such a fan
― ℗⎣▲✘ (ico), Tuesday, 9 August 2011 18:49 (twelve years ago) link
compare Springsteen slap at home in "Born to Run" vs "My Little Town" (leavin' nothin' but the dead and dyin')
― satan club sandwich (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 9 August 2011 18:54 (twelve years ago) link
plax otm
― horseshoe, Tuesday, 9 August 2011 19:10 (twelve years ago) link
NOTHIN' BUT THE DEAD AND DYIN' BACK IN MY LITTLE TOWN
― horseshoe, Tuesday, 9 August 2011 19:11 (twelve years ago) link
that song hits a little close to home these days
Similar degrees of authorial distance there, right? I don't think either Simon or Springsteen actually hated their hometown.
― L.P. Hovercraft (WmC), Tuesday, 9 August 2011 19:13 (twelve years ago) link
My Little Town OK haven't heard that in 35 years. Awesome song. What the hell happened to him?
― Alamac, Tuesday, 9 August 2011 19:55 (twelve years ago) link
Still making good music?
― livin in my own private Biden hole (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 9 August 2011 21:12 (twelve years ago) link
I read some Playboy interview with Simon from the 1970s where he was asked who he most admired of current songwriters, and (as Bob Dylan and Randy Newman do) took a long, uncomfortable pause trying to some up with someone, and finally he says that likes Bob Seger. Which made me realize that "Little too call, could've used a few pounds" is a total Paul Simon song-opener, height aside.
― saint dominic's p4k review (Eazy), Tuesday, 9 August 2011 21:15 (twelve years ago) link
(Jesus, I'm full of typos today.)
― saint dominic's p4k review (Eazy), Tuesday, 9 August 2011 21:16 (twelve years ago) link
I have to fuckin raise that question myself when people ask me & I'm fuckin aching to big-up underrated songwriters but interviewers just do not ask questions like that any more, like, period
― pathos of the unwarranted encore (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Tuesday, 9 August 2011 21:17 (twelve years ago) link
"when people ask me" = "when ppl interview me" I meant
I once heard a radio interview, with Peter Mulvey I think it was, where the interviewee answered questions and played his songs, but he also picked a song he most would like to have written, and they played a recording of it (it was S&G's "America)--really liked that they did that.
Hey, here is that interview--from 1984, it turns out.
I have a song on this new album called Train in the Distance. It's very factual about my life. What I discovered in writing recently is that facts, stated without color, are just potential energy. you don't know where they're going to go until you give them a direction. The song starts, "She was beautiful as Southern skies / The night he met her. She was married to someone." That's about Peggy, my first wife. And it's all true. Then it goes, "He was doggedly determined that he would get her/ He was old, he was young." That's me. I was, you know, pretending I was sophisticated. I wasn't . "From time to time, he'd tip his heart / But each time she withdrew." True, all true. All those are just facts. Then I add what is, I think, the artist's job : "Everybody loves the sound of a train in the distance / Everybody thinks it's true." That's not fact anymore. That's comment. I told a story, and then I used the metaphor. And then I thought, I don't think people are going to understand what I mean when I say, "Everybody loves the sound of a train in the distance / Everybody thinks it's true. " And I don't want to be enigmatic. So I added : "What is the point of this story? What information pertains? / The thought that life could be better is woven indelibly into our hearts and our brains." And what was my writer's point of view. That's we've survived by believing our life is going to get better. And I happened to use the train metaphor because I was sitting in a friend's house near a railway station, and I heard a train. And I said, "Oooh, that's nice." There's something about the sound of a train that's very romantic and nostalgic and hopeful. Anyway, I guess my point is that facts can be turned into art if one is artful enough.
And then I thought, I don't think people are going to understand what I mean when I say, "Everybody loves the sound of a train in the distance / Everybody thinks it's true. " And I don't want to be enigmatic. So I added : "What is the point of this story? What information pertains? / The thought that life could be better is woven indelibly into our hearts and our brains." And what was my writer's point of view. That's we've survived by believing our life is going to get better. And I happened to use the train metaphor because I was sitