Don't have either in front of me at the moment, but the ardent thing has an extra Icewater track and an exclusive snippet of Alex singing "Don't Worry Baby".
― Lady Writer, Male Seether (C. Grisso/McCain), Thursday, 2 February 2012 23:20 (twelve years ago) link
in other news, looks like that big star doc is showing at sxsw http://schedule.sxsw.com/2012/events/event_FS12365
― tylerw, Thursday, 2 February 2012 23:36 (twelve years ago) link
i feel like i'm really late to the party, but i'm just starting to get into big star for real. i've given #1 record a shot several times over the last decade but could never get into it that much, other than the big obvious stuff like Thirteen and September Gurls. but this time i skipped straight to Third and i love it, particularly the last half. over on the What is the original track sequence for Big Star's third record? thread (which prompted me to check out Third, incidentally), it seemed like the original tracklist is the way to go, even if it wasn't what Chilton intended for release:
http://i41.tinypic.com/125timd.png
i love the descent into o dana, big black car, holocaust and then kangaroo. Kangaroo, especially. what a fantastic song.
also, way upthread someone linked to a good article that focuses on Alex Chilton from 1975 to 1981. that link is now dead, but it's still online at http://www.pastemagazine.com/blogs/crawdaddy/2011/07/alex-chilton-1975-1981.html . the reason i mention it is that there was some brief discussion upthread about whether or not the lyrics of "Jesus Christ" are ironic. fwiw, the article says:
With less inspired results, Tiven had Chilton and company run through “Jesus Christ”, a song Chilton had recorded for Third. “I thought that was a really good song,” Tiven says. “When we did it, Alex sang it in a German accent and sang, ‘You’re going to rot in your grave tonight, Jesus Christ.’ He was really trying his best to be as offensive as possible.”
― Z S, Friday, 10 February 2012 20:18 (twelve years ago) link
So, you have the cd with #1 Record AND Radio City on it, then?Cuz Septembur Gurls is on Radio City while Thirteen is on #1 Record.I had a similar experience to you, but it was Radio City that really clicked for me. It's an all time favorite now. I think it's a perfect record. After picking up the box set, though, I love it ALL. The demos of the Radio City songs and the Third songs are really great, check them out.
― Trip Maker, Friday, 10 February 2012 20:33 (twelve years ago) link
i don't actually own #1 record or radio city, i was just going off of memory and thought both songs were on #1 record. i'm planning on returning to those records at some point (Radio City in particular, i haven't given it a fair chance), but for now i'm just going to take my time with Third and let it soak in.
― Z S, Friday, 10 February 2012 20:38 (twelve years ago) link
the demos of the Third material on the box set really put the lie to that album being half-assed/messy/drug-addled madness. Chilton's arrangements are clear as day.
xp
― max buzzword (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, 10 February 2012 20:40 (twelve years ago) link
I mean sure there are weird production choices and touches and a lot of the delivery is off-the-cuff but the songs themselves have very definite structures
― max buzzword (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, 10 February 2012 20:41 (twelve years ago) link
oh man, i should check that out. in the allmusic review of Kangaroo it mentions that Chilton recorded the guts of it on a single track, just 12-string guitar and vocal, and all of the other stuff was added the next day. i'd love to hear that original middle of the night version, although i love the washes of chaos of the recorded version too.
― Z S, Friday, 10 February 2012 20:52 (twelve years ago) link
if there's a solo 12-string demo version of Kanga Roo (similar to those for Stroke it Noel, Big Black Car, Downs, Jesus Christ etc), it's not on the box set. The liner notes to the ryko reissue go into how Kanga Roo was recorded - iirc Jim Dickinson said Alex had overdubbed the mellotron and feedback and some other stuff all one channel as a deliberate challenge/test of Dickinson's patience and mixing skills
― max buzzword (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, 10 February 2012 21:01 (twelve years ago) link
my other favorite anecdote from the Ryko reissue was about using a basketball as a snare drum for Downs
― max buzzword (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, 10 February 2012 21:03 (twelve years ago) link
i got all 3 albums on some weird german 2cd many years ago... the tracklist for sister/lovers is 17 tracks long and really weird...
― and the answer is: Opinions differ. (stevie), Friday, 10 February 2012 21:04 (twelve years ago) link
Kizza me You can't have meJesus Christ Downs Whola lotta shakin' going on Thank you friends O, Dana Femme fatale Stroke it, Noel Holocaust Nighttime Kanga-roo For you Take care Blue moon Dream lover Big black car
― and the answer is: Opinions differ. (stevie), Friday, 10 February 2012 21:06 (twelve years ago) link
that is weird. and plus, it loses the back to back order of Holocaust into Kanga-roo (Kanga Roo? Kangaroo?) which works so well not only because they're both in the same otherworldly bleak territory but also because the beginning of Kangaroo uses an almost identical melody to the one in Holocaust.
