Thread for coordinating the order and timing of ILM ballot polls

^ exactly

Yeah, I say include it and get excited about what's going to come second instead.

LBI beat me to it--wanted to advocate for inclusion of "I Feel Love" (which would be high on my own list, though not #1).

There've been lots of polls, music and film, where the #1 looked to be obvious. And most times, that's how it turned out--though not always. I would have bet real money that "Cortez the Killer" would take the Neil Young poll, but it finished second. "I Feel Love" would indeed probably win, but I wouldn't be shocked if "Good Times" or "You Make Me Feel (Mighty Real)" or "Don't Stop 'til You Get Enough" or something else won instead. If it does win, great--as suggested above, the interesting thing then becomes what finishes second. But its absence would be jarringly conspicuous, and what significance would finishing first have anyway in a poll without "I Feel Love"?

xp I don't like the idea of excluding I Feel Love either - sometimes ILM comes up with wild #1s but that only feels meaningful when the game isn't rigged. Just count down from #51 or #101 instead of #50 or #100.

You could give "I Feel Love" slot #0, thereby confusing everyone when it seems, for a few minutes, to have missed the top 100 altogether.

"I Feel Love" won the general 70s poll, and IIRC it was in the top 5 in the top songs of the 20th century poll, so it seems obvious it will win this one too. The only way I can see it not winning if most of the votes come from obscurists, or those who love string disco and hate electronic disco, but this being ILX, I don't think it'll happen.

Anyway, another issue I was thinking of: should remixes count as separate tunes? In the 90s electronic music poll I did count them separately, but since most of the famous disco remixes are, essentially, extended edits, I'm not sure if they should be considered different tunes. OTOH, there are some well-known remixes, like the Patrick Cowley mix of "I Feel Love", or the Larry Levan mix of "Stand on the Word", which change the tune in significant ways.

Maybe limit the main poll to the original tunes, and have a side poll for remixes?

I agree that IFL should be included. Part of the stathead fun is in seeing the points jumps and the margins of victory, etc. One of the big surprises in Zep was that the #1 got almost 50% more points than the #2.

Thanks in advance for running this one, Tuomas.

xp good idea on remixes

In the case of Stand on the Word, the remix is the only one anyone knows iirc? Would be a pity to relegate it to a side poll. Cowley IFL feels like a unique case, I'd happily vote for it over OG IFL in the main poll.

Yeah, I don't think bracketing out "foregone conclusions" is going to be a very popular line. It also puts a big asterisk next to the results, like, anybody coming from outside and reading this goes "man, this is a crazy website, they voted on every disco song ever and I Feel Love didn't even place?!" and then they read all the thread details and they're like, "huh, okay...but what if it had actually gotten #2?" I dunno, it sort of taints the affair. I think it was pretty clear that Miguel was going to stomp the 2012 album poll but it was fun seeing it actually do it. "It wasn't even close!" You can always post the #2 and #1 at the same time if you're really concerned that the thread will just die on the vine in the interim due to the lack of suspense.

(note, all this should be taken with the large grain of salt that is the fact that I don't think I actually know "I Feel Love")

Of course the disco poll will be a forgone conclusion on ilm.

Blue Monday will win by miles.

Tuomas, will you change your DN to Discuomas for the duration of the poll?

Maybe limit the main poll to the original tunes, and have a side poll for remixes?

Nah, that won't work, since many disco remixes (especially those by Tom Moulton and Larry Levan) are better known than the originals.

In the case of Stand on the Word, the remix is the only one anyone knows iirc?

I don't think this is the case... AFAIK, the official releaseof the disco version (apparently there was a straight gospel version released before the disco mix, but I don't think anyone's heard that one) of "Stand on the Word" only has the version produced by Tony Humphries. I'm not even sure where and when the Levan remix was first released, though I guess it's better known than the Humphries mix these days.

• include I Feel Love, there'll be a mutiny if you don't
• count main track & remixes together, imo you have to be a real head to justify distinguishing

Ok, I'd never heard the Humphries version before. I thought I read that the "Larry Levan Remix" wasn't remixed by Larry Levan at all but just got that name because some bootleg reissuer thought it would sell better that way? There must be a DJ History thread or something that clears things up...

There won't be many remixes on my ballot, for the record.

Here we go: http://deephousepage.com/forums/showthread.php?t=169783

Francois Kervorkian's account:

Yvonne Turner is the one who discovered the song while she was working at Downstairs Records, from what I gather.
She managed to get a couple of boxes of the record to sell at the store, sold out immediately and that was it.

The church was kind of unprepared to deal with this 'secular' attention, and adamantly refused any further commercial
exploitation of this recording, for purposes unrelated to its original intent.

The Joubert Singers version is a re-recording done for Profile, featuring the same singers (I think) but done outside of
the church choir. From hearsay, there seems to have been some ill feelings about the song even being re-recorded between
the group responsible for it and the congregation heads, this could all be a rumor and nothing more.

In the meantime, Larry Levan was far too busy inventorying his large collection of flashlight and torches, and
would not have had time to spare to do a remix.

The only reason this was written on the bootleg is to try and drum up some more sales. Same person desperate for
any attention who recently bootlegged my X-Medley and said that it was a present I gave to Larry for his birthday,
(false as well) hoping he could make a few more dollars that way, as it is well-known that birthday bootlegs are
far more valuable than regular ones.

