RUSH vs. YES vs. THE GRATEFUL DEAD

the one time i tried to put the dead on while high i got shouted down. i have listened them for stretches of 2-3 days while sober, though.

this is sort of herman's hermits vs manfred mann vs the beatles

i'm sure scott seward or someone would go 'but that first earth band record just blows the beatles out of the water' but that still kind of works

'box of rain' is interesting - there's all kinds of cheap inversions, omissions to pad the meter ("thoughts unclear", "look into any eyes", seriously "look into any eyes") and on one level it seems kind of boilerplate hippy almost-philosophy, and on another somehow it manages to achieve actual beauty. it feels oddly vindicated by context, history, these worn-out singers who would spend much of the rest of their lives attempting to prolong the 60s. -- the folk couplet quoted at the end is a stroke of total genius, in this or whatever context.

Yes, because The Yes Album, Close To The Edge, and Fragile are 3 of my all-time favorites.

I have mad respect for RUSH, and love 2112, plus a bunch of their other songs.

I think I only know about 10 Dead tunes.

okay I am listening to "Box of Rain" right now and it's mostly inoffensive in its component parts, but for some reason all of them working together are making me want to claw my ears off

I think at this point I am just irrevocably prejudiced against The Grateful Dead

did Yes ever write a lyric as rad as "cool and remote like dancing girls"?

No.

But I mean, I kind of weirdly admire stuff like "Sharp! Distance! How can the wind with its arms all around me?" Stick it to semantics, man.

I like all 3 but the Dead by several million light years

I may have never heard the studio "Box Of Rain" before this moment, or at least never paid close attention on headphones, but the poor vocals (lead and harmony) really suck the enjoyment out of that song for me. There's still probably more Dead songs I like than Yes, though, and more Yes than Rush.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_-nrolqmXOts/TT4W6hpf95I/AAAAAAAABU0/oKR5cCUhmF8/s1600/pepsi07.jpg

It occurs to me that Rush vs Yes vs Zappa might be a better comparison, if you wanted to pit an American artist who started in the 60s against Rush and Yes.

I'm not really feeling the "Box of Rain" love either btw. I really like "Ripple" and "Uncle John's Band" though.

Here's a great lost classic from 1984:

― Moodles, Friday, 27 July 2012 01:26

http://www.ian-brown.co.uk/forum/images/smilies/suicide.gif

That would be a really tough one for me. I have no problem dismissing the Dead and Yes just doesn't have enough top shelf material to stand up against Rush, but Zappa is a whole different story.

"Terrapin Station Medley" should figure into this comparison!

Yeah, Terrapin is the proggiest the Dead ever got.

"cool and remote like dancing girls" sounds like a sprockets lyric to me

It's like 1968 prog, though, like Music from a Doll's House, or like the second Klaatu album!

(Note: I don't do drugs, and never went through a drugs n Dead phase: anyone out there actively listen to the Dead from a more or less exclusively sober perspective?)

when I was doing drugs I hated the Dead and all hippie shit. I didn't get into the Dead until about six years ago - on those too-rare occasions when I get lifted & listen to music I always mean to listen to the Dead but I usually end up listening to metal or Devin the Dude. I don't doubt that if I dropped acid and listened to Dark Star, it'd be a fucking revelation, though.

you know, i don't think i've listened to the dead too much while stoned. and i definitely saw them sober (but i was a clean cut kid at the time).

the dead is about as good to do drugs to as bob marley or sublime

this is really a case of "one of these things is not the same" though

it would be like polling flying burrito bros vs poco vs blue cheer

I don't doubt that if I dropped acid and listened to Dark Star, it'd be a fucking revelation, though.

^there is no revelation when high like the "shake hands with Jesus moment" on Mountain Jam after the drum solos where you can faintly hear Duane count the band back in. You gotta really be listening for it sober, but when high it's like the man is right in front of you.

bill magill, you should only post about things you notice when listening to music while high

(...after the drum solos, then the bass solo...)

eh i dunno about that, fripp and eno's "no pussyfooting" at 33 rpm captures the feeling of the comedown probably better than any music i've ever heard

"grayfolded" >> "dark star" although it's surprisingly not as obviously tape manipulated as "no pussyfooting"

but i mean re: acid music revelations yeah it was revelatory hearing a bootleg recording of live phish, doing improvisatory call-and-response group wankery to an except of "beavis and butthead", but the feeling only lasted about 10 mins before it was like ok ok turn it off turn it off there's a lot more interesting stuff happening than a cassette tape right now

probably why people's i-was-on-acid-at-this-concert stories are about 5% what they were playing and 95% random shit like rolling in the grass and a stranger you kept seeing who was reading your mind

bill magill, you should only post about things you notice when listening to music while high

― thomp, Friday, July 27, 2012 3:44 PM (15 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Sure, another one: the bass drum pedal on Tony Williams' Emergency album is really squeaky.

xp listening to "no pussyfooting" w/o drugs is a more druggy trip than listening to "no pussyfooting" on drugs imo

i had to stop listening to new stuff like anthony braxton and matthew shipp cause i'd always be noticing shit like squeaky stands

bill you probably like sextant and mwandishi and live evil right?

Love live evil, not familiar with the other two.

in terms of ways this thread could have gone this is so much better than people trying to seriously argue that jon anderson or neil peart were ever more interesting than anyone in the grateful dead

well, maybe bruce hornsby

here's one for you

yes : rush : grateful dead :: early 70s miles and herbie : return to forever : swiss movement

bill you should check out "raindance" off sextant and "quasar" off crossings, it's not the same high-energy style of play, it's more slow drifting bitches' brew type of stuff and sometimes just sparse rumbling and blooping but if you like noticing little sound details in the stereo space it's a good one

Yeah, i like that. That sounds good, i'll check it out!

the bass drum pedal on Tony Williams' Emergency album is really squeaky.
i've noticed this too! i don't think i was high on anything. except life.

you would be squeaking too if tony williams was kicking your ass all day like that

I love picking up shit like that. Plus that album is so good.

xpost-hahahahahaha

Re. "Terrapin Station" being like '68 prog - was produced by Keith Olsen, who had produced the Millennium (Curt Boettcher group) album.

Olsen produced Fleetwood Mac too; I imagine there was a huge difference in those two work environments.

He was also the bass player in the Music Machine!

bill magill, you should only post about things you notice when listening to music while high

― thomp, Friday, July 27, 2012 3:44 PM (15 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

this should be its own thread

the bass drum pedal on Tony Williams' Emergency album is really squeaky.
i've noticed this too! i don't think i was high on anything. except life.

― tylerw, Friday, July 27, 2012 3:54 PM (37 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Ditto. I find it endearing, though. (the squeak, not the fact that you were high on life) (ok, that's endearing too)

Terrapin Station the album is 35 years old today fwiw.

Dead, no contest. Like Yes a lot. Rush kinda creeps me out for some reason, in the same way Marillion does.

It is interesting to me the three very different approaches these bands have to making music. Rush is hyper-arranged, then immutable. Yes changes and shifts a little based on who is in the band at any given time, but even the long songs are very thought out; Yes doesn't jam (afaik). The Dead, on the other hand, is the opposite of immutable and highly reflective of who is in the band at any given time.

The Dead, on the other hand, is the opposite of immutable and highly reflective of who is in the band at any given time

Think this applies to Yes just as much.

This isn't even a contest.

RUSH.

rush. tons of great songs & albums. yes a close second. their best moments arguably eclipse rush's, but i'm less often in the mood, and they're sometimes unforgivably schmaltzy. dead in third, but i don't hate them. like their more concise and folky stuff quite a bit.