But I do rep for Discipline!)
― I would much rather listen to hard bop jazz and stfu (The Reverend), Tuesday, 17 February 2009 04:13 (fifteen years ago) link
Voted, somewhat to my surprise, for Control, which is harder, colder, and, yeah, warmer than she'd ever be again.
― The Screaming Lobster of Challops (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 17 February 2009 04:15 (fifteen years ago) link
(although love lots of subsequent Janet)
― The Screaming Lobster of Challops (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 17 February 2009 04:16 (fifteen years ago) link
I think the sproingy cowboy noises in "Go Deep" justify my pick. My suspicion has long been that DJ Quik makes some uncredited contributions to that one like J Dilla did on "Got Til It's Gone".
― I would much rather listen to hard bop jazz and stfu (The Reverend), Tuesday, 17 February 2009 04:23 (fifteen years ago) link
Terribly tough choice. Up to a couple years ago, I'd have said Velvet Rope and moved on, but now I'm back in the Control/Rhythm Nation camp. So naturally I'm probably going to vote for janet.
― Nurse Detrius (Eric H.), Tuesday, 17 February 2009 04:36 (fifteen years ago) link
colder, and, yeah, warmer
http://www.cynical-c.com/archives/bloggraphics/Bush%20confused%2021_a.jpg
― Jewish Lager (k3vin k.), Tuesday, 17 February 2009 05:31 (fifteen years ago) link
"Janet Jackson" LOL :)
Just joking. "Rhythm Nation" just ahead of "The Velvet Rope".
― Geir Hongro, Tuesday, 17 February 2009 05:39 (fifteen years ago) link
ooh i think i'm going for the velvet rope here...i might have to relisten to them again though, hurrah. i don't own the first two! should i?
― lex pretend, Tuesday, 17 February 2009 10:16 (fifteen years ago) link
eh, no one else does
― Lots of praying with no breakfast! (HI DERE), Tuesday, 17 February 2009 13:58 (fifteen years ago) link
There were a couple OK 12" remixes that came from those first two albums, but definitely not essential.
― Nurse Detrius (Eric H.), Tuesday, 17 February 2009 14:51 (fifteen years ago) link
if it can make a fan (albeit a closeted one) out of a GnR/Beastie Boys-obsessed 10yo me, it's doing something right. Control.
― now is the time to winterize your manscape (will), Tuesday, 17 February 2009 14:54 (fifteen years ago) link
Automatic thread bump. This poll is closing tomorrow.
― System, Monday, 23 February 2009 00:01 (fifteen years ago) link
Like Madonna's discography, this one is a testament to the ultimate pointlessness of The Album to pop. Not a single one of these sustains its pleasures from start to finish (usually a fault of the ballads). But at their best, they're exhausting affairs like Great Albums often are.
I've never quite felt Control probably because, as Soto states above, it's her warmest album. Warm doesn't work too well on the dancefloor (or from a Jackson) (hell, sometimes even on the radio).
For me, her peaks are Rhythm Nation and janet.. I voted for the former simply because I can listen to it the longest without skipping a song (whoever disfigured the run up through "Black Cat" with the zzz-plus "Livin' in a World (They Didn't Make)" needs to buy me a velvet-covered NEXT button). But the latter contains her two greatest songs, "If" and "Throb."
From there, her albums have gotten steadily worse with The Velvet Rope and All For You (best ballads) still great, a significant drop with Damita Jo, and a nosedive with 20 Y.O., her worst (it wouldn't surprise me to discover that those first two albums, which like most people here I haven't heard, are better). Discipline is a step in the right direction but sadly, not a zeitgeisty one. Is she gone?
