Verve: S/D ?

blimey, didn't realise best was their manager.

used to deal with him when he was part of david holmes/13 amp label crew.

That first Verve album, A Storm In Heaven, is the one I keep returning to whenever I feel the need to listen to this band. I just enjoy getting lost in the overall sound of it, and on that level it works better for me than pretty much anything they did afterwards.

Been listening to a lot of early Verve the last couple of days, listening to the early EP tracks and B-sides in sequence almost makes for a great companion album to A Storm In Heaven. Their music circa 1992-1994 is easily my favourite era of this band. I never really liked the way that A Northern Soul sounded, they were pretty much a different band from that point onwards. I just love the spacy, jam-like, loose feel of their earlier work.

I put Storm In Heaven on the other week and it felt really juvenile and unformed. Which obviously was a massive part of its appeal when I was 16, but grated now.

They were a great groove band in those days - Gravity Grave, A Man Called Sun, No Come Down. I'd've liked them to stay more locked-down like that, instead of starsailing.

Yeah, 'Gravity Grave' especially still takes me on a journey whenever I listen to it... it has to be the 8+ minute version where they jam out at the end, though. My favourite tracks from A Storm In Heaven are stuff like 'Already There' and 'Beautiful Mind', where I just get lost in the sound of it.

I've never particularly cared for Verve's lyrics, mind, even in their earlier stages; and if there's one element of the band's sound I could call 'juvenile', that would be it. But to concentrate too hard on the lyrics when listening to early Verve is kinda missing the point. Their best work, especially their lengthier pieces, carry me along with them and take me somewhere else: 'She's A Superstar', 'Gravity Grave', and the aforementioned 'Already There' and 'Beautiful Mind'.

They did clean up their sound later on, and got better at writing songs (even through jamming), but it doesn't touch me and nor do I find it absorbing in the same way as I find their 1992-1994 work, sadly.

The key to deep music is deep atmosphere.

"Because I’ve got a thing about rooms, I think a lot of stuff that we wrote was influenced by the very room that we were in. I got sucked into them. Two months later I thought, “That’s why the record doesn’t sound right, because we can’t get the room anymore.”
~Nick McCabe

I dig Nick's subtle slide guitar on this song.

Haunting dreamscape....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0F5oOSCVqkA

God, how I wish 'Gravity Grave' and 'She's A Superstar' were both on A Storm In Heaven...

I've got all the original cd singles from 92 onwards and love the early stuff the most but bloody hell there needs to be a decently remastered compilation of their singles and b-sides, the original singles don't have the power they should have.

I put Storm In Heaven on the other week and it felt really juvenile and unformed. Which obviously was a massive part of its appeal when I was 16, but grated now.

― Sick Mouthy (Scik Mouthy), Friday, May 25, 2012 10:45 PM (9 months ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Just getting this revived for GP.

what a coincidence

I'm a better musician. Serious musicians and composers are not commercial I trained at the top music school in the US.. I'm a CREATIVE person. I am a vocalist, composer, multi-instrumentalist. I taught myself how to write music but I had extensive training. I sing advanced music and write advanced music. I can write simple music too. I need donations since the commercial world does not fund serious composers or serious musicians. I need assistance. All serious musicians do.

heh, I can still listen to Storm in Heaven repeatedly, it's just one of those long haul LPs for me. the first side is just perfect.

I was going to say, this one is still all time for me.

Occurs to me that in the end Ashcroft followed the Stipe path -- as it became clearer what he was singing, the end results dropped off.

Yeah, for me part of the appeal of those early records isn't what Ashcroft is singing, it's more the sounds he makes with his voice and the way he reacts to the music and compliments it, which is even more evident in the live performances of some of the longer pieces where they sprawl out a bit. In a way, Ashcroft is "jamming" as much as the rest of the band are, but with his voice.

man i only really knew Verve from bittersweet symphony and that record

listening to storm in heaven, this is fucking a gorgeous guitar record

I think the midpoint album (A Northern Soul) is better than what came before/after. best of both worlds.

xpost:

Check out the early EPs too, if you can. If you love A Storm In Heaven, you'll also really like 'Gravity Grave', 'She's A Superstar' etc.

thanks turrican

started northern soul, don't like it as much. it's not bad. but i think i basically just love the guitar player(s?) in this band and like it best when ashcroft isn't out front

Singular. Nick McCabe. Wonderful guitarist. Listen to the title track of A Northern Soul; WTF IS HE DOING?! There's a b-side from that era called Let The Damage Begin which is just fucking ungodly.

But yeah, their three records were completely different from each other, basically, might as well have been different bands.

xxpost:

No worries! It's mostly just the one guitarist on those first two Verve records (and on Forth): the inimitable Mr. Nick McCabe, although Richard Ashcroft does play a little bit of acoustic guitar here and there (although I think it's just on 'History' and 'See You In The Next One' from those albums). Simon Tong was a member of The Verve for the Urban Hymns period only.

My favourite McCabe riff on A Northern Soul is undoubtedly 'So It Goes' (god, I love that riff), but I'm pretty much with you... I see A Northern Soul as having much more in common with Urban Hymns than with A Storm In Heaven. I'm not a big fan of the Owen Morris production treatment on it either.

Listen to the title track of A Northern Soul; WTF IS HE DOING?!

A lot of wah-wah and a lot of attitude! :D

Owen Morris' production is fucking brutal and weird. I like it, but I think it's affection from adolescence rather than appreciation.