That Humphries mix from 85 is awful compared to the original imo. I'm not really down with the idea of including modern remixes of older tracks - like do Terje re-edits count?

If no one has claimed a Sightings poll, I'd like to

There's a thread devoted "Stand on the Word", I think we can continue the discussion there:

Can we reach a final consensus here? Was "Stand On the Word" by The Joubert Singers or Celestial Choir?

loving Eric H.'s #0 idea tbh

Has the discuo noms thread started, im nomming i feel love

I am against excluding I Feel Love fwiw

disco dilletante that I am I would probably put "Love to Love You Baby" first. or maybe a Charanjit Singh song.

won't be voting for "I Feel Love," feel like it's kind of a rockist 'important' pick, nothing wrong with it but i enjoy lots of other disco songs more. of course it should be eligible, though.

IFL is a great song, an important song and a song I personally find quite enjoyable to hear. Don't think it would even be in my top 10 on a disco ballot, though.

Tuomas, if you want to start the disco eligibility year at 1973, I guess that's cool. The more vexing variable is where you choose to end it. 1980? 1983? The present day?

IFL is a great song, an important song and a song I personally find quite enjoyable to hear. Don't think it would even be in my top 10 on a disco ballot, though.

― Johnny Fever

Same here, it's not even my favourite Donna Summer song (that's Sunset People) I think it should be included. The obvious songs don't always win. Didn't everyone think When Doves Cry, Dancing Queen, Being Boring, Enjoy The Silence, Like a Prayer would all definitely win their polls by quite a long way? God Only Knows which was voted the best song of all time on here but only just beat out Surf's Up in the Beach Boys poll by a few points.

Mainly cos ppl vote tactically, may their tongues flavour senses default to ass of hyena evermore.

No exclusions, no dates, anyone posting sentiments akin to 'i voted for x because i knew everyone else was voting for y' to be permabanned

Excluding I Feel Love is an idiotic idea. We can get excited about the rest of the poll even if the #1's a lock. (If indeed it is)

Well, 'If' is a good question.

Well this is a pickle. The only way I see through is to have two polls, one excluding IFL and the other excluding everything else.

A bit like this pair?

The FAC73 NewOrder Poll (Closing 25-May-2007)

The XFAC73 NewOrder Poll (Closing 25-May-2007)

lol

There is no good reason for excluding it. Artist polls seem to manage fine without leaving out big hits.

Quite.

anyone posting sentiments akin to 'i voted for x because i knew everyone else was voting for y' to be permabanned

otm - death to tactical voting!

If say anything after 1973 is probably technically eligible, even if very few songs after about 1983 probably have a shot.

If I'd

I'd say anything after 1973 is probably technically eligible, even if very few songs after about 1983 probably have a shot.

Yeah, I'm leaning towards this option, I just have to make it clear that genres that were influenced by disco, like house/synth pop/old school rap/new wave, are ineligible. Basically, I think the only disco offshoots that should be eligible are Italo, boogie, and hi-NRG, because they're often indistinguishable from proper disco. How does this sound?

Dance music 1973-83 makes sense to me, though "Soul Makossa" and "Girl You Need a Change of Mind" were released in 1972.

http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6175/6157907671_6d5ec98fe1_z.jpg

Basically, I think the only disco offshoots that should be eligible are Italo, boogie, and hi-NRG, because they're often indistinguishable from proper disco. How does this sound?

That works for me, there is a separate Italo poll scheduled though. I'll probably vote for a lot of Italo in this one but wouldn't mind leaving it out if we're going to get to it later.

I know there's an Italo poll coming, but it was suggested after this one, and I don't think it'd make much sense to have a general disco poll where Italo is disqualified. I mean, you could argue that "I Feel Love" is Italo too! But I think/hope the Italo poll results will highlight more obscure tunes, and there won't be too much overlap with this poll.

Dance music 1973-83 makes sense to me, though "Soul Makossa" and "Girl You Need a Change of Mind" were released in 1972.

Just making it "dance music 1973-83" would mean stuff like electro, synth pop, and funk is in too, and that shouldn't be the case.

I love "Soul Makossa", but I've never understood why it's considered an early disco tune... What common qualities it has with proper disco?

As for the other tunes suggested, yeah, sure you can find proto-disco tunes from before 1973, even from the 1960s, but I think the line should be drawn somewhere, because otherwise you could argue any danceable soul tune with strings is eligible, and I don't want the poll to be dominated by soul.

I don't want the poll to be dominated by soul

Soulful disco is the best, but am hoping this poll highlights the stunning diversity within disco.

Just leave it as 'disco' imo, then let the results be whatever people vote for.

I guess I didn't really mean all dance music, more that between 73 and 83 it might make life easier not having to distinguish between "disco music" and "music played in discos". Drawing a clear line between funk and disco seems difficult though; what about e.g. "Do It ('Til You're Satisfied)"?

Agree that "Soul Makossa" is not obviously in a disco style (though it probably was influential on the style) and I wouldn't vote for it anyway, but it is important in disco history so I thought I'd mention it. "Girl You Need..." might have been my #1 if it counted (though I'm not mad on the lyrics) but it's Tuomas' poll.

What post-83 tracks make the case for inclusion?

On a film forum I sometimes visit they have the rule 'if you vote for it, it's [insert genre]'. The most popular votes will rise to the top anyway, and a lot of the fun is in looking through everyone's ballots afterwards.