Project for an ILM blog/site/publication

just a bit of fun let's be cool

guys, podcasts are where it's at now. hire someone with a stentorian voice to read ilx threads aloud, slap on some commercials for audible.com, boom done.

Ned.

I'd kickstart a decent sum to any pub that I'd want to read, since as of yesterday apparently (almost) none exist. Especially one focusing on conversational crit rather than features journalism as such. But I'm not sure if there's a workable model. There's also a bunch of great stuff on tumblers/lj/etc. but the conversations are too insular (just like much of ILM in the past however many years) for me to follow since I pay less attention than in the old days. I'd be down for a curatorial low-volume blog, longreads-style, maybe, including links to xgau and eddy in their current gigs, etc.

four reviews a day is waaay too much btw. its a firehose. i'd want maybe one or two things to skim a day, at the most.

even like weekly updates w/ 6 articles.

the endless stream of posts on the voice blog under maura even was too much for me.

hire someone with a stentorian voice to read ilx threads aloud, slap on some commercials for audible.com, boom done.

― i've hidden a white teen on Crimedoer Mountain (reddening), Saturday, September 15, 2012 2:34 PM (13 minutes ago)

Ned.

― _Rudipherous_, Saturday, September 15, 2012 2:35 PM (12 minutes ago)

A vision.

Even though I've heard Ned's voice, I still hear his posts in my head in the voice of Arnold Stang. Sorry, man.

get david attenborough to narrate it. "will a WmC get enough zings to survive the cold sandbox winter ahead? in his weakened state he could make a tasty treat for a wild Johnny Fever, tipsy mothra, or crut." etc

if this happens we have to pick the most British title possible to annoy Whiney. I leave this matter in the more capable hands of my chums across the sea

blud sausage

Ok so I figure say 5 good articles a week at 100 a pop (which is low in my opinion, but I know that it's actually probably ok by today's miserable standards) is $500 a week * 50 weeks = 25k for authors plus say 4k for a part-time editor and 1k for overheads gives us 30k/yr for something modest? If we want decent design + photos then there's say another 3k right there? Is this totally off base?

I don't know ad rates or have any other ideas for revenue models (eventual cross-promotional super-obnoxious campaigns, i guess?).

So I could imagine getting funds together to try this, but I have no idea how it could *last*, unless it acquired a fair amount of reputation and readers fairly quickly.

Some ideas in that direction:
I dunno how much one can make from amazon/itunes affiliate sales or if those even really exist anymore, but there's another revenue source?

Even w/o kickstarter one can adopt the model of money for prestige bonus items -- lunch w/ yr. favorite writer or invited to the launch party or like $100 tote bags or comps with exclusive tracks (from, say j0hn D :-) ) or the like. Like PBS or WFMU style.

If somebody really wants to run with it (low-to-nonextant on ILM ties, but polling resources from good writers/editors/musicians who hang out hear plus their contacts and their contacts' contacts) I think it may just work.

seems like a good idea, tbh, even if just for fun

guys, podcasts are where it's at now. hire someone with a stentorian voice to read ilx threads aloud, slap on some commercials for audible.com, boom done.

To expand on this, I'd actually be interested in helping out with some sort of "ILX podcast network" that was similar to the model of the FreakyTrigger podcasts. If Hardwick can go from zero to twenty-one podcasts on the Nerdist network, we could certainly make our own.

one thing i think would be cool is turning the artist track polls into full-on features with blurbs and everything. obviously that would require the consent of all the posters who vote for it to be used for that purpose, and people might hate losing the fun of the rollout threads for the sake of unveiling them in that form, but so many of those lists are great thorough examinations of catalogs that don't necessarily get that kind of respect.

Eh. I don't think it would matter if any material got repurposed from ilm/posted to ilm first (matter vis a vis "spoilers" that is -- using people's stuff requires their consent, obv.). Long rollout threads + the like are worthwhile, but a chore. Having the nice condensed stuff like ILG does with coint and plick (especially w/ added media) is a clear win.

The great thing about ILX is you can have all sorts of stuff on the same thread, but I'd hate to see some it preempted by a site dedicated to Real Writing. Or made too self-conscious by the prospect of being reposted on such a site.

i'm not sure if it's been seriously suggested by anyone else but i definitely wouldn't want ILX posts reposted anywhere else for any purpose, that's a really terrible idea imo. with the list thing i meant just taking the poll results and then writing content to go w/ it.

