amanda palmer's open poem to jonathan chait (and other crimes)

shit i said shit a lot

Sic

Skots basically right, I was trolling & being serious or at least trying to seriously break down his claim that all the money was filtered back into improving the quality of what was given back to the fans....I know geeta said I was trolling on twitter too....which like I said I was to a degree

But anyway this all took place in like 10 minutes so sorry it wasn't an atlantic piece or nabisco quality otm but I stand by my attempt to break down the math of how much even the most ”deluxe” packaging & posters cost to make....gaimen was the one who denied that they were making money on it not me

Also frankly he engaged with me with a pretty imperious, dismissive tone so sorry if the goth millionaires line wasn't helping foster a dialogue but I would note he never seriously addressed any of my points

Basically if they claim that the enterprise of doing this live recording & pressing a few thousand fancy posters & triple cds cost 137k they are full of shit, not me

Artists of the right to be full of shit.

frankly he engaged with me with a pretty imperious, dismissive tone

dude you opened with "ima stranger: ugh could you guys abuse kickstarter any more," when it's the only kickstarter he's ever done and it was more than a year ago!; it was exceedingly polite of him to reply at all

It seems he's saying they spent more on the posters and CDs than they would have if the orders had come in lower, not that all of the money went on fancier printing. And wtf big fucking deal if they made more money than they expected to! how many bands go "whoops our bad" if they sell five times more records than they anticipated and refuse to fill the orders because it means they'd get more money?

it might be gross to offer "special hugs" for $2500 or whatever it was, but that doesn't mean ppl paying $1 for a download or $25 for a quadruple CD are getting rorted as long as they get their product. and no-one on any side of the hugs transaction can be under any delusions about the labour and manufacturing costs involved

it was exceedingly polite of him to reply at all

i know, what a guy

Thrill of my life

Anyway I'm banning myself from twitter for awhile because arguing with a famous person is just a bad look and twitter arguments are pointless basically

uh oh really?

Just get in an argument with me, u.m.s.; I'll make you look good.

"Minneapolis and St. Paul are just the same thing, right?"

Lol, a huge loss to the twittersphere!

Watch it ned! I'll banish u to columbia heights

Albini, Palmer, Lowery, Lefsetz, or an NPR intern
The Traveling Wilburys 2.0

― Ned Raggett, Thursday, September 13, 2012 6:00 PM (3 days ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

actual death upon reading this just now

she talks about the suicide faking thing here about halfway through

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h57XWrFNGs8&feature=youtu.be

she actually says "i think its a really cool like art idea, but someone else might come along and say that's fucked up"

and he committed suicide 6 months later, not 2 years later

"he loved it!"

Maybe it's not a good idea to hold up Emily the npr intern as a kindred spirit.

http://i831.photobucket.com/albums/zz233/8ftmusic/afp/blog/20120916/05.jpg

if anybody understands my philosophy and the complicated collision of art, commerce and asking for help…it’s the folks at National Public Radio.

no doubt about it: my band has hit a DEEP, PAINFUL cultural nerve.

I realize I'll never experience misogynist bile, so my opinion is obviously blinkered. I can imagine if one is getting "stupid whore slut" comments, you'd want to call out that you're getting that kind of hate. But I can't help but wonder if, when faced with a spectrum of critical voices, some choose to ONLY acknowledge the one that says "stupid whore slut" because it makes it easier to dismiss those criticizing them.

Sigh.

yeah I'm sighing too. Sighing because "it's obvious I've hit a nerve" in reaction to people criticizing you is one of the lamest fucking things a person can say. "I shat on your french toast and you got really mad! I must have really touched a nerve!"

I think the worst thing I've said about Amanda Palmer is that she seems to be incredibly terrible at managing money

I'd say she's very good at it, actually

You know, if Palmer just admitted she's happy to profit from her work, and is grateful that fans give her the opportunity, it would be bullshit if she continued to get grief. She'd be no fucking worse than Kiss or 90% of rock bands. But if she continues to make the case that she's being really admirable and valiant here and blazing new pathways for ART, she basically is feeding the trolls.

Let's save judgment on that until we've seen her house and her pension fund.

She's great at managing others to give her money, not so good with it once it's hers.

"i talked with emily white over our beer about how she felt, being the living symbol in a giant cultural battle. as you would expect, it sucks the life out of you a little."

I can't believe that I feel twinges of remorse whenever I eat a few French fries, meanwhile this woman has the entire world screaming "PAY YOUR MUSICIANS PLEASE" at her and she can't muster up even an iota of self-doubt re: this issue

french fries, owen?

Freedom fries.

I'd say she's very good at it, actually

lol touche

Yeah, French fries. I'm not a kid, I don't eat that stuff. (Except when somebody accidentally orders them for me then I'll eat all of them.)

Albini again:

http://www.thestoolpigeon.co.uk/features/interview-steve-albini.html

I wonder if Palmer will eventually go full Rob Liefeld and sign another major label contract

I don't understand the french fry remorse. Or the "kid" thing.

even neil, my husband who has NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS, has been fielding hate and anger from people who just see him as a fun target because he’s high-profile.

M@tt you hurt the Sandman's feelings!

I'm starting to think a world where grown-ups don't eat french-fries is a world where I don't want to pay musicians.

That is a very strange bit of lateral logic!

even neil, my husband who has NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS

He was involved with her other kickstarter, so this strikes me as more than a little disingenuous.

what albini said, yes.

If french fries are off the table, so is equitable compensation.

I have a compromise; all musicians will be paid in french fries

Ah, well, aside from French fries and soda being like the worst shit you can put in your body, I suffer from acid reflux and can't eat them. You can pay me in hummus

we will mash up your french fries and you can do what you will with the resulting paste

did she really compare the way she's attempting to fund her artistic work to NPR's model? I don't think we even need to break that one down.

http://chandler.concreterepairman.com/wp-content/uploads/wpbdm/1302354389_0.jpg

I thought you might want a bigger shovel, Amanda.

He was involved with her other kickstarter, so this strikes me as more than a little disingenuous.

that kickstarter has nothing to do with this tour though - it's like attacking her for shows on the Moth tour he's doing right now being sold out

albini otm, especially about the barely-literate nature of the bloggity-blog echo chamber. makes me want to go see him on the Australian tour I just learned about from his replies.

fwiw I don't think that anyone is getting super-rich from this, and if she wants to create content and sell stuff this way, that's cool. For all I know, the album this kickstarter is for might be something I'd be into, but what I do know is how to recognize when someone is flailing around trying to justify actions they may not know their own reasons for taking.

fwiw I don't know why she didn't just say something like "I didn't think it was a good use of resources to take several musicians on tour when they only play for two songs in my set," but again, I'm not her.