What kind of EOY Metal Poll do you want this year?

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to put it another way--

1. no one else seems to want to run the poll. if anyone did, they likely would have spoken up. this is probably because running the poll sounds like a pain in the ass to most people, whereas you seem to enjoy it.

2. if we take #1 to be true, you can run the poll however you want! there is prob very little you could do that would turn away mass amounts of voters.

3. therefore, asking for the input of the community is a simple act of courtesy. you can choose to take our suggestions (most of which boil down to reducing the number of albums that make the list) or not. a polite, but firm, rejection would tell us all we needed to know.

4. INSTEAD, you get cranky when anyone suggests an alteration and tell them they can run the poll. that's not what anyone was suggesting!

5. if you have a specific way you want to do it, just be honest and say so.

we will abide by the results

i voted because i like voting for things

i find ~500 results to be too much to follow and i don't check in often enough at that point to see if poll is down to a more manageable number, so i'd say for sure no more than 100 results. i think very liberal voting policies are important too (minimum requirements for ballot slots) and also, interesting content during the countdown - ESPECIALLY quotes from ilxors who discussed the album, or submitted comments w/ their ballots.

I ask every year for comments and blurbs but nobody is interested. They prefer to keep those for their dayjob.

but if you want to pay them go ahead :)

at the very least it's not hard to write a sentence, or fragment, about what you like about the album

you can't do blurbs AND do 50+ results rollouts, gotta decide whether to focus on quantity or quality.

I just voted for top 50, mainly because it seems more manageable from my end. I can totally accept the argument that a bigger roll-out can and would open people's eyes to records they may not have discovered, and that's perfectly fine, but as Jeff said it can get intimidating to miss a few. I barely kept up with last year's.

Also, the large roll-outs do tend to lose the element of surprise when you get down to the top 10. If we stuck to, say, a top 50, the last few could really keep people guessing. That's a good thing in my view.

Top 50, then before #1 is revealed, a honorable mention list of the above 50 in no particular order (and no more than another 50)with brief descriptions of who and/or what...

I'm sort of torn here: I got a serious kick out of seeing some of my favorite albums place in the #101-#125 range last year; in a lot of ways that might've been my favorite part of the poll.

And yet I feel like EZ has a point.

I guess my thing is that the more expanded rollout imo worked brilliantly in the 80s poll because that decade had been polled to death, and your approach to it was a genuinely original one to take. It cast the decade in a completely different light and I think in those circumstances, that poll was a good place to introduce people to new records.

But I kind of feel like not every poll has to necessarily function like that. From my limited exposure to it, I don't really feel like the EOY metal poll is the ideal place to introduce new records; I feel like ppl who are looking for 50+ new metal records for this year to listen to have already found that. Which doesn't mean that you can't do a rollout of >50, just that maybe there are other purposes for this rollout to consider that might more ably suit it...

Like besides Fastnbulbous, I don't think a single person paid any attention to the Windhand album because it made #109 in the albums poll last year. My pleasure at seeing it place was purely selfish.

Anyways, I took FnB's cue and voted 100 in the spirit of compromise.

More pressing question for me: will stuff from the spacerock thread qualify?

actually Sean's idea is p great

Of course it is!! xp! lol!

I voted 100 but honestly I don't think their were a 100 hundred good metal albums put out this year (at least I've only listened to about a dozen I've really liked)...

And don't count on me to help with the planning or roll-out. Everytime me or AG get involved the trolls come in and ruin it. I'll participate but I'm preemptively resigning as a poll runner.

(WRT Space Rock -- if it can be described as "heavy psych" then I think it qualifies for sure. If its really just new age w/ guitars -- IMO it fit with the whole family of metal IMO. One exception being a typically metal-oriented artist doing an artsy side-project thing.)

*it DOESN'T fit...

Anyway, I didn't mean to suggest there wasn't a TON of great albums, I just don't know about them yet and I have persnickety tastes about what I like. I think a 100 rollout is long enough, 50 is too short (it will all be just the obvious stuff everyone knows about), and I wouldn't be disappointed by a 100+ as I genuinely enjoy long drawn out rollouts...

As for artist/album discovery, I tend to do this during the nomination phase. I understand a lot of people don't have the time or inclination for that but that's why I feel 100 is a good number and its ok to let the outliers be outliers... do yer due diligence!!

I am also out, this whole thing has turned into no fun to run, last year being particularly bad. This shit is a lot of work and a pain in the ass, and getting sniped at during the rollout for crazy shit like falsifying the results was the final straw for me. I hope somebody else steps up, and I'm sure I will participate, but I've pretty much had it with co-running the thing, sorry AG.

OK

As for jjj's -

and getting sniped at during the rollout for crazy shit like falsifying the results was the final straw for me.

