New Joanna Newsom Album "Ys" Due Nov 14

This thread is going downhill fast... but I sympathise with people finding it all a bit hollow and contrived, in a way that frequently actually repels an emotional connection.

Well for me anyway. Whether she's "sincere" or not I don't know, I wish I could finally understand why I just-about like this, and even then with doubts, whereas other people are finding it utterly rapturous & I assume, deeply satisfying.

Maybe it's because so little of her poetry strikes me as coming from the sub-conscious, it makes too much literal/poetic sense when it's understood, it reminds me of rap that I don't like, when there's piles upon piles of lyrical puzzles to untangle but not much blissful surrender. Which is unfair, as there are many moments of surrender here, but as a whole, the sheer concentration -of- it, and the concentration it feels like it needs to be absorbed is wearying. I tried letting this just wash over me too but that came out even less rewarding :(

I still have the horrible feeling this is going to click eventually and I'll have to eat my words... but I still wish the 5 parts didn't all sound so similar overall, without that differentiation, this record feels more like a half-remembered dream with an uncertain beginning and end, and not enough of a "journey" for me.

I definitely see how her music can sound like it was labored over to an excessive degree. When an artist appears to be trying too hard, it becomes a big turn-off. In that sense, I understand a lot of the criticism here.

The part I don't get is the notion that she is pulling a fast one on her audience or playing some kind of confidence trick. That seems to be the implication of a lot of comments on this thread, and I find it kind of mystifying.

Why are so many people convinced that there is a big disconnect (for good or ill) between her persona and her personality?

Is it so hard to believe that she is, in fact, that person?

I mean think about how long she sings about "darling dance with me" over and over and over and over again for a good 3 minutes at the end of "bear and monkey"

Sure, get lost in it. Feel the magic. It's like a sandra bullock romantic comedy, (but sandra REALLY IS THAT CUTE IN REAL LIFE), you either get lost in it or you don't.

Obviously I don't and I guess the other major issue I'm taking here (and I'm more irritated by the fans/critics then the actual album) is that NOBODY else seems to be speaking up here. Is it required that everyone think what she's doing is fucking hands down 10/10 across the board album of the year.

I know now people are going to chime in with a one sentence "I don't love it" but seriously, I just can't believe so many people buy it.

I'm quickly turning into the resident joanna hater and that wasn't my intention. I admire her ambition. I think the record is FINE. It is what it is, but I can't stomach all these giddy male rock critics talking about how for some reason HER lyrics about skipping stones are so great and why random other artists singing equally as ridiculous (IMO ) lyrics , get the full brush over or deemed as "trite" and "cutesy"

why her?

What makes you think that she sees herself this way? I have no way of knowing for sure, but I would guess that she sees herself as a musician. I've never seen her say anything that would indicate otherwise.

I just can't believe so many people buy it

This is what confuses me - why does liking this album = "buying" it? If I enjoy listening to her am I suspending my disbelief? Disbelief of what?

I can't stomach all these giddy male rock critics talking about how for some reason HER lyrics about skipping stones are so great and why random other artists singing equally as ridiculous (IMO ) lyrics , get the full brush over or deemed as "trite" and "cutesy"

I understand disagreeing with the critics, but why be angry at them? Why even care about them?

THE GREEEEEED

(same pitchfork reviewer, (nearly) same score, same 'epic' expansion upon promising first disc, same hype)

I can't see this being better than BB, myself, but I'll need to give it a listen.

This is...as good.

Plus VDP & Steve Albini & Jim O'Rourke.

Like whoa.

Ys is a good album, though

(same pitchfork reviewer, (nearly) same score, same 'epic' expansion upon promising first disc, same hype)

I jumped in w/my "as good as" cause I know teh Jagger digs it lots, and then we miscommunicated shit all to hell.

A couple years ago, they were getting the same hype.

They do projects that seem either ambitious or crazy.

The lyrics are overly verbose or just plain long.

so i was hoping to get this for my 8-year old cousin who is a concert harpist... (no shit)... is there a lot of smog dick or it is bad mixed metaphor?

will she see through it? i was gonna make her a copy of the last record minus the song with the "whores" on it... cause i'm not sure if her folks would dig that...

any chance JN will be on a NOW! kids comp in the near future?
m.

Huh? Joanna Newsom? Sandra fucking Bullock? "CUTE IN REAL LIFE"? Is this some exercise in automatic writing?

I think YS sounds like a treat, actually.

This is the case with 90% of today's most critically praised indie music.

Because Newsom has a much stronger grasp of meter than most lyricists, not to mention most poets. With great consistency she can roll off stanzas like "and the articulation / in our elbows and knees / makes us buckle as we couple / in endless increase" or "though our bones they may break / and our souls separate
/ why the long face? / and though our bodies recoil / from the grip of the soil / why the long face?" Pick any set of words (buckle / couple, they-may-break / sep-a-rate) and you can see the active engagement with the rhythmic possibilities of words - not to mention themes like how a lover's embrace can forestall our fear of death. Freshman poetry? Obviously you haven't attended enough freshman poetry workshops - many seasoned poets would give an arm for Newsom's facility with rhyme and meter.

This is a lot harder then it looks, and you're coming off like a guy watching an Olympic skating routine and going "Pshaw, I could do that shit!" Anyone who claims Newsom isn't doing serious work in her lyrics either isn't paying attention or is getting hung up on surface details like skipping stones and fables about monkeys and bears. And since you've owned up to posting here primarily to bait people who like Joanna Newsom, I'll close by saying this;

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y176/edwardiii/screwtroll.jpg

a friend of mine made this comparison the other day, and I actually think it's spot on. That and Sufjan Stevens, at least insofar as they're good examples of overreaching, overstuffed, absurdly elaborate indie records that have proved to be really divisive. I prefer JN to both of them (and personally find Sufjan repulsive), but then again, there seems to be plenty of venom for Ys here and I'm having a hard time drawing a good argument together for IT over Sufjan or Blueberry Boat. though I think it's obvious that Ys is a more anal and sonically precise record, which, for me, makes its frillery a little more vivid & validated.

I agree that there is a pattern here. First, there is the quirky and promising debut that wows many and shows evidence of a new talent, though some listeners still aren't convinced. Then, there is the more assured, "ambitious", and polished follow-up, which wins over most of the doubters - yet also disappoints many of the original true believers, who miss the odd charm and spontaneous thrill of the debut.

-- mike powell (revelator...), November 14th, 2006.

I'd say that Newsom's contribution, being the centerpiece, is precise but I've always felt Van Dyke Parks and all of the mixing/production techniques zip around like giddy children who get to play at the rich kid's house.

Then again, I prefer it to Sufjan because Parks' arrangements are flawed. Sufjan is the one who sounds a little too precise for me: he writes songs in 11/8 time sig. just for shits and giggles.

fine, but still a world away from plebe Stevens's ragtag Salvation Army orchestra schtick

There's a thread like this every week. Pretty sad.

love it

'sall I'm sayin.

That being said, more than anything I think this album reinforces how tempting it is to drink the Kool-Aid when its so fucking tasty on first sip and its so fucking hot outside.