or readers will use the quote to condemn Pitchfork.
― the little prince of inane false binary hype (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 17 December 2012 19:54 (eleven years ago) link
'Julia Holter is right, all i ever loved is bullshit'
― Van Horn Street, Monday, 17 December 2012 19:55 (eleven years ago) link
it seems pretty clear she's not making a vague statement about "sucky music that sucks" but a more specific one about technical chops
― lex pretend, Monday, 17 December 2012 19:56 (eleven years ago) link
The issue I have with quotes like this is that it punctures a balloon. At first listen, I feel that Julia is writing "Marienbad" out of a necessity to have this overstuffed, endless parade of ideas. That it's a natural expression, a pursuit of her muse. Then when she's recorded as "throwing shade" at LDR or whatever it loses the impression of being natural and gains instead some music school hangups and/or resentment of things that are, like, totally different
― you, your max is on fire (flamboyant goon tie included), Monday, 17 December 2012 19:58 (eleven years ago) link
it's specifically about people haven't learned to really quite perform yet and been thrown in the spotlight way too fast. it's funny because pitchfork has been accused of mentoring those situations.
― Van Horn Street, Monday, 17 December 2012 19:59 (eleven years ago) link
Anyway she's like new and young and thing, I just thought it was a strange quote to include and gave me the impression that it was deliberately chosen to reframe Julia in a negative light
― you, your max is on fire (flamboyant goon tie included), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:00 (eleven years ago) link
if it was it worked!
― some dude, Monday, 17 December 2012 20:01 (eleven years ago) link
I feel like she was talking about LDR for sure but didn't come right out and say it.
― LIKE If you are against racism (omar little), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:02 (eleven years ago) link
it's not like it's a zero sum game: if there are bands that sing lazy shit into a microphone and put effects on it and people like it, that doesn't mean that other artists who can easily modulate between keys and discuss music theory can't make music. there's room in music for both, and more.
and this is obvious so apologies in advance for mentioning it, but if people like the "lazy" music (i hate myself for adopting that as a description because it's wrong but whatever), why should julia holter or any other trained musician care? it reeks of mid-70s dinosaurs whining about the ramones, and it points to an assumption, even if it's unstated, that more complicated/grounded in theory = better. and also just a kind of jealousy - "some stupid kid in a room with pirated effects modules is landing ahead of me on year end lists, while i, classically trained julia holter, languish in obscurity." well, bullshit, who cares. it's not a zero sum game.
― dexpresso (Z S), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:02 (eleven years ago) link
many xposts
― dexpresso (Z S), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:03 (eleven years ago) link
flopson your post is so bad
― puff puff post (uh oh I'm having a fantasy), Monday, December 17, 2012 2:42 PM (13 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
ftr i like lots of amateur music featuring dispassionate singing, but at the same time it's been a few years now and so much of it that's totally awful. not just on the internet or in the media, where it's easier to avoid, but also at shows. not that the existence of this glut negates any of the good stuff, but it's definitely something you might want to kick away from if you've sat through too many sets. i wouldn't put it in the words "putting your soul into it" but i definitely feel like bands that take their performances to a more potentially embarrassing place feel refreshing rn
― flopson, Monday, 17 December 2012 20:03 (eleven years ago) link
LDR's not the only person she could have had in mind - it wouldn't fit the bedroom thing anyway, it actually feels like she's taking shots more at people like, idk...salem? there's so much music out there which sounds like being in your bedroom alone on the internet at 2am that she could have been talking about any number of artists. good for her tbh
― lex pretend, Monday, 17 December 2012 20:05 (eleven years ago) link
xp @ some dude, no way man I <3 her forever
― you, your max is on fire (flamboyant goon tie included), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:06 (eleven years ago) link
i think you're reading more into the quote zs. or at least, you're reading different things than i am into it. i don't imagine she gives a fuck about people's classical training, i think she means more just, like, actual effort and thought and time put into the music
― flopson, Monday, 17 December 2012 20:06 (eleven years ago) link
also a weird conflation of technical chops with "putting your soul into it."
― congratulations (n/a), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:06 (eleven years ago) link
it's ok to have never performed before. you gotta start somewhere, if anything it's sound discouraging for new artists.
― Van Horn Street, Monday, 17 December 2012 20:06 (eleven years ago) link
There's always that first year of interviews where musicians say the dumbest things, not realizing that "we're the best band in the world!" is a great attitude to have around your bandmates and label and family and your own work ethic but that it just doesn't translate into good press
Anyway that Julia quote felt like that to me,
Also "that first year" is a variable period of time for some people :/
― you, your max is on fire (flamboyant goon tie included), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:08 (eleven years ago) link
I agree with that flopson but my stance on this is that there is no harm in doing anything so let people release as much similar sounding shit as they want and then maybe 20 years down the line there'll be a bunch of disposable bands from ages ago w/ one good idea on their release that can be sampled
― puff puff post (uh oh I'm having a fantasy), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:08 (eleven years ago) link
― you, your max is on fire (flamboyant goon tie included), Monday, December 17, 2012 3:06 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
yeah but the fact that this thread is about her now because of that quote and not in a "you go, girl" way suggests that if it was an attempt to reframe her in a negative light it was successful
― some dude, Monday, 17 December 2012 20:08 (eleven years ago) link
i.e. weird because technical ability and passion/soul are often framed as opposites in the rock/indie world (not saying i agree with this)
― congratulations (n/a), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:09 (eleven years ago) link
fact is like EVERY young musician believes they are going the grain of a music world that has lost its way, which is fine as a motivating force to get stuff done but should really really be kept in check when speaking in public
― some dude, Monday, 17 December 2012 20:10 (eleven years ago) link
please don't dudesplain
― puff puff post (uh oh I'm having a fantasy), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:10 (eleven years ago) link
can this discussion NOT be about pitchfork or julia holter
― dexpresso (Z S), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:11 (eleven years ago) link
lol
― flopson, Monday, 17 December 2012 20:11 (eleven years ago) link
i like to consider those topics "off limits" itt
how is my post 'splaining any more than your last couple posts (xp)
― some dude, Monday, 17 December 2012 20:12 (eleven years ago) link
for the love of god, let's not talk about Pitchfork on the "Pitchfork is dumb" thread
― Jesus, the Total Douchebag (DJP), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:12 (eleven years ago) link
surprised nobody mentionned anthony's 'should animal collective go to jail' quote.