This is what it refers to(not last years eoy poll), and yes jf has apologised many times(which i accepted every time), but he still snipes and you will notice that BILL who started the accusations never did apologise.Although it was really JF who ran with it(keep reading down from the 1st link) esp to this bit YOU TOTALLY MISSED THE ILX HEAVY ROCK/METAL ALBUM POLL COUNTDOWN, SUCKA (CLICK FOR A RECAP) but he doesn't deserve all the blame
YOU TOTALLY MISSED THE ILX HEAVY ROCK/METAL ALBUM POLL COUNTDOWN, SUCKA (CLICK FOR A RECAP)

Now:

jjj and viceroy, I totally understand about it being no fun and why you're resigning. I do not blame you. The same people (johnny fever,bill,ez snappin) troll every year and its quite clear unless they run it or someone else runs it the way they approve of, they will keep doing it or say they wont vote etc etc.
I feel the way we do a larger roll-out (125 last year) means that

A)More albums get "15 mins of fame" and are more likely to get checked out when it places in a countdown (complete with Spotify link) than after the polls done and ballots are published (not everyone even posts theirs!)
Maybe its psychological but seeing an album placed in a countdown means people really will check it out whereas if its missed out , its seen as not being in the list therefore not worth checking out apart from the fewer amount of people who do check out ballots at the end.

B)I feel a longer rollout than 50 encourages more people to vote if they know their more 'obscure' but equally as good albums stand a chance of making the poll.
The reason the metal poll was set up was because metal wasn't getting in the EOY poll and metal fans weren't voting as they felt it was a waste of time voting as they felt there was no chance of getting more than 1 or 2 token crossover p4k approved albums in it.
Then some of the metal fans felt that the more obscure dm/bm wasn't making it so the metal poll rollout was extended . That pleased those voters and they turned out in numbers.
Lots of really good albums were introduced to greater ilx as a result. Would be a real shame if that was lost and people feel its not worth voting as their albums have no chance of making it.

However since Glenn has already said he's not doing it this year and now viceroy/jjj & henry have resigned I think it's a good time for me to resign too and the poll can have a fresh start with a new team behind it. It will stop this nonsense and everyone can start from year zero. Leave all the stupid shit behind.

Plenty of people have an opinion on how it should be run and someone should volunteer to take over.
Last year we had 74 ballots and the year before 80 ballots so people are happy how its run (mostly) if you take that into account .
Seandalai has already said he will set up voting forms and tabulate which is basically most of the hard work. You just need to set the rules, run nomination thread,voting thread then do a rollout or full list in 1 go. Whatever you choose.

Johnny Fever is infact good at running his own polls and I believe he would be a good choice and ez snappin & bill could help him out. (at least that way the poll will run smoothly as they cant snipe at their own poll).

I would like to see them takeover and run it as they wish and I will still vote n stuff (sans sniping) and I wish them every bit of luck with it.
I hope everyone will enjoy it and you all participate in large numbers as before and give us a good poll.

I hope you guys will run the poll, have fun and everyone enjoys it.

JF,EZ & Bill. I hold no grudges against you. I still like you guys, sure we have disagreements but not talking to one another,hassling etc would be stupid and, its not for me, at least. As far as I'm concerned its all done and forgotten.

Just concentrate on the poll and make sure its a good one.

Thanks to all who voted in the past , I hope you discovered lots of good albums and had fun.
On behalf of myself and the others - I hope you all enjoy future polls no matter who runs it.

I miss Twisted Pollstarter.

um

I know I am going to regret adding my two cents here, but why was this thread started if you know how you like to run the poll? Just do it how you like - all this seems to be is a chance for either pre-emptive validation or having a pop at people who have different ideas to you. You seem to be pretty good at running polls, even when people are initially against your ideas, so seriously, just go for it.

EZ & JF came on this thread and said nothing trolly at all, they merely stated their preferences. Do you not see how calling that trolling is ridiculous, when that is what you claim to have started the thread for?

Also: jf has apologised many times(which i accepted every time), but he still snipes... it was really JF who ran with it(keep reading down from the 1st link) esp to this bit - you can't say you accepted the apology if you're still going on about it and using it as a weapon. That's not what accepting an apology is.

Really, already regretting posting here. Shoot me now.

Please don't! I just had a dream!

http://static2.dmcdn.net/static/video/456/794/21497654:jpeg_preview_large.jpg?20120423161811

daer emil.y its not my concern now. We all resigned to let them takeover and run the poll the way they think it should be as they have been harping on about it for every poll.

Please note 2 other people resigned first because of their trolling to which I followed. I note you don't reference them and seem to want to lay it all on me. You may not think they were trolling this time but bear in mind they have been trolling for years and know how to push buttons while appearing reasonable to outsiders. Do you really think the others would resign for nothing? We all resigned over the same thing and the same people who trolled for years. Also it was jjj who first brought up the jf accusing us all of cheating,not me. I just explained it for people who may be unaware of it and might believe the bs about being reasonable.

oh and the poll was because of this . Where it was made clear that everyone should have a say and i shouldn't run it how I want to.

but since this thing is supposed to be for the community and not something that you came up with yourself (like the 70s and 80s polls), I feel like the community does have a say in the rollout – And it seems like the community is saying that they want a smaller list.