To me, it just has that "mid-'90s Owen Morris sound", like his work on Oasis' What's The Story (Morning Glory)? or 1977 by Ash. Of course, the musical content is going to be different (since The Verve aren't Oasis or Ash), but you can definitely tell he worked on all three just by listening to them... the overall sound of those records are very similar. I think he ruined 1977 in particular... didn't really get the best takes or performances out of Ash and god damn that over-reverbed snare drum sound (which is a bit of a mid-'90s Owen Morris trait, I think). Then again, wasn't he known to get carried away with the partying just as much as the bands themselves? I don't think I heard a decent production job from him until... oooh... Free All Angels.

Yeah, there are LOTS of stories of BIG indulgence where he's just as hammered as who he's working with.

The ones that I know of are of him being off his face on Ecstasy and smashing a window during the making of A Northern Soul, being massively coked out of his skull during the making of Be Here Now... I have absolutely no doubt that he would have got off his face working with Ash too.

A track from Ashcroft's and McCabe's pre-Verve band Rain Garden has surfaced

Nick McCabe taking questions from everyone on Facebook (Black Submarine update, inevitable deluxe reissues of ASIH and ANS, Forth is fave Verve album, Ashcroft doesn't return messages, live album completed but sitting on the shelf)

And from the Quietus today

http://thequietus.com/articles/13826-verve-a-storm-in-heaven

yeah brilliant album, i bought the day it was released and was pleasantly blown away.

McCabe on Facebook: "just signed off on reissues of the first two albums with extra tracks, vinyl remastering, etc."

Also: "Si and I were up for 20th anniversary shows but Axl wasn't interested"

Roffle.

Recently picked up a cheapo CD copy of A Storm In Heaven and it has yet to leave the stereo.

Been inspired to listen to the Verve for the first in ages. Not to labour a point but the early stuff really does hold up - pretty much everything up to Ashcroft's delirious 'that was amazing' at the end of (Reprise). Everything after I can pretty much take or leave, and mainly because I just can't bear Ashcroft's unearned messianic bullshit. McCabe, though. Jesus.

Are the b-sides available anywhere? The ones not available on No Come Down, I mean. There's a bunch referenced in this thread I've not even heard.

Listening to A Storm in Heaven for the first time in ages. Yup.

And 'One Way to Go' so readily conjures up bleached out stoned softdawns it's like mainlining my late teens.

Yeah, I completely agree. The success of Urban Hymns was just the worst thing for this band. After that, Ashcroft's ego ballooned and I often get the feeling that he thinks he was The Verve. In reality, the appeal of this band for me comes from the interaction between the other three members.

After that, Ashcroft's ego ballooned and I often get the feeling that he thinks he was The Verve

If you read the latest interview with him in Q magazine (Prince cover), your feeling will be confirmed.

is McCabe/Jones' recent project Black Submarines any good?

I thought Ashcroft saw himself and McCabe as the Jagger and Richards of The Verve. Every time the band broke up it was because Ashcroft thought he could carry The Verve on his own, and every time he realized there could be no Verve without McCabe he reformed the band.

rereading this thread: "i feel like we're flying" O_O <3

it's interesting that people dismiss latter-period Verve output by equating it with '73-5 soft-rock. i enjoy all Verve eras, and have specifically cited the later stuff's being "modern 70s soft-rock" as something that appeals to me! hell, even some of richard's solo stuff (ok just "i get my beat"). i get that folks who only like the earlier, wilder sound would feel betrayed by the shift, though. for me, it feels like an indulgence in exactly the same way 73 soft rock does -- i have to let go of certain tendencies (like balking at corny lyrics) and just melt into this giant soft rock jacuzzi.

roxy otm I love Urban Hymns as well as the early stuff. Even forth has some great moments. Not so keen on the solo stuff mind

I gave A Northern Soul a re-listen this weekend and it still sounds like Rattle and Hum-era U2 to me. Airless and overblown. You can hear in the guitar playing how good it would have been had Leckie produced it and Ashcroft tried to sing with the music instead of over it. I think I'll like Urban Hymns better... let's try!

The best songs on Urban Hymns are the ones written by the band, IMO. 'Catching The Butterfly', 'The Rolling People' etc. The stuff on there written solely by Ashcroft points towards his solo work which holds less appeal for me. It's weird, though, how their biggest album is actually their most obviously "transitional" work.

Czech singer Natalie Kocab's new album has McCabe all over it. Haven't heard anything other than what's on the YouTube promos - kinda gothy sounding, but am curious.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvi2x0l9p5c

Intrigued!

also intrigued

Dug out my vinyl copy of A Northern Soul tonight and it sounds muddier than I remember but goddamn McCabe's guitar tone - it's like solar wind.

I have though, after years of listening, just worked out that at the end of ' On Your Own' Ashcroft is singing 'I'm just a poor little wifeless fella.' What a twat.

Need to get that A Storm In Heaven deluxe thing.

the 1998 live set that was on tv at the time has McCabe back doing similar guitar stuff so is really worth checking out.

I always heard his guitar as sounding a lot like Richard Thompson for some reason. Wondered if i was alone in doing so but think one of the reviews I read in a current monthly refers to something along the lines.

I have though, after years of listening, just worked out that at the end of ' On Your Own' Ashcroft is singing 'I'm just a poor little wifeless fella.' What a twat.

― Sunn O))) Brother Where Art Thou? (Chinaski), Friday, September 9, 2016 7:47 PM (yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Isn't that 'So It Goes'?

I usually find that the better Verve songs for me are the ones where the lyric feels secondary to the music, which is probably why I like their earliest stuff so much.