7 years of prison for pussy riot?

how's life, you're surely joking?

my understanding is that, for the members of Pussy Riot, bringing up children in a Russia without protest means that those kids will never have a good life.

So, "let the wookie win" then? xp

Cis OTM. I imagine that having kids is one of those things that changes your priorities so sharply that there are things one is no longer prepared to put up with and shut up about.

once you are a mom you should never leave the house

it's far too early to say that their actions haven't changed anything

xp: I'm a dad and I'd walk a mile to stay out of the way of a protest.

zappi, I'm sure the kids will take great solace in that.

maybe they will in the future? who knows.

oh my god plz don't let this thread get fucked by this 2nd rate troll bullshit

criticizing their parenting nagl bro

WCC OTM imho

I somehow doubt they consider that shutting up and letting their kids grow up in Putin's Russia would have been a bed of roses y'know.

xxxp not trolling in the least!

yeah, i'm not gonna criticize parents for protesting politically. especially when the form of their protest was so mild. the sentence is the only stupidity that deserves criticizm here.

how's life, teaching your children to cower before injustice because you fear for your security is kind of a terrible look too, imo

Sorry to bring up Mr Y again today, but he had a very good quote - that he actually *started* his activism after he became a parent. Because he said that there was no way that he could look into his kids' eyes and say "sorry, kids, I didn't even try to do anything about this fucked up shit." You're not just trying to save your own skin any more, but also worrying about what kind of future you will be leaving for your offspring.

xxxp not trolling in the least!

― how's life, Friday, August 17, 2012 8:38 AM (9 seconds ago)

no matter what the cause, a fair number of those who protest are likely to be parents. they're not stupid. they're people making a difficult moral choice.

like I hope aero jr. doesn't end up saying "my dad always taught me, keep your fucking mouth shut, don't make waves, wouldn't wanna get in trouble"

if no one in history who had family responsibilities had ever put their own wellbeing at risk for what they saw as a greater cause, then

remix:

It was really, really dumb for the russian authorities to do this considering that a couple of them have kids.

Cheers.

if you believe that political engagement and the belief in justice is an essential part of being a human being then maybe you would be modelling that for your children. if you don't, i guess you don't have to.

xps: I'm not saying you should "cower before injustice", but I am saying that protests are extremely high-risk compared to their benefits. There's gotta be an opposition party or something in Russia, right?

um

you do not know whether or not there is an opposition party in Russia but you are very confident in asserting the effect that protest will or will not have there?

Oh for fuck's sake

(xpost to everything how's life has said)

playing the political game perhaaaps doesn't really work when those in charge don't follow the rules.

e.g. when they imprison you for two years for being a bit rude.

I am saying that protests are extremely high-risk compared to their benefits.

tell that to MLK, ghandi, the arab spring, etc...

There's gotta be an opposition party or something in Russia, right?

genuine lol here, well done!

I don't wanna teach my kids to do a cost v benefits analysis before exercising their inherent right to self-expression, either. you set a good example for your children if you live your most deeply-held values imo

maybe the suffragists should have just joined the opposition party instead of protesting to demand that they... get the vote...

things how's life assumes about Russia:

- there is an "opposition party"
- most people are atheists
- protestors don't consider the welfare of their children

in russia party opposes u iirc

Any government with a thoroughly corrupt legal system like Russia's, twisted by influence and a micro-managing neo authoritarian ruler who would orchestrate a verdict like this against non-violent protestors would have cracked down on anyone who did not toe the party line exactly eventually, moms or no. That's what Russia was like for several decades, for those too young to remember, and what Russian under Putin as been wobbling toward once again in recent years. At least these women went down fighting.

in russia party opposes u iirc

well played

(xp) it's probably how the States will go if the Romney/Ryan ticket wins in November.

none of the 40 reports ive heard have defined hooliganism under russian law (maybe cause it didnt really matter for pr).

good analysis marcello

maybe the suffragists should have just joined the opposition party instead of protesting to demand that they... get the vote...

in fairness this is basically the line the Democratic party here uses about protest: do it the effective way! Vote Democrat!

Def some of those revolutionary war bros had kids, that whole "taking on the British" thing was a bit risky

(xp) it's probably how the States will go if the Romney/Ryan ticket wins in November.

― Here he is with the classic "Poème Électronique." Good track (Marcello Carlin)

a new challenger has appeared

Maybe Putin is counting on this story to not make waves in the U.S. because the media here won't want to expose the citizens to the word"pussy"

http://www.tnr.com/article/magazine/politics/105735/maria-baronova-anti-putin-activist

Shaken, Baronova wanted to leave the country, but her ex-husband wouldn’t let her emigrate with their son. So she went to the office of Solidarity, an opposition organization, and volunteered to help them—and later Ponomarev—with public relations. She also poured the money she’d saved for her son’s education abroad into the opposition’s activities. “I see this as a cold civil war,” she explains. “The state is using all its resources to fight its own citizens, so we have to use of all of ours.”

Maybe Putin is counting on this story to not make waves in the U.S. because the media here won't want to expose the citizens to the word"pussy"

so many classic ellipsis-edits possible here

There's no point in putting them in jail - if there IS a god and (s)he's offended by what they've done, they'll be punished when their time comes. So there.

i'm sure how's life tuts just as loudly every time a father is clapped in gaol for protest

well of course he does! because he himself is a dad, to a child, who he has, sometimes he talks about it on here iirc

that was unnecessary. sorry to how's life.

anyway, this is really shitty.

There's gotta be an opposition party or something in Russia, right?

The biggest opposition party in Russia, and traditionally the strongest threat to the dominance of United Russia, is the Communists. Russia's problem isn't specifically a lack of opposition parties, it's the lack of a civil society that can actually support and nurture effective grass roots political movements. The whole political system is broken - to the point at which Putin is arguably the least offensive option for voters much of the time. Russia doesn't need more people joining traditional parties - the traditional parties are terrible, it needs more people willing to step aside from mainstream politics and challenge the assumptions of authority via other means, which is what Pussy Riot were doing.

There's a case for saying that staging the protest in a church was a miscalculation, not least because they'd probably not be in jail now had they done it somewhere else, but that was presumably a calculated risk they were willing to run.

No, that's okay Matt. And I don't want to detract from how shitty and unfair this verdict it, either!

I sort of want to apologize to people because I've been doing some reading up on Russia and I guess things are a lot worse than I actually thought over there. However, I still couldn't tell you what singing songs in churches is going to do to change those conditions.

xp

hopefully to demonstrate that the 'natural' and 'unshakeable' and media-determined hand-in-glove relationship between the (orthodox) church and (putinist) state can be cracked apart, just by a prank.