― Van Horn Street, Monday, 17 December 2012 20:12 (eleven years ago) link
ah fuck I was jk u idiot
― puff puff post (uh oh I'm having a fantasy), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:13 (eleven years ago) link
well my feelings weren't hurt before but they definitely are now! :(
― some dude, Monday, 17 December 2012 20:13 (eleven years ago) link
I mean if anything I am holding myself back from making a julia holter pussy tastes like joke
― puff puff post (uh oh I'm having a fantasy), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:14 (eleven years ago) link
and I dont even know who julia holter is
some dude, I guess we're talking about Julia Holter for a moment, but I was making the shaky argument that the JH quote was included deliberately to cast her in a negative light, as opposed to, say, the John Maus one, where it was like "we have passed over all the famously dumb things this man has said to include this innocuous (but still idiomatic) opinion on cannibalism"
Like, "did Pitchfork curated these quotes with an agenda?" of course they did editorially, but it just seemed especially strange
xp "should animal collective go to jail"? really? i missed that one
― you, your max is on fire (flamboyant goon tie included), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:15 (eleven years ago) link
wow pitchfork picked a quote from andrew wk about partying, how profound, how utterly worthy
― some dude, Monday, 17 December 2012 20:16 (eleven years ago) link
Did you hear what Pussy Riot said in the courtroom? "Even though we're behind bars, we're more free than anyone." That's like Benazir Bhutto before she went back to Pakistan to be killed. That's like Oscar Wilde facing the courtroom before he was jailed. To see that courage among women in a white youth movement? That is incredibly powerful. It sets a new bar: How are we going to participate now? Should we all be going to jail? Should Animal Collective go to jail? Should Grizzly Bear go to jail? Should Bon Iver go to jail? Is it time?
- Anthony
― Van Horn Street, Monday, 17 December 2012 20:17 (eleven years ago) link
- Hey Justin, it is time.- Aww ok.
that's kind of amazing
― lex pretend, Monday, 17 December 2012 20:19 (eleven years ago) link
To see that courage among women in a white youth movement?
― puff puff post (uh oh I'm having a fantasy), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:20 (eleven years ago) link
there is some very cruel editing going on with some of these
consider for example the quote from Elite Gymnastics' James Brooks:
I don't know if I could ever write a song for a girl to sing. I hate that paradigm of male producer/songwriter, female frontperson-- I feel like encouraging it reinforces this bullshit that all women are good for is looking pretty out in front.
here is the associated picture:
http://pitchfork-cdn.s3.amazonaws.com/content/b3404d1e.jpg?wmode=transparent
― Jesus, the Total Douchebag (DJP), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:21 (eleven years ago) link
OTOH the Killer Mike quote is amazing
― Jesus, the Total Douchebag (DJP), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:22 (eleven years ago) link
Agreed.
― Van Horn Street, Monday, 17 December 2012 20:23 (eleven years ago) link
lol djp
― flopson, Monday, 17 December 2012 20:25 (eleven years ago) link
i posted on (a different) board with that kid, he's um...very very serious but basically deemed like a decent guy
― Andrew WKRP (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:25 (eleven years ago) link
xp When Antony allows himself some candour he rules the school
re: James, I like his tumblr posts, he actually reminds me of Lex like a lot
― you, your max is on fire (flamboyant goon tie included), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:30 (eleven years ago) link
-_-
― lex pretend, Monday, 17 December 2012 20:32 (eleven years ago) link
jusssst kidddding
― you, your max is on fire (flamboyant goon tie included), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:33 (eleven years ago) link
And she doesn't sound like she's "putting her soul into it," she sounds shy at least on record.
― Evan, Monday, December 17, 2012 1:04 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
I haven't listened so I don't know, but i know you can be shy and put your soul into it.
― Van Horn Street, Monday, December 17, 2012 1:08 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
Late response. I guess it seemed like she was just describing herself, is all. Anyway, carry on.
― Evan, Monday, 17 December 2012 20:46 (eleven years ago) link
Should Animal Collective go to jail? Should Grizzly Bear go to jail? Should Bon Iver go to jail? Is it time?
o_O @ "white youth movement" but this is surely the greatest thing anyone has said in 2012
― she was giving it to two friends ...Aaay! (crüt), Monday, 17 December 2012 20:53 (eleven years ago) link
it's a pretty ufwa statement i gotta say.
― s.clover, Monday, 17 December 2012 22:40 (eleven years ago) link
white youth movement wtf
― Emperor Cos Dashit (Adam Bruneau), Tuesday, 18 December 2012 05:31 (eleven years ago) link