I was mostly responding to Sterling's don't think it would matter if any material got repurposed from ilm/posted to ilm first (matter vis a vis "spoilers" that is -- using people's stuff requires their consent, obv.) But not meaning it as I Must Protest, just misgivings.

i'm not sure if it's been seriously suggested by anyone else but i definitely wouldn't want ILX posts reposted anywhere else for any purpose,

A short history lesson in previous attempts to do this:
Excelsior the book
When ilx is on the coffee table

And the one time an ILX thread was published (in Da Capo's Best Music Writing of 2002)
The new *Da Capo Best Music Writing 2002* book is out...
NYLPM response: The Strokes Coverage

yeah i was basically referring to people taking chunks of their own posts and wholesale repurposing ideas/phrases for articles, which writers do all the time. there was some concern upthread that ppl would cut down on what they contributed here for some reason or another, or just now the concern that e.g. a more formal presentation of lists would be counter to the rolling announcement threads here. obv just using other people's for anything but excelsioring or the like is a terrible idea.

I like this idea.

I think one way it could actually work as an extension of ILM is if people were specifically prodded to expand on things they've written about fleetingly on ILM which other users would like to see them write more about, or to write about in a more thorough manner. That kind of thing is unlikely to happen on ILM proper b/c most users are too modest to impose themselves on threads in that manner, and there doesn't seem to be any reward for the effort vis a vis the instant gratification of the one line zing. But I know a lot of the time I see posts that seem to hint at a wealth of knowledge and insight, and that i'd love to see expanded.

Not saying this should be what any publication should be, but I'd love to see it form a part of the overall picture.

I primarily lurk, but I would be interested in this.

yeah that sounds good.

But also, it's good just to say what you wanna say even if it's long, even if it's not zing, don't expect standing ovations or any audible response--don't be modest either! Not a trait I associate w ILX so much anyway.

Say it loud and proud on ILX, I mean (and wherever else)

Just to throw something out there, I'd like to see ILM's "Books That Were Left Out Of The 33 1/3 Series." I know a few of us here submitted proposals to Continuum, but there's some long posts on the single-album threads that could make for some good essay-length pieces. Anthologize a couple dozen together and away you go...

I remember one issue of the zine Badaboom Gramophone was themed "Bands Left Out Of The Trouser Press Guide" - and it was a terrific guide!

If anything, the ILM anthology could be organized just like the pre-covers comps.

I still use that Badaboom guide.

The idea of being a literal voice of ILX...intrigues.

^^the secret ingredient to tapping all that sweet amanda palmer goth ca$$$$$h

in all seriousness the podcast idea could go all sorts of places, i think it's a good one. same with elvis' rejected 33.3 idea, i'd read that.

and tim's ideas too - does anybody really hold back that much from ILM as it is? i'd have thought it's more that people are often using it as a diversion from work or whatever; it doesn't mean the ideas being put forth aren't as complex, more that you wouldn't spend as much time teasing them out. some folks might enjoy the chance to do so.

Yeah it's as much that as anything else. I'm certainly not saying that ILM is dumbed down vis a vis "proper" music writing.

The point of my suggestion is more about having people say what they'd like to see others do - the appeal of that for me is that it maintains some of the communal, conversational vibe of ILM despite being for the purpose of eliciting longform pieces.

If it did fall to a podcast type thing, I work in a fancy studio in LDN and could certainly help.

everything I write here is intentionally very very stupid. I have to save my smart stuff for paying gigs

I'd certainly be interested in reading that publication.

But having not gone through this entire thread, I wonder why people are especially invested in this now and not, say, back in 2004-06. What's different now?

village voice media

does anybody really hold back that much from ILM as it is? i'd have thought it's more that people are often using it as a diversion from work or whatever; it doesn't mean the ideas being put forth aren't as complex, more that you wouldn't spend as much time teasing them out. some folks might enjoy the chance to do so.

This is basically how I feel about this idea. I think starting from that point makes total sense.

