Bolt the door, Varg is loose!

How many is not relevant

99.9999% of people you see when wearing a burzum shirt will have no idea who they are, neither will they care.

Several people have said that in this thread... Really? The idea that people would buy a shirt with a word on it and not know what the word meant is very odd to me.

People do things all the time that they don't understand because it's cool on the surface. Same with Burzum ... underground music with a touch of Charles Manson and outsider art. I can understand why art school types would like it, Burzum might just be this decade's Joy Division t-shirt.

If you can't see how the possibility of giving someone the implicit message that you are cool with racism &nazism should outweigh your own ”need” to wear a burzum shirt, and you're older than like 16, I don't know what to say

99.9999% of people you see when wearing a burzum shirt will have no idea who they are, neither will they care.

― Blue Collar Retail Assistant (Dwight Yorke), Thursday, August 16, 2012 10:31 AM (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Several people have said that in this thread... Really? The idea that people would buy a shirt with a word on it and not know what the word meant is very odd to me.

― Clarke B., Thursday, August 16, 2012 10:33 AM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark

pretty sure he meant most of the people that SEE a burzum shirt know who the band is, not most of the people who WEAR a burzum shirt. i'm still kind of puzzled by aero's implication that most of the people who wear burzum shirts haven't listened to burzum albums, which if true is bizarre.

0 - knows no Burzum
1 - "somebody in the NBM scene is a murderer"
2 - has listened to Jesu Dod on Youtube
3 - owns and wears a Burzum t-shirt
4 - can spell Count Grishnackh without checking
5 - Filosofem on the Winamp
6 - owns all albums, has met Necrobutcher but had the decency not to ask
7 - "I will subscribe to your newsletter"
8 - ???

profit, i think

x-post to some dude:

Ah, you're right; I didn't notice the "when" in "see when wearing"... That's kind of an interesting point, actually. I would guess that people tend to wear Burzum shirts more as a wink to other people "in the know"--they fully acknowledge that 99.999% of people they pass won't know what their shirt means, and that the ones that do probably won't come up and punch them for being a racist. Wouldn't be quite the same thing to wear a Charles Manson t-shirt.

Isn't half this sad chump's music super boring Fischer Price My First Dead Can Dance Album (tm) bullshit anyway?

8 - signed original pressing of Daudi Baldrs

xp yeah (8)should be "will defend the music on the prison albums"

-1 - wears the shirt because Burzum's a word from Lord Of The Rings and the letters are maybe Elvish

9 - owns all his books
10 - has read them

lolllll

and that the ones that do probably won't come up and punch them for being a racist. Wouldn't be quite the same thing to wear a Charles Manson t-shirt.

People do things all the time that they don't understand because it's cool on the surface.

yeah but once you're older than 16 surely you see that this is a really stupid thing to do

Agreed. I wore Burzum and Death in June t-shirts in high school, and it struck me that it may not be a cool thing to do ... I imagined if a Jewish friend or something happened to know the death's head symbol or knew what Burzum was about would see it and feel weird, and bottom line didn't like the idea of fronting for the ideas those things represented. Made me feel pretty guilty so never wore them again.

I'm not a Burzum fan but yeah one of the very best things about being a metal classical and film score geek is not needing to stress about what's corny

OTM

You don't need to support Burzum or DiJ shirts if you want to walk around with a Totenkopf on yr chest, just go to Wal-Mart.

good old Wal-Mart

Yeah but I'm sure that's just post addiction graphic design, gone cluelessly awry

Affliction

fretting over how cool your metal music is represents, more than any sun(((o album, the pernicious influence of the hipster (and his associated aesthetic cliches)

whatever, man, your lame metallica patch on that jacket sucks, why don't you listen to real metal like megadeth!

DJP, not that this should in any way redeem him in your eyes, but I thought you should know that he does have a song in his catalog called "The Crying Orc."

just to clarify, did someone up thread basically go for the idea that wearing a burzum shirt is equivalent to wearing a skr3wdr1v3r shirt? because thats bullshit

skr3wdr1v3r t-shirt = fair chance that people who are familiar with the band are going to think you're a racist

Burzum t-shirt = fair chance that people who are familiar with the band are going to think you're a racist

Not particularly interested in whether one is "worse" than the other, more in whether someone from a minority group who sees you in the shirt is going to feel uncomfortable with it.

let me fix that for you

skr3wdr1v3r t-shirt = fair chance that people who are familiar with the band are going to think know you're a racist

I can't lie; I would probably wear a shirt with this thread title on it

xp, So all we're really arguing about is the degree of certainty, not that you're going to be running a significant risk of making people from groups that have traditionally been the victims of racism think you might be a neo-Nazi?

