It Takes a Nation of Millions to Hold Us Back

from the loveless one (from '09) posted upthread

The guitars on Loveless, which for many are the most compelling element of the album, were hit-and-miss for me; I love the quality but not the quantity. The thick distortion, bends and subtle tremolo make for a truly mind-blowing sound. It's obvious that the guitars are what make the album. But I'm a big fan of space in music, and how what isn't played is just as important as what is. So for me, the constant barrage of guitar haze is too confining. Also, without some of that space, the music tends to blend together with only repetitive, and often grating, synth hooks to distinguish between songs. The ones that did stand out to me are the opener "Only Shallow" and "Come in Alone." I think I would like all of the songs a lot more outside of the context of the album as a whole, where they (and I) have more room to breathe.

that's just cuz yr old scott. kids these days LOVE cringe

i was 18 when i started writing for large-ish outlets and continued to do so as a college student, and i sure as hell had more gaps in my knowledge then and COULD have exposed my naivete or played up my youth but i was more interested in coming across as an adult who had an idea of what he was talking about it.

that loveless one reads fine! maybe everyone hates this PE review because it's poorly written!

stop shouting, mad guy

no lie what the tone of the NPR piece reminded me of more than anything was
http://www.ithaca.edu/rhp/ithacan/articles/0308/28/accent/2back_beat.htm

Haha me too.

"The dashikis, baggy pants, giant clocks that hang around your neck, throwback jerseys — they’re all vibrant and different and fun."

vs.

"His hook over that yappy guitar, the service-academy beat that drops shortly afterwards, the bells on the top-end — it's all so viscerally pleasing."

stop shouting, mad guy

lol u don't know how to read!

I don't think it'd make a bit of difference if the kid had written a thoughtful, reflective, careful analysis of why Millions doesn't really sound so amazing to him/her really tho, the same olds who got their lives changed by that record, me included, would be all "You are dumb!! This amazing record" etc etc & they/we'd sound just like fuckin baby boomers only w/rap. The piece is really stupid but there's a fair bit in the response to it that's going unexamined imo

there is some truth to this but I ultimately disagree, because this idiot is a total dickbag who thinks hip-hop sucks unless it sounds like Drake

like, there is literally NO context within the hip-hop sphere for him to engage with what Public Enemy is doing, and furthermore instead of using that disconnect as the foundation of the piece he basically whines that the album isn't very smooth and then throws the interesting bits about the evolution of hip-hop in as a half-assed aside at the end, mixed in with a comment about he's "evolved" as a music fan

I mean, I read the Loveless one; that writer didn't "get" the album either, but somehow managed to write about it in a manner that didn't make it sound like everyone who DID get the album or who grew up with it or whatever must have deluded themselves into liking it because they didn't have the benefit of someone amazing like 30 Seconds To Mars to enjoy

no lie what the tone of the NPR piece reminded me of more than anything was
http://www.ithaca.edu/rhp/ithacan/articles/0308/28/accent/2back_beat.htm

hahahaha yesssssss

being on some "rap must be smooth in order to be good" bullshit

I don't think he ever said that, though -- he just suggested that the smooth stuff was more appealing to him. I mean, you can't fault the dude for expressing a subjective opinion.

Now just because I appreciate and respect the culture, doesn’t mean I falsely (and lamely) try to emulate it. It has its place

wau

que you haven't seemed mad itt once so yeah i have no idea what croup's talking about unless he's joking

you can't fault the dude for expressing a subjective opinion.

lol, pretty sure this is 86% of ilm on any given thread

yeah i think he's joking, i am joking about him not being able to read as well, i am fairly certain he knows how to read. (i think.)

I think croup was joking due to Que's use of exclamation points

It takes a million of us to turn whitey black.

Stylus used to do an "On First Listen" column that was similar to this NPR intern exercise:
https://www.google.com/search?q=site%3Astylusmagazine.com%2Farticles%2Fon_first_listen

quite a few of which I remember fondly while others I'll leave for enterprising young NPR interns to look for as influences.

yeah, i did an On First Listen about MC5. The problem with these kind of pieces is that it's pretty damn rare you hear some canonical thing for the first time and a light shines down on you.

especially if you're listening to it for the sole purpose of writing a critical appraisal

I don't think he ever said that, though -- he just suggested that the smooth stuff was more appealing to him. I mean, you can't fault the dude for expressing a subjective opinion.

dude said "I don't really know much about hip-hop but I love Rustie and Clams Casino" and then went on to blame Public Enemy for not fitting into that context, ending with "in summation, Drake rules"

the On Second Thought columns were more fun and required more thought: you had to at least demonstrate that you have an ear.

i didn't even like when the npr intern was like i haven't heard paid in full, etc either. you could have listened to it in the weeks you had to write this damn thing!