― Z S, Friday, 10 February 2012 21:10 (twelve years ago) link
Holocaust chords are "borrowed" from Yoko Ono's "Mrs. Lennon" fwiw
― max buzzword (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, 10 February 2012 21:14 (twelve years ago) link
I need "Blue Moon" near the end, find orderings where it's not p hard to follow
― Euler, Friday, 10 February 2012 21:21 (twelve years ago) link
similarly, I find any arrangement that doesn't put Stroke it Noel first absolutely baffling
― max buzzword (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, 10 February 2012 21:25 (twelve years ago) link
haha I love the Ryko opening with "Thank You Friends"
― Euler, Friday, 10 February 2012 21:27 (twelve years ago) link
never knew this, fwiw. mind's on crooked now.
― Little GTFO (contenderizer), Friday, 10 February 2012 22:18 (twelve years ago) link
it's pretty blatant - same key, tempo, piano part, etc.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VLeZTKEVGVkhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vsQ977u8Wuk
― max buzzword (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, 10 February 2012 22:20 (twelve years ago) link
Damn, you weren't kidding.
― pplains, Friday, 10 February 2012 22:27 (twelve years ago) link
Yoko ruins everything.
― Josh in Chicago, Friday, 10 February 2012 22:58 (twelve years ago) link
I should finally listen to Big Star. I have everything else released on Ardent and a lot of records recorded there. The Hot Dogs and Cargoe have become two of my favorite records, but I keep putting Big Star off for some reason.
― JacobSanders, Friday, 10 February 2012 23:15 (twelve years ago) link
speaking of mrs. john lennon and holocaust
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rXRExocnpUw
― Z S, Saturday, 11 February 2012 06:31 (twelve years ago) link
Third turns out to be even better when you're wasted and bummed out! who could have predicted that?!
― Z S, Sunday, 12 February 2012 05:31 (twelve years ago) link
seriously though, as much as i enjoy the first half, there's this run from blue room>take care>jesus christ>femme fatale(well, eh on that one tbh)>o,dana>big black car>holocaust,kanga roo>thank you friends that's just astounding
― Z S, Sunday, 12 February 2012 05:32 (twelve years ago) link
very seriously though
opening chords to angie always make me wanna go "on a dark desert highway..."
― Little GTFO (contenderizer), Sunday, 12 February 2012 05:43 (twelve years ago) link
blue room lol
― Little GTFO (contenderizer), Sunday, 12 February 2012 05:44 (twelve years ago) link
blue room>take care>jesus christ>femme fatale(well, eh on that one tbh)>o,dana>big black car>holocaust,kanga roo>thank you friends
otm tho (except femme fatale cover is good too)
― Little GTFO (contenderizer), Sunday, 12 February 2012 05:45 (twelve years ago) link
oh, i didn't mean the carrot signs to mean lesser than or greater than, i just meant i liked that whole flow from song to song!
and i like femme fatale cover too, actually, just not in the context of that slide into wasterdom
― Z S, Sunday, 12 February 2012 05:49 (twelve years ago) link
i just meant i liked that whole flow from song to song!
oh yeah, me too. might be my favorite song sequence anywhere ever. awesome in that it's relatable no matter how good or bad i'm feeling, and however dark it gets, it never brings me down. plus just songs. could live inside blue moon forever.
― Little GTFO (contenderizer), Sunday, 12 February 2012 06:13 (twelve years ago) link
i'm so happy to have Third in my life. I dunno, this afternoon I devoted some serious time to #1 Record and Radio City, but Third is just...way more appealing to my ears. I always try to stay open to stuff, and i'll revisit their first two over and over again (and probably update this thread in 2017 or something), but at the moment Third really appeals to me more than the others.
― Z S, Sunday, 12 February 2012 06:16 (twelve years ago) link
first two are really great (like REALLY great), but i agree. third forever.
― Little GTFO (contenderizer), Sunday, 12 February 2012 06:24 (twelve years ago) link
i don't know, the first two seem relatively straightforward to me. don't get me wrong, it's great pop, and repeated listens earlier today i was enjoying them (and i'll keep checking them out and i'm sure at some point i'll revive this thread and feel like a dumbass for not loving them from the beginning), but Third really hits at something a bit skewed that really appeals to me.
