what happens if SOPA passes?

ze german pov

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vaXR9dsQGn8

xp i know, but that's how a lot of this is reading

i assume they're easier to maintain because they sell a lot of records?

well, one kinda begets the other. i'm not sure what you're suggesting is going to happen here

I've always been under the impression that the musicians that are most likely to earn a living are wedding bands, smooth-jazz-standards-for-'classy'-bars bands, some session dudes, advertising jingle writers etc. Figure it's similar to the way in which most actors who earn a living by it are not film stars, y'know.

but I do think that there are amazing social gains from having total freedom of information and because of that it's worth it for the gov't to just pay people to be artists.

Sorry, no, a government that "just pays people to be artists" also gets to decide who is and isn't one. Do you trust the fucking Republican House of Representatives not to just give all your money to Ray Stevens and that chick from Northern Exposure? I sure don't.

I mean, shit, I play the bass and guitar and have been in bands and have an entry at AllMusic and a bunch of songs with BMI. Where's my check?

i would think it would be based on something like "who's getting the plays on Spotify" rather than anything the government controls

Well, that's kinda cart before the horse territory, isn't it?

lol that sounds like a total racket

xp

Sorry, no, a government that "just pays people to be artists" also gets to decide who is and isn't one. Do you trust the fucking Republican House of Representatives not to just give all your money to Ray Stevens and that chick from Northern Exposure? I sure don't.

yeah I guess the difference is I don't see this as 'govt pays people to be artists vs market pays people to be artists' I see this as 'govt pays people to be artists or nobody pays people to be artists'

I like this conversation, just chiming in with thoughts

lots of parallels with the long history of arguments and dialogues about the sad demise of classical music. which is still around, but as a museum. few people mind; by the early 1920's it was pretty clear most of the good music for that medium had already been written, and the newer works were either populist neo-classical collages of earlier works, or too experimental and esoteric to captivate a large audience

what's dying now is popular music as we know it, funded by major labels, and we're at the neo-classical phase. the largest artists are collagists hopping across the last 50 years of styles, and the experimenters are increasingly fringe. it's winding down and its passing is nothing to mourn.

people worshipping at the altar of classical were not in a position to accept jazz & pop as substitutes in the 1920's, the new music was a base competitor corrupting the children & leading young instrumentalists away from the higher discipline, it took another 4-5 decades before recorded pop proved itself as a 'high' art form, it really might be a while before we get some clarity on this issue, but the music being posted for free on youtube like tap water is already incredibly fascinating and the technology behind video game soundtrack composition, which is mixed in real time by the games and different every time you hear it, is already several paradigm shifts ahead of the way most of us like to think about music

but anyway SOPA can't pass and I'd be seriously surprised if PIPA does

Well, that's kinda cart before the horse territory, isn't it?

all i'm saying is that the system would be in some way based on what people actually listen to. obviously you wouldn't want to pay for bands that nobody likes

and besides that, i'm not sure what would work better.

video game soundtrack composition, which is mixed in real time by the games and different every time you hear it

like 1/2 of it is "procedural" sam's choice hans zimmer but there is some interesting stuff going on

Milton otm

like 1/2 of it is "procedural" sam's choice hans zimmer but there is some interesting stuff going on

nintendo has done some pretty amazing things along these lines, especially in games like "Mario Galaxy"

money-making opportunities created by the sale of recorded media were a small blip relative to the history of human music-making. musicians of all sorts were making a decent living long before the advent of the commercial music industry. suspect that this will continue to be true even when the sale of recordings to consumers ceases to be a big dollar engine for anyone.

when do we see the emergence of a generation of hip young artists who don't record/release anything, and instead make their music available only through their live shows?

plus Milton OTM

that's a pretty interesting take milton tho find this line curious:
by the early 1920's it was pretty clear most of the good music for that medium had already been written,

there is some truth to this though, compare everything we got from 1969-1984 to everything from 1998-present

though the real equivalent to milton's point = "everything we got from 1929-2000" in comparison with what's going on right now

^^^

it really might be a while before we get some clarity on this issue

what's your take on the french revolution nyuk nyuk

obviously you wouldn't want to pay for bands that nobody likes

i do!

I find the 'classical music has been exhausted' argument interesting. can you exhaust a genre? is there low-hanging artistic fruit that someone takes and then that's that? this is veering into new-thread territory.

xp - uh, why?

out of spite

well i was being flip abt my own musical tastes but in a more serious way this goes to the whole problem of a govt pd artist program - the nea doesnt pay for popular artists they pay for "artists of merit" however that is defined. but plenty of (republican) people would like to establish some sort of metric where popularity is the dispersal unit which would lead to guess what blando art and all the crap peeps from that shitshow on bravo would be living in cocaine castles.

idk it'd be more like guaranteed income for people who prove that they're working musicians and produce a certain quantity of work, not 'gov't bureaucrat is the new talent agent'

i think in general people are becoming more educated about what the "good stuff" is, thanks to the internet of course

obviously the Justin Bieber world is always going to exist and be hugely profitable in some capacity

So under that system, Robert Pollard would be set for life.

(xpost)

considering that we live in a country where 'subsidized medical care for poor people' is ~controversial~, yeah, we're far from something like this but the future will be a strange place

its a neat idea except for the part where it is insane and impossible

i have read quasi-scifi stuff about the future of socialism being some combo of public ownership/elimination of private ownership of intellectual property, where "producers" however defined are subsidized via tax transfers. i don't get the particulars either but it's not like iatee is making this idea up!

idk I'm sorta getting into my crazy futurist ramblings but eventually I don't think this type of thing will be limited to musicians.

xp yeah basically

well yeah it used to be called patronage but guess what it led to a separation of "high art" (classical) from low art (folk or whatever you want to call it) and the same thing would happen under this system. its a non-starter.

like betty blue hair is going to write her congressperson when she finds out i am getting government cheese for my power drill and bucket kicked down the stairs series of eps

well she won't have a job either

i think in general people are becoming more educated about what the "good stuff" is, thanks to the internet of course

― frogbs, Wednesday, January 18, 2012 3:42 PM (6 minutes ago)

smdh

yeah if u dudes arent careful im going to go ten kinds of philosophy of aesthetics on yall

So in iatee's future we will all live in an expertly designed urban megalopolis with renewable resources, but no one will have any jobs? Bleak dude, bleak.

has patronage even gone away?

not in the slightest IMO

I mean, what do you think record labels etc are but a for-profit patronage system

smdh

you really disagree with that?

well that's not really what i meant. the donor/foundation-manager/big ticket art buyer crowd aren't nobility (well not all of them) but they're pretty close

So in iatee's future we will all live in an expertly designed urban megalopolis with renewable resources, but no one will have any jobs? Bleak dude, bleak.

very few people will have jobs because computers will do most things we consider to be jobs! it's only bleak if we don't redistribute the social gains from this.

hey, while where all here: if you turn javascript off wikipedia is still perfectly visible.