Queen: Classic Or Dud

Queen II still my favorite

apolitical (and so right wing by default),

explain, plz

i mean you could level that absurd charge at 99.9999% of pop music

actually that's so close to trolling i'm not even sure it's worth chasing after. is that what dave marsh had in mind?

Dave Marsh is also the luminary who said he held Ronald Reagan "responsible" for the death of his father.

Whatever its claims, Queen isn't here just to entertain. This group has come to make it clear exactly who is superior and who is inferior. Its anthem, "We Will Rock You," is a marching order: you will not rock us, we will rock you. Indeed, Queen may be the first truly fascist rock band. The whole thing makes me wonder why anyone would indulge these creeps and their polluting ideas.

Dave Marsh was being his usual nasty self but I can't read this without laughing. I bet at least one person in Queen laughed too -- back in '79. "The first truly fascist rock band" would have been a great line to put on anyone's concert T-shirt, providing they even had a smidgen of a sense of humor.

Polluting ideas.

wow, that's ridiculous. so would marsh object to a funk band threatening to "funk you up" on similar grounds?

i mean it's hard to take anything dave marsh has written seriously after that. has he apologized for it?

"We Will Rock You," is a marching order: you will not rock us, we will rock you.

this dumbfuck has either never attended a sports game or has read too much Adorno.

if you check out google's home page today you're in for a surprise. a fucking awesome surprise.

i have a hard time understanding the vitriol this band inspired among rock critics. dave marsh, in a review of jazz (a great album IMO), called them "fascists." this seems all rather incomprehensible now. what was going on in the mid-late 1970s that made this band such an object of derision? just the theatricality? the lack of "seriousness"? were queen victims of rockism avant la lettre? or something else?

Yeah, this is a perfect example of why so much classic 70s-era rock journalism is so hard for me to relate to. It was like pop music critics really believed they were fighting some sort of ideological battle by reviewing rock albums. It's hard for me to imagine any contemporary band receiving the sort of attacks that Queen or ELP or Black Sabbath received, especially at that level of popularity.

we will rock you sounds kinda nuremberg-y

Classic, of course.

All of the albums from "Queen" to "A Day At The Races" are excellent, "Jazz" is VERY GOOD, "News Of The World" and all other albums they released aren't so good as albums - but consistently fantastic singles.

Innuendo is such a strange, fraught final bow. I think it says something that "The Show Must Go On," seen to be Mercury's farewell number, was actually written wholly by May, where Mercury's own acknowledgement was the seemingly trifling "I'm Going Slightly Mad," which apparently was his take on the frustrations of AIDS-related dementia. Leave it to him to find a way to address the subject in an intentional bout of misdirection.

The points above about the now-distant and apparently utterly deranged pop crit wars came to mind to me too after reading about the Google doodle and thinking about the band some more. I think it's interesting how the subjects which at the time were carefully obscured or relatively downplayed are now in retrospect the most absolutely compelling part of the story -- the idea that a gay/bi immigrant Parsi kid originally from Zanzibar with initial formal education in India would end up becoming this massive, iconic English-language singer seemingly designed for arenas and amplification in combination appears to be right out of fiction, and works now as both endless grist for sociological and academic studies and a fucking true to life Horatio Alger goddamn dream in an English context (and if the UK didn't have the social/art school support system in place for Mercury to fall into and work to the full, would any of it have happened as it did?). Mercury's personal shyness and ultimate stage flamboyance worked in perfect balance as well. As time passes it really becomes a 'how the hell did THIS happen?'

And a lot of the songs are just plain fun. REALLY fun. It's funny to me how "Don't Stop Me Now," just to pick the current song back in the popular consciousness a bit, feels so light and free, when back in the mid-1980s you had Little Steven-and-everyone-else's "Sun City" as the response song to Queen playing South Africa, an earnest outrage. The effect of a good Queen song is to erase both the actions of the band that are questionable at best (it's interesting to me that the two UK acts that seemed to get hit the most on the subject, Mercury-via-Queen and Shirley Bassey, both had direct African if not South African backgrounds) and to make something like "Sun City" seem like the lumpen who'd-want-to-listen-to-that-again thing it is.

Freddie's vocal on 'The Show Must Go On' never fails to astound me, really, especially during the final part of the song where he really seems to give it his all - and it's even more remarkable given the circumstances.