― Z S, Sunday, 12 February 2012 06:27 (twelve years ago) link
yeah, that's the difference. first two are brilliant, aching power pop gr8ness. 3rd is alltime rip yr guts out weirdo darkness shit. and i'm way more in that camp, but you know, i'm cool with brilliant aching power pop too.
― Little GTFO (contenderizer), Sunday, 12 February 2012 06:42 (twelve years ago) link
i'm sure at some point i'll revive this thread and feel like a dumbass for not loving them from the beginning
one week later!
ok, i'm officially obsessed. i don't think i've listened to anything else in the last week, and since i just started digging into the demos/i am the cosmos/icewater/rock city shit it's only going to deepen from here.
WHAT'S GOING AHN!!!!
― tmi but (Z S), Sunday, 19 February 2012 16:58 (twelve years ago) link
having said that, with that said, that being said, that having been said, i am a little afraid to wade into the alex chilton solo stuff. also, that big star biography mentioned upthread by rob jovanovic has some nice tidbits and i'm glad i took a few hours to read it, but it really is pretty terrible.
― tmi but (Z S), Sunday, 19 February 2012 17:01 (twelve years ago) link
Chilton album 1970 is well worth time even without having to try to "get" Chilton
― Euler, Sunday, 19 February 2012 17:08 (twelve years ago) link
oh, definitely. it's more the post big star output that i'm wary of. is there a good collection that picks out the good stuff?
― tmi but (Z S), Sunday, 19 February 2012 17:11 (twelve years ago) link
It sounds like Third is the Big Star record for me by what you guys said above. How do Big Star compare to other bands on the Ardent label like Hot Dogs or Cargoe?
― JacobSanders, Sunday, 19 February 2012 17:51 (twelve years ago) link
xpost re: good stuff. Speaking as someone whose favorite Chilton song is the fucked up version of "Take Me Home and Make Me Like It" I'm not sure how anyone could define "good" with reference to his post-Big-Star stuff. That 1970 album is pretty good without getting too complicated about things...been listening to it a lot since it appeared on Spotify.
― dlp9001, Sunday, 19 February 2012 19:16 (twelve years ago) link
How do Big Star compare to other bands on the Ardent label like Hot Dogs or Cargoe?
Oh Jacob.
― Kevin John Bozelka, Sunday, 19 February 2012 19:28 (twelve years ago) link
What?? So I've never heard Big Star, their records aren't cheap ya know
― JacobSanders, Sunday, 19 February 2012 20:02 (twelve years ago) link
i've never heard any other bands on Ardent. But check out youtube! just search for big star +
september gurlsthe ballad of el goodobig black carholocaustwhat's going ahnfeelthirteenkangaroo
and so on
― tmi but (Z S), Sunday, 19 February 2012 20:10 (twelve years ago) link
impressive that anyone would've heard of hot dogs and cargoe without hearing big star first -- they're basically footnotes to the big star story. those records are decent, but imo they pale in comparison to big star. as for chilton the top 30 comp is a pretty decent overview. i've grown to love pretty much anything he's been involved with, but suffice to say he was taking a radically different approach to music making in his post big star days.
― tylerw, Sunday, 19 February 2012 20:48 (twelve years ago) link
Surely he was trolling?
― Dalai Mixture (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 19 February 2012 22:42 (twelve years ago) link
I wasn't trolling. I've been hoping to find their records while out record hunting. With certain groups I put off listening to them until I find them. I could go on you tube and listen to big star or I could wait until magic happens and I find one at a flea market. It's silly but it's also fun leaving certain groups to be heard.
― JacobSanders, Sunday, 19 February 2012 23:25 (twelve years ago) link
yeah, i can understand that! with big star, though, i don't think i've ever seen one of their records on sale! they had major distribution problems back in the day (they were on Stax for the first two) and very few records were printed in the first place (i think 5K or so for the first, maybe 20K or so for the second).
― tmi but (Z S), Sunday, 19 February 2012 23:28 (twelve years ago) link
One trip through Tennessee didn't turn up a Big Star record, but I'll be there again this summer. What I really want is the Chris Bell solo record, if anything for being called I Am The Cosmos. What I love about the Cargoe record is the flashes of a southern feel underneath the power pop. I assumed that had more to do with Terry Manning though, I'm hoping Big Star have that too.
― JacobSanders, Monday, 20 February 2012 00:00 (twelve years ago) link
O man the beginning this thread. lol Old ILX. Ethan, such a worthless critic.
― President Keyes, Monday, 20 February 2012 00:08 (twelve years ago) link