― Kevin John Bozelka, Monday, 23 February 2009 14:22 (fifteen years ago) link
"I've never quite felt Control probably because, as Soto states above, it's her warmest album. Warm doesn't work too well on the dancefloor (or from a Jackson) (hell, sometimes even on the radio)."
wrong. warmness = dancefloor = very good combination as thousands of funk, disco and soul records will tell you.
i think shes gone though, yeah. theres always a few keepers on her albums but from velvet rope onwards, theyve started to get smaller (and on the last few albums, mostly been the ballads as the club tracks have been mostly irredeemably awful). janet was good, but even there, you saw how things were going to go downhill (plus the I LOVE SEX angle has really run its course by now).
― Yellow Carded (titchyschneiderMk2), Monday, 23 February 2009 14:28 (fifteen years ago) link
rhythm nation is prob her last 'great' album, in the sense of there being lots and lots of high points but its started her off on the 'i must have tons of skits and at least 20 songs' approach to album making which wasnt a good move. shes making shorter albums now but i think its too late. prob doesnt help that jam and lewis arent what they used to be (or their helpers? arent what they used to be lol)
― Yellow Carded (titchyschneiderMk2), Monday, 23 February 2009 14:30 (fifteen years ago) link
Heh. You're informing the wrong person.
― The Screaming Lobster of Challops (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 23 February 2009 14:34 (fifteen years ago) link
xpost - i meant warmness + dancefloor = v good combo.
but this is also wrong:
"Not a single one of these sustains its pleasures from start to finish (usually a fault of the ballads)."
janet has almost always had some really good ballads. eg - lets wait a while, funny how time flies, any time any place, etc.
― Yellow Carded (titchyschneiderMk2), Monday, 23 February 2009 14:40 (fifteen years ago) link
Warmness + dancefloor CAN work. But I find hot/cold works best.
And I did say "usually a fault of the ballads" and "All For You (best ballads)," e.g. I love "China Love" and, esp., the radiator plitzes of "When We Oooo."
And from "'i must have tons of skits and at least 20 songs'" you seem to agree with me that ""Not a single one of these sustains its pleasures from start to finish."
― Kevin John Bozelka, Monday, 23 February 2009 16:33 (fifteen years ago) link
i do. which is why control is >>>>>
― Yellow Carded (titchyschneiderMk2), Monday, 23 February 2009 16:36 (fifteen years ago) link
Yeah it IS pretty damn consistent. I'll give it that. Just prefer the harder edge of RN.
― Kevin John Bozelka, Monday, 23 February 2009 16:40 (fifteen years ago) link
Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.
― System, Tuesday, 24 February 2009 00:02 (fifteen years ago) link
OF COURSE
― The Screaming Lobster of Challops (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 24 February 2009 00:17 (fifteen years ago) link
I want to Dream Streeter to come forward and testify. Bimble?
― Kevin John Bozelka, Tuesday, 24 February 2009 00:23 (fifteen years ago) link
Probably Surmounter.
― The Screaming Lobster of Challops (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 24 February 2009 00:25 (fifteen years ago) link
lol
― Graduate of the Fantasia Barrino Instatoot of Fine Literature (The Brainwasher), Tuesday, 24 February 2009 00:46 (fifteen years ago) link
um
― Surmounter, Tuesday, 24 February 2009 00:50 (fifteen years ago) link
i didn't see this. i would have voted for Control. for the fuckin record.
― Surmounter, Tuesday, 24 February 2009 00:51 (fifteen years ago) link
the problem with rhythmn nation is that while the point of it is to cram pack the rhythm, in comparison to how clean, polished and efficient Control is, it can come off tinny and overwrought at times
― Surmounter, Tuesday, 24 February 2009 01:00 (fifteen years ago) link
Saw the video for "Rock With U" last night and the dancing blew my mind! Does anyone know who did the choreography? I googled but turned up nothing.
― Kevin John Bozelka, Saturday, 30 May 2009 01:09 (fifteen years ago) link
o ya the choreography is awesome, no idea whose work tho
― sensitive thug hugging epidemic (The Reverend), Saturday, 30 May 2009 01:19 (fifteen years ago) link
i think i prefer Mach III 90s Janet to anything else
― lex pretend, Saturday, 30 May 2009 09:42 (fifteen years ago) link
Control: The Remixes beats all those.