And a lot of their best songs work on several levels - yeah, a lot of their songs are plain fun, but they DO bear up to scrutiny - look beyond the fun and frolics, and there's a musical sophistication there.

re. sun city: the members of queen do seem to have been really politically naïve, like profoundly so. watching that recent BBC documentary reinforced that for me. playing latin america they basically allowed themselves to be used by ruling juntas in a bread/circuses way.

even in that doc and others mercury is a really elusive character. he doesn't seem to have been particularly reflective or philosophical about his own immigrant status, his gayness, etc. -- and the oddness of all his aspects merging in one person. but that just be a symptom of nobody really being able to get inside his head.

was listening to Made In Heaven yesterday - despite much of the songwriting not really being great, it's sort of heartbreaking how incredible his vocals are on that record given the circumstances. You Don't Fool Me is pretty awesome though, and sounds like it should have been on one of their records 15 years earier.

Namely 'Hot Space'.

The worst, most plodding and groove-free rhythm section EVER. And I don't know whether Roger or John was worse, I just know that the two of them together kept Queen from being a real contender.

-- Nubbelverbrennung, Tuesday, November 27, 2007 3:00 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Link

wha...?!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NsIOZDUEU6o

A mate had his library on shuffle and this kind of amazing epic electro-style track started playing. We looked and it was by Queen. I think it said the name of the song was "Fahrenheit" (not Mr Fahrenheit). Does this exist?

Man, just read that Dave Marsh passage. That guy's got to be the stupidest man on the planet.

Nice piece by Kate Mossman in the new Word about being a Queen obsessed kid in the 90s. In it, they talk about being hated by critics, but as if no one else hated them.

I despised them as a kid; partly because I hated the way the records sounded (even now, I think the sound of them - that Roy Thomas Baker production - is horrible and hollow, depsite their status as sonic masterpieces. And I can't stand Brian May's guitar tone. I remember Dorian writing somewhere about understanding why people liked Steely Dan, but finding every single sound on their records revolting, and I feel that way about Queen). But also because, like every left-leaning kid in the 80s, I thought playing Sun City was disgusting. I don't think the naivete defence cuts it: the members of Queen were much brighter than the average rock band scrote, and they must have known what they were doing. I just think they a) didn't care that much and b) thought their status would cause it all to blow over.

I think May's tone on the early records was awesome.

I don't think the naivete defence cuts it: the members of Queen were much brighter than the average rock band scrote, and they must have known what they were doing. I just think they a) didn't care that much and b) thought their status would cause it all to blow over.

you may be right and they may have simply been projecting naivete to cover their asses. but that's the way it comes across in the BBC doco.

I'm loving this song at the moment

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lQf3uTbF5Vk

Classic! I will never forget hearing We are the Champions playing loud in the casino of the Stardust Hotel as I stood waiting for a limo with my two best friends. I was wearing a strapless wedding gown and veil and everyone that went by handed me cash. Nothing under $10.That was an awesome moment!

There are two Queen songs that I loathe heartily. "Spread Your Wings" and "We Are The Champions".
Then there are several dozens of their other songs that I love a lot.
Go figure.
Yesterday listened to Jazz from start to finish, for the first time again in probably ...twenty-something years. Blimey. A very good record.

It's not a favorite song of theirs, just fit the ridiculously cheesy moment in Vegas so well. The wait for the limo lasted longer than the marriage. But I do love quite a bit of their music.

There are two Queen songs that I loathe heartily. "Spread Your Wings" and "We Are The Champions".

Really!? In a way I can understand your point of view in regards to "We Are The Champions", it's been overplayed quite a great deal and it is one of those Queen songs it's easy to get sick of. "Spread Your Wings" is a gem, though, and should have been a bigger hit than it was IMHO. Still, I'd easily take those two tracks over stuff like "Party" or some of the lesser moments on 'Hot Space'.

Yesterday listened to Jazz from start to finish, for the first time again in probably ...twenty-something years. Blimey. A very good record.

'Jazz' has aged really well, IMHO, and it's probably their most 'wacky' record overall. Where 'Queen II', 'Sheer Heart Attack' and 'A Night At The Opera' have this more controlled feeling to them, 'Jazz' seems both creative and unhinged at the same time I reckon - like they weren't trying to create a complete statement with it, rather they just took one last creative dump and moved onto more straightforward things, a la 'The Game'. Some classic tracks on it... I particularly like 'Mustapha', and 'Bicycle Race' is a musicologists wet dream.

how can anyone hate we are the champions?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Qt-Tt04NKg&feature=player_embedded

http://www.youtube.com/user/rafinha5485#p/u/2/EZy4yPup9kE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EZy4yPup9kE

Sheer Heart Attack and Queen II pretty totally "uncontrolled". Jazz an amazing record. Really, 70s record critics hating on Queen instilled lifelong distrust of music critics. and goodnight!