lil Kerouac ripping first drafts from his typewriter

dude said "I don't really know much about hip-hop but I love Rustie and Clams Casino" and then went on to blame Public Enemy for not fitting into that context, ending with "in summation, Drake rules"

He didn't "blame" Public Enemy, he just described his reaction to Millions. He said it left him "perplexed" but that he was glad he gave it a shot.

this board has countless threads devoted to ripping on revered albums, generational differences, not understanding stuff on the first listen, and while there's as much argument as can be expected in those threads there's probably not as much judgment or annoyance because people were just making conversation, not writing columns for a high profile media outlet, i really think the NPR intern angle is much more potent than just the content of what he's saying, which is occasionally lol but not especially aggressive or outrageous.

reading a bunch of these just made me say "ok yeah why am i reading what a 19 year old has to say again?"

someone needs to do a variation of this that says "NPR INTERNS ARE RUINING MUSIC"

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/bc/Home_taping_is_killing_music.png/220px-Home_taping_is_killing_music.png

also the "high profile" claim people are making is funny in that they've been running this series for 3 years and i'd be impressed if 2 of us knew it before this

true, true, that was news to me

serious question: how many of us read NPR's music stuff on our own? I don't unless it's linked.

they should make these interns listen to obscurities instead. world needs more Son of Bazerk reviews!

I avoid NPR like the plague but my wife gets her news from it in the car

there are a few people on there that i know and/or check for their stuff, don't go on the NPR site all the time but here and there. and my wife always has it on in her car also lol.

I listen to All Things Considered in bits to and fro work but that's it

He didn't "blame" Public Enemy, he just described his reaction to Millions. He said it left him "perplexed" but that he was glad he gave it a shot.

he said he was getting a harsh tank when he was expecting a Bentley and called various elements of the songs "thin", "cartoonish", "caricature" and "alarmingly dated"

then, rather than using that gap between expectation and reality to spend some time talking about how things have changed since Millions was released and to examine where his preconceptions of what the album would be like came from, he instead decides to complain that the whole album isn't ambient soundscapes and throws the more interesting question out as an aside at the end

tbf Chuck D does sound like a tank

I hope it's clear my annoyance is not with dude disliking Millions, it's with him acting like rap music should be passive-sounding in order to for him to enjoy it

sounds like he'd like the last couple PE albums

hahahaha

he said he was getting a harsh tank when he was expecting a Bentley

But this is a perfect example of how he explicitly lays his personal biases/expectations on the table. He doesn't say "The only good hip-hop is the kind that's lush and luxurious-sounding. Public Enemy is not like that, therefore it's bad." He says "I like hip-hop that's lush and luxurious-sounding. When I listen to a hip-hop record, that's what I want to hear. Public Enemy is not like that, so it's not my cup of tea."

called various elements of the songs "thin", "cartoonish", "caricature" and "alarmingly dated"

Again, I think he couches these descriptions pretty well as subjective opinions:

Chuck D.'s unvarnished vocals sit front and center in the mix, accompanied only by percussion that, to me, sounds thin and funk guitar samples that, frankly, I find cartoonish. To me, Chuck D.'s legendary flow also comes across like a caricature.

But Public Enemy and I are on the same page only briefly: immediately following "Show 'Em" is the alarmingly dated rap-rock fusion of "She Watch Channel Zero?!" I simply cannot get past the bizarre, jolting juxtaposition of bludgeoning, Metallica-style guitar riffs and Flavor Flav's ebullient rhymes. I find myself more inclined to laugh than dance.

I hope it's clear my annoyance is not with dude disliking Millions, it's with him acting like rap music should be passive-sounding in order to for him to enjoy it

But ... what if that's true?

He doesn't say "The only good hip-hop is the kind that's lush and luxurious-sounding. Public Enemy is not like that, therefore it's bad." He says "I like hip-hop that's lush and luxurious-sounding. When I listen to a hip-hop record, that's what I want to hear. Public Enemy is not like that, so it's not my cup of tea."

but, jay, the way he writes means these two thoughts are indistinguishable

he phrases his thoughts in such a way that "only" is the inevitable adverb

I know way too many people here right now that didn't listen to rap last year, who the fuck are y'all?

then, rather than using that gap between expectation and reality to spend some time talking about how things have changed since Millions was released and to examine where his preconceptions of what the album would be like came from, he instead decides to complain that the whole album isn't ambient soundscapes and throws the more interesting question out as an aside at the end

I don't disagree that this would make for a more interesting piece of writing, but it doesn't seem like that's his/NPR's aim.

he doesn't bother examining other possibilities for hip-hop

but, jay, the way he writes means these two thoughts are indistinguishable

Sorry, I don't get that sense at all.

xp Is that his responsibility? It's an exercise in listening and responding to music.

then you are reading the piece incorrectly

haha a cousin, selecting a Kenny Chesney song, chastised me on Memorial Day weekend for being "way too old" to listen to hip-hop.