― Ant, Tuesday, 2 June 2009 16:41 (fourteen years ago) link
overhyped
― Surmounter, Tuesday, 2 June 2009 16:52 (fourteen years ago) link
These results are right, though I'd have probably bumped janet 3 votes to tie it in 3rd with Rope.
― nu hollywood (Eric H.), Tuesday, 2 June 2009 16:58 (fourteen years ago) link
In any case:
20 Y.O. 0Damita Jo 0All For You 0Discipline 0
OTM
― nu hollywood (Eric H.), Tuesday, 2 June 2009 16:59 (fourteen years ago) link
Well OTM only in the sense that none of those are her best album. But there are great moments on all of them save for 20 Y.O..
― Kevin John Bozelka, Tuesday, 2 June 2009 18:11 (fourteen years ago) link
But there are great moments on all of them save for 20 Y.O..
― Kevin John Bozelka, Tuesday, June 2, 2009 6:11 PM (18 minutes ago)
― ARE WE SOME FUCKING LADIES OR WHAT? (The Brainwasher), Tuesday, 2 June 2009 18:29 (fourteen years ago) link
Control: The Remixes beats all those
Seconded. I helped with a mix in which "The Pleasure Principle" remix appears prominently:
http://passionweiss.com/2009/06/02/summer-jamz-09-alfred-soto-tal-rosenberg-risottoberg/#more-3800
― Bud Huxtable (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 2 June 2009 18:39 (fourteen years ago) link
Does anyone rate Dream Street? Her debut is totally forgettable, but Dream Street is super unfairly overlooked. Not as great as the albums that immediately followed but it's a really solid and fun '80s pop album.
― Your Ass Is Grass And I Will Mow It With My Face (Old Lunch), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 14:11 (eight years ago) link
On the other hand, I prefer the debut!
― The Silky Veils of Alfred (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Sunday, 23 September 2018 03:11 (five years ago) link
xp LOL’ing at Old Lunch’s display name^^
― growing up in publix (morrisp), Sunday, 23 September 2018 03:56 (five years ago) link
― The Silky Veils of Alfred (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Sunday, 23 September 2018 14:40 (five years ago) link
Man, these results are perfect. The one-two punch of Control and Rhythm Nation might be one of the greatest back-to-back album pairings of all time (as I'm reminded every time I listen to them back-to-back).
― Goody Rickels on the Dime (Old Lunch), Wednesday, 13 March 2019 13:57 (five years ago) link
Whereas janet. is more VG+ and would be so vastly improved with just a little editing. Like it could easily lose maybe a third of its verrrry loooong runtime. Y'know, trim this musical interlude down from 90 seconds to 30, repeat that chorus four times instead of eight or sixteen, stop consistently wearing out the welcome of otherwise solid songs. It's a less sublime package overall (a little too AC MOR at times) but still has very strong moments (there are days when I'm convinced 'If' is the best pop single of the '90s).
― Goody Rickels on the Dime (Old Lunch), Wednesday, 13 March 2019 16:54 (five years ago) link
― Your Ass Is Grass And I Will Mow It With My Face (Old Lunch)
It's a very definite okay, but her debut has some good to excellent Rene & Angela tunes.
― Let's have sensible centrist armageddon (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 13 March 2019 16:56 (five years ago) link
"What'll I Do" pretty clearly marks the line between an album that's maximal but still in control and an album that's gotten out of control.
― zama roma ding dong (Eric H.), Wednesday, 13 March 2019 16:57 (five years ago) link
Tho I like more of the songs that follow than not.
I looooove "This Time."
― Let's have sensible centrist armageddon (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 13 March 2019 17:09 (five years ago) link
and I'd argue she's drunk with abandon
I like 'This Time' a lot. I'm just not sure I needed seven minutes of 'This Time'.
― Goody Rickels on the Dime (Old Lunch), Wednesday, 13 March 2019 17:25 (five years ago) link