No-one seems to like the debut but I love it, especially the musical-about-fairies-in-three-minutes that is "My Fairy King".

in the whole they hated Sabbath, Zeppelin and Queen. what the fuck were these sick no-fun bastards listening to? jesus christ.

http://myplay.com/files/imagecache/photo_345_square/files/artist_images/billyJoel.jpg

They hated Genesis too! Springsteen was a-ok though.

Wait, which critics touted Billy Joel? It might depend on where you live. Our local papers were rock biased, Genesis and other progressive rockers might merit a lengthy discussion whether it sucked or not.

Sheer Heart Attack and Queen II pretty totally "uncontrolled". Jazz an amazing record. Really, 70s record critics hating on Queen instilled lifelong distrust of music critics. and goodnight!

― Dominique, Friday, September 16, 2011 1:43 AM (7 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I agree with this. Brighton Rock is pretty fucking unhinged, what starts out as a pop ditty turns into some noise guitar skronk. And Stone Cold Crazy is about as heavy as it gets. Even Tenement Funster is a pretty fucked up song. Those guys were smoking good shit when they made that record.

in the whole they hated Sabbath, Zeppelin and Queen. what the fuck were these sick no-fun bastards listening to? jesus christ.

^they were listening to utter crap, which suited the writing.

Sheer Heart Attack and Queen II pretty totally "uncontrolled". Jazz an amazing record. Really, 70s record critics hating on Queen instilled lifelong distrust of music critics. and goodnight!

― Dominique, Friday, September 16, 2011 1:43 AM (7 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I agree with this. Brighton Rock is pretty fucking unhinged, what starts out as a pop ditty turns into some noise guitar skronk. And Stone Cold Crazy is about as heavy as it gets. Even Tenement Funster is a pretty fucked up song. Those guys were smoking good shit when they made that record.

― You're a notch, I'm a legend (Bill Magill), Friday, September 16, 2011 1:39 PM (6 hours ago) Bookmark

I didn't mean it that way. I meant that 'Queen II' and 'Sheer Heart Attack' as albums, in spite of how 'unhinged' or 'heavy' some of the material may be, flow perfectly well from start to finish, with link tracks etc. You can really tell they paid close attention into getting those albums to feel like whole, complete things. Start-to-finish album length experiences. 'Jazz', on the other hand, feels to me to be more all over the map as an album.

No-one seems to like the debut but I love it, especially the musical-about-fairies-in-three-minutes that is "My Fairy King".

― |III|||II|||I|I||| (Matt #2), Friday, September 16, 2011 8:22 AM (12 hours ago) Bookmark

I love the first album a hell of a lot! 'Keep Yourself Alive', 'Great King Rat', 'Liar'. I love the way that 'My Fairy King' builds up into that outro section, and the way harmonies at the end of 'Doing All Right' slowly rise and rise.

A curious thing, but I miss that kind of journalism where people made ridiculous, inflated, ideological claims about rock music. Nowadays its all just commerce: then it was a matter of life and death. It never did bands like Queen any harm in the long run because people's ears won the battle in the end. But really, who cares that much about music today?

kinda sadly otm. however, the same might be said of most *music* that's being written about these days.

and further curiously, Queen were against the grain in the 70s in that they didn't really "stand for" anything obvious, in the face of what some critics might have expected/wanted. quick, someone do a critical analysis of contemporary rock bands that make big sweeping cultural-statement (or even smaller, political) kind of works, and compare their pfork average scores to bands who, say, don't!

like, what would happen if Neon Indian released a record detailing the economic crisis?

...Neon who?

Classic! I will never forget hearing We are the Champions playing loud in the casino of the Stardust Hotel as I stood waiting for a limo with my two best friends. I was wearing a strapless wedding gown and veil and everyone that went by handed me cash. Nothing under $10.That was an awesome moment!

Classic story!

Jesus christ is this actually happening?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2011/sep/20/queen-official-tribute-band

"Let's face it," Taylor told Rolling Stone magazine, "we're getting a little long in the tooth, but there are an awful lot of tribute bands, some of them good, some of them not good."

Pretty honest if you ask me! (Also: 1) this doesn't sound at all surprising for Queen, 2) KISS would be even worse at this, 3) fuck, after that Beatlemania touring thing back in the 70s all bets were off anyway.)

Still superior to touring with Paul Rodgers, I suppose.

What's with the little replicants from the Miracle video? They should be fully grown into their new identities by now.