― Bound by Habitrails (J3ff T.), Friday, 26 October 2012 18:15 (20 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

AG, neither EZ nor I give approximately ANY fucks about this EOY metal poll. I was responding to comments he made that were pasted over from the rolling metal thread when the topic was brought up there. I thought they were on point and said so. You, my friend, are the one who became a complete drama queen at even the sight of him or I in this thread, regardless of what either of us were actually saying.

As for the kerfuffle on the all-time poll, for which I've apologized about 50 times now, and you say you're past but continue to bring it up every single chance you get, that's your baggage at this point. My conscience is clear.

Also it was jjj who first brought up

anyway you & ez are now free to run the poll the way you want to. Have fun.

Your reading comprehension is for shit.

It's my suspicion that you simply don't want to do the EOY metal poll this year and, instead of making a dignified and well-reasoned exit, you want to pin it on "trolls" who aren't even being anything resembling trolly. Be an adult, AG.

Wow, I just went back and read the dust-up in the all-time poll for the first time since it happened and even then I don't think I come across as a troll. I had clearly been misinformed about whom the voting body was comprised of, and admitted that rather quickly. All this time I'd been remembering myself being a total dickhead, but actually I was just confused as hell.

Nope. I reject any responsibility for any of this.

jf you seem to wilfully ignore the fact the other 2 quit first BECAUSE OF YOU and others trolling the poll EVERY year. But you like to wilfully ignore everything so you can just try and make it all about me.
or

Can someone (non-combatively) explain the fixation on polls in general? Is that really the reason people come to ILX - to vote in polls? It's certainly not why I come here, and I suspect I'm not some weird antisocial outlier in that regard.

they are (used to be at least) fun for the people taking part.

And it leads to people finding out about good music that they didn't know about previously (hence me using longer rollouts).
Others have different reasons for liking polls of course. Some just like the suspense of polls.

Despite your protestations of innocence, JF, you're the biggest troll of metal and rock threads I know. You can deny it, but whatever man... I'm checking out of this thread now before I start getting too many posts flagged.

just for the record no one trolled the 2010 or 2011 metal polls

There's a definite misunderstanding of the definition of "troll" with you guys. Dissention? Maybe. But it's not like I posted 100 goatse pics in any of your threads.

yeah also that

I was reading through Rolling Metal this morning and I feel like EZ at least is getting a bad smear job here. Here are his first four posts* from the exchange (also c&p'd upthread):

Not if you're rolling out 200 albums, but if you want to do 50 or whatever than cool.

― EZ Snappin, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:14 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I'm not rehashing the argument for the umpteenth time. As with your other polls, feel free to do without my input. As poll runner that's your right, and others enjoy so go with my blessing.

― EZ Snappin, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:19 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Yep. Same as I haven't voted in the 70s or 80s polls. I don't enjoy them so don't participate.

― EZ Snappin, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:25 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Yes. I enjoy polls that are as much about what placed as where it placed. I like the suspense; it keeps me engaged where a long rollout doesn't. It's all personal preference.

― EZ Snappin, Friday, 26 October 2012 17:36 (59 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

now true--EZ did say that you were going to do a top 200 out of nowhere, but the pollrunners were arguing as if that was a reasonable expectation (not "top 200 wd be silly", but "what difference does it make?"). But anyways, for the rest of it, he is saying things like feel free to do without my input", "go with my blessing", "it's all personal preference": word usage inidcative not of a troll but of somebody attempting to agree to disagree. I have zero problem with anyone in this thread, and I'm not super familiar with similar problems to execute the metal poll in the prior years, but I'd hate to see EZ go down as the troll who ruined it for everyone this year when I think he really was just amicably saying that he might not vote.

everybody is cool here, I just really want to say a good word for EZ

Likewise. That's the only reason I even posted on this thread in the first place.

I voted for top 50.

can i vote "i dont care as long as im not spammed about it"

Can I vote "I don't give a fuck and can you please stop projecting against some people who might have disagreed with you one time (but can you please not count this disagreement as "trolling" so you don't count me in with them) and if you want to poll the top metal releases of the year just get on with it".

you can't please all the people all the time...

bailing out at the first sign of the slightest criticism is weak sauce.. Bailing cuz suggestions of a different way, also weak sauce. Bailing cuz others bailed, weak sauce. Thinking these guys trolled anything, weak sauce.

You live for the EOY poll, Kerr, Do it. Who gives a flying fuck all what anyone thinks of how its done. If you can't handle any sort of opposition, then you shouldn't be on the innerwebs at all.

too much weak sauce = absolute FAIL!

You pretty much freaked out and failed pretty hard on your response to any and all of this Kerr, Sorry, Bro.

I will volunteer however, fair warning here, as a poll-hater I will auto-delete all ballots unread, on balance I'm probably the wrong guy for the job