Is SPIN really circling the drain?

http://www.slate.com/blogs/browbeat/2012/08/24/spin_accuses_lupe_fiasco_of_mansplaining_with_bad_bitch_.html

think i'd quite like the awful 'rap in stuffy white person language' meme if that stuffy white person was derrida.

where's steve allen when you need him?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zlzP-zPvtgo

that is not ned raggett by the way.

http://theworldsbestever.s3.amazonaws.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/humpty-hump-head.jpg

thank you for ruining the internet

all PR is good PR. good for lupe and good for spin.

― scott seward, Friday, August 24, 2012 12:57 PM (3 hours ago) Bookmark

lol i really hope whiney tells us how much website traffic has jumped as a result of this "boycott"

maybe he meant the pimp c-quoting line about 'ain't a bitch in a sense of having a pussy.' i wouldn't call it 'sensitively' but you could stretch that to being a deconstruction

― The rain in Spin circles mainly on the mansplain (D-40), Friday, August 24, 2012 3:42 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark

this is a cheap gotcha but seriously how can you not know which member of the group said that line

lol i really hope whiney tells us how much website traffic has jumped as a result of this "boycott"

― some dude, Friday, August 24, 2012 4:59 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

The Lupe story is not even one of our two biggest traffic getters today, so....

damn boycott is working, better apologize to lupe

is it the third biggest

Ah, the Internet.

switching gears, the new issue looks fantastic as ever

i didn't get to read much cuz i was just waiting to get a haircut, but dang

#1 traffic getter on Spin today is The Academy in Peril: Deconstruction After Barbara Johnson by Brandon de Soderman

Lol. To be fair I do believe that exposing the problems inherent in relying on the bitch/lady dichotomy - with "woman" stuck in the middle as an underused supplement - is a good starting point for a "proper" deconstruction of a well-intentioned fail. I'd still try to avoid that word though.

that is not ned raggett by the way.

The things I miss.

longneck

looool oops yah thats a bun lyric obv many xps

https://twitter.com/LupeFiasco/status/239177260299587584

hes still goin at it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1-xGuEkdLw

https://twitter.com/NewBlackMan/status/239197831989190656

i think you should think about this from other angles tho j0 ...

lupe's song being muddled doesn't justify a hatchet criticism

hatchet JOB

https://twitter.com/therealbakari/status/239180828192681984

rofl @ the one response to that tweet

anyway i don't think brandon's article does either of those two things

it more sees men policing the identities of women as problematic... and while brandon is sort of playing that same game by taking lupe to task it doesn't invalidate the critique

if mark anthony neal & bakari kitwana ever say a piece of yours is 'culturally arrogant' i would probably take a step back & think about your approach, is all i'm saying

they have plenty of room for critique of lupe too in their tls, fwiw

if mark anthony neal & bakari kitwana ever say a piece of yours is 'culturally arrogant' i would probably take a step back & think about your approach, is all i'm saying

― The rain in Spin circles mainly on the mansplain (D-40), Saturday, August 25, 2012 12:10 AM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark

well sure -- brandon's writing is ALWAYS arrogant tho

my guess is that brandon has probably been reminded that when he writes something like this in the future he will have to choose his words/points very, very carefully -- not that he didn't do that w/ this, but since he expressed being taken aback by the response i'm sure there's a few things he would choose to re-word if he could

the part about "females" not wanting to be called ladies was a pretty big facepalm.

not as much as that dumbass song though

the part about "females" not wanting to be called ladies was a pretty big facepalm.

― wk, Saturday, August 25, 2012 12:28 AM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark

nah i think that's one of the more facepalm parts of the song

deej and bakari otm. however confused the song and valid brandon's points may be, the piece seems to reflect an obliviously overentitled sort of cultural arrogance. like, "here lupe, lemme tell you how to talk about your own culture cuz you're doing it all wrong. you're totally welcome."

it's weird, and i suspect that if people here were A) less down on the lupe track and B) less in sympathy with brandon's points, he would have been called out quite harshly for whatever it is that made him think this was something he needed to pontificate on. it's equally arrogant whether or not you think he's right.

i mean, i guess i should say "it seems equally entitled whether or not you think he's right," cuz i'm not sure i fully trust my read on this. there may be angles i'm missing. there often are...

what's not a good look: a clusterfuck consisting of a song by a man called out by another man with supporting viewpoints from other men when the subject is women

are the women who've called out the lupe song being "culturally arrogant" too? smh

are the women who've called out the lupe song being "culturally arrogant" too? smh

hell no! of course not. (or rather, that's not really mine to say...)

the subject of the song isn't limited simply to "women", though. we could also say that the subject is language and culture, and race is unavoidably a part of that.

i'm not saying anything about what a woman should or shouldn't do, say or think. as a white man, i'm talking only about my own, personal sense of appropriate boundaries where discussions of certain issues are concerned. for instance, as a white guy, i think it's generally best not instruct women and nonwhite people on the "proper attitude" to take regarding gender and race. i've crossed that line before, and regret it terribly.

the fact that any conversation about this particular song will necessarily hinge on both gender and race makes it something of a minefield, and for that reason, i would hope that any white male pundit tempted to weigh in on it would approach carefully and respectfully.

again, maybe i'm out of line in saying that, or just being a dork, or i don't know what. these aren't easy things to talk about.

They're pretty difficult things to talk about, yeah. But the moment this becomes about whether white writers have the right to criticize hip hop because ultimately they're outsiders to "the culture" I believe we're on dangerous ground. Not that white writers don't have to think carefully about how they go about such things, but there's a line there I think. And when that particular argument is being made, we're all in trouble.

what's not a good look: a clusterfuck consisting of a song by a man called out by another man with supporting viewpoints from other men when the subject is women

― lex pretend, Saturday, August 25, 2012 3:53 AM (3 hours ago) Bookmark

aren't you part of the problem by jumping in?

jumping in by posting a substantive dissection of the song written by a woman? o_0

eh i didn't know the gender of the person who wrote the thing you linked

maybe you should stand outside and sign more women up for ilx? "hello, madam, i iz teh lex, may i interest you in a lupe fiasco spin magazine rock crit bitch beef?" people just talking in here. you have every right to picket though. don't get me wrong. just don't disrupt traffic if you don't have a marching permit.

x-post

anyone with half a functioning brain should feel great about calling out this song.

i was referring more to deej posting links to dudes tweeting rather than this actual conversation but yknow feel free to continue dismissing the idea that it's one that shouldn't be men-only

oh okay see i totally didn't get that! thank you for clarifying. thought you were just talking about everyone here. i competely ignore tweet links.

'deconstruction' in the derridean sense is an ongoing process always already at the heart of all systems; jay-z cant 'deconstruct' the word bitch; he can reveal the tensions and instabilities w/in rap's construction of gender; not sure its fair to say thats what hes doing; possibly preferable synonyms might be 'unpack' or 'interrogate' or even just 'explore'

anyway i thought 1 of the kind of weird things abt soderberg's piece is that it wouldve taken him like 10 minutes to call up a couple gender studies/af-am studies/academic rap experts to make his point or similar points for him, probably better and more articulately, or maybe more crucially to help him hone his 'attack' such as it is, and help stave of criticisms of cultural arrogance or whatever.