I would think that neo-Nazis who just wanted to vibe out on some good haterock would not necessarily flock to Burzum just because he's a racist, since his lyrics are about forests and stuff.

They did when I was into metal ... the official Burzum mailing list was full of that crap, and white power dudes would message me on IRC about their groups when I'd talk about the band. Then it was hard to be into Burzum without encountering the neo-Nazi side of it. Could be different now, I have no idea. I was primarily into the forests and vibes of the music, but got out pretty quickly when I saw that part of it.

Ick... Yeah, I think I'll stick to the nosebleed seats of somewhat ethically tortured Burzum fandom.

I can't lie; I would probably wear a shirt with this thread title on it

― Clarke B., Thursday, August 16, 2012 1:18 PM (25 minutes ago) Bookmark

it would have an arrow pointing straight down, right?

lol @ "neo-Nazis who just wanted to vibe out on some good haterock"

xp, So all we're really arguing about is the degree of certainty, not that you're going to be running a significant risk of making people from groups that have traditionally been the victims of racism think you might be a neo-Nazi?

― Temporarily Famous In The Czech Republic (ShariVari), Thursday, August 16, 2012 5:21 PM (37 minutes ago)

nah what i am saying is that one is a just a str8 up obvious racist band with indisputable racist lyrics, and the other is a dude making non-race related music that we know is a murdering racist asshole. theres a valid distinction there - if i see a dude with a swastika shirt, i know whats going on with him for sure, but if he is wearing a custom #88 sports jersey i dont.

it would have an arrow pointing straight down, right?

― some dude, Thursday, August 16, 2012 1:44 PM (10 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

That would be the only shirt in existence to pull off the elusive neo-Nazi-undertone / dick-joke combo

that sounds like a wager to me

xxp, to me, and to a lot of other people, they're both str8 up racist bands. Far more people are aware of the racism than the music if they're familiar with the Burzum name at all. There's certainly a strong possibility that the wearer isn't racist but there's also a fairly legitimate implication that they might be. If i get on a night bus and the only two free seats are next to a guy in a Burzum shirt and a guy in a shirt that has 88 on the back, i'm probably going to choose the one that could be a completely unintentional association.

Wearing a Burzum shirt sends a message out. That message isn't necessarily going to be interpreted in the way the wearer intends. I can't see why anyone would even want to take the risk of making people who aren't white self-conscious or uncomfortable in their presence simply to rep a band they like.

tedious nitpicking but why does racism only make non-white ppl uncomfortable?

a guy in a shirt that has 88 on the back,

woah, what is this a reference to?

With 113 caps and a World Cup winners medals to his name there is no doubt that Buffon is one of the finest goalkeepers of all time. However controversy has followed Buffon since his early days at Parma, where he chose the squad number 88. “H” is the eighth letter of the alphabet and the number 88 is used by neo-Nazi groups worldwide to signify “HH”, or Heil Hitler. [...] As he protested in his autobiography, he chose the number 88 because it contained 4 balls. [...] “We all know what having balls means in Italy,” Buffon declared in his defence

almost! gah, xps!

xp It wouldn't necessarily but "visible minorities" are obviously going to be more of a target for any potential unpleasantness and potentially more sensitive to symbols like that.

http://images.kitbag.com/celtic-82632.jpg?width=350&height=400&quality=95

ah tq merdeyeux

idk man, you can't un-know what you know. the distinction is sort of without-difference. it's not even about authorial intent -- no doubt varg would disagree that what he does is "non-race related music", but that's irrelevant.

we all know that his "about forests and stuff" music is some viking lebensraum type stuff. music about killing other people vs. music about the purity of the old lands or w/e, this is just a matter of vulgarity, but it's the same stuff all around.

it's not even code or hidden or anything, i mean, that blood-and-soil stuff is more classically fascist than killing a bandmate over a beef. (i say this being p unfamiliar with any of this music)

hey jjj, apropos of this thread if we happen to go out for awesome boozes at Moscow on the Hill when I'm home, plz don't wear a Burzum shirt

thx in advance

haha i dont own a burzum shirt, so i dont have an actual horse in this race

aw

lol actually maybe I should get one, and then silkscreen "Makes you think, huh?" on the back and wear it around town