I keep thinking about this idea, don't know why. I think podcast is the most interesting idea - I don't personally listen to podcasts more than once in a blue moon unless they're all-music (RA & Ultima Thule), but a lot of people do, so I assume that it's possible for there to be some income of some sort from a podcast. OTOH for anybody to give a shit about your podcast you need to have on-mic charisma & the time & will to put together a decent-sounding, well-produced (edited) presentation. But with hurdles accounted for - not just presentations but really good ones, rigorous adherence weekly or maybe bi-monthly presentation - I think something pretty cool is possible.

A website, on the other hand, seems likely to go the way of lots of other well-intentioned music websites - if you don't keep relentlessly current, i.e put in actual labor-hours daily, your website will not get a lot of traffic. Certainly not enough to be paying anybody.

Have we discussed an app yet? This also could be a big moneymaker, I propose the app OTM which OTMs you sporadically throughout the day via your iPhone. Presently developing a similar top-secret app under the code name XL-C-OR, mum's the word on that one

it would be cool to have people submitting spoken comments on music or doing creative takes on records in that way.

Datamining for Insight -- not to be confused with Bowling for Dollars -- is fairly trendy (c.f. sabermetrics and Nate Silver). I could see some interesting stuff coming out of examinations of the artist poll results numbers.

I had a podcast idea a while back to do 'album commentary tracks' -- basically have a couple critics listen to and discuss an LP in real time, and you can either play the album simultaneously Rifftrax-style or listen to the podcast by itself -- that I almost started doing earlier this year but put the idea on ice for the time being. Would be happy to offer up that concept if people like it.

I actually really like the idea of an app. There's a lot of different possibilities for what form it could take.

Datamining for Insight -- not to be confused with Bowling for Dollars -- is fairly trendy (c.f. sabermetrics and Nate Silver). I could see some interesting stuff coming out of examinations of the artist poll results numbers.

God, if he was a regular commenter here -- which he isn't, more's the pity -- Chris Molanphy would have a field day.

This is all nice and idealistic and cooperative and so on and so forth, but who's going to actually drive this forward? Because in my experience, which is not vast, getting something like this from idea to implementation is very, very fucking difficult, and needs at least one, if not two or three, people to really motivate and push things forward. One or more of those people will probably need to work pretty much full time initially, and that's very difficult to reconcile with day jobs, other interests, families, etc etc. anyone can set-up a blog at th drop of a hat, but design, content, scheduling, logistics, etc etc is bloody difficult.

This is all nice and idealistic and cooperative and so on and so forth, but who's going to actually drive this forward?

ha, yes, well

http://deadhomersociety.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/thetelltalehead11.png

Datamining for Insight -- not to be confused with Bowling for Dollars -- is fairly trendy (c.f. sabermetrics and Nate Silver). I could see some interesting stuff coming out of examinations of the artist poll results numbers.

God, if he was a regular commenter here -- which he isn't, more's the pity -- Chris Molanphy would have a field day.

― Ned Raggett, Sunday, September 16, 2012 9:11 AM (22 minutes ago) Bookmark

i should mention, Chris and I have enjoyed the chart columns Maura had us doing for the Voice (and before that Idolator) so much that we've been discussing trying to figure out a way to continue that work somewhere else, so I would definitely make an effort to rope him into that stuff. Glenn McDonald would probably be able to do great stuff w/ stats too*

* which once again raises the question of whether VV is still going to do Pazz & Jop this year and/or if another 'Jackin' Pop' type alternative should be organized

i think there is a lot of potential in this idea. and i also think that if there is logic, discipline and structure at play, the combined energies of different writers here could amount to something that would truly stand apart in the digital world.

personally, i'll only contribute to ILM these days when something occurs to me on the spot. if the moment lapses, i'll move on. i'll very rarely stew over an idea, linger at the keyboard or mentally prepare what i'm going to write on here. so a lot of the things i come up with are kind of cursory, impulsive and well... half-formed. if i take an afternoon to really collect my thoughts for a more organised piece, i like to think the result is different. that said, i spend a great deal of time reading the insights of others and often marvel at how quickly a lot of writers here are able to develop and expand their thoughts in complex, insightful and wholly original ways. as others have already mentioned, i'd love to see some of these thoughts given even greater consideration in a different format.

as for Sick's "who's going to do the work" question -- at the moment i've got a job with weird hours that leaves me with a good amount of free time during the week to stay at home and write, so if there was a need for people who can put the time in to edit or organize or whatever, i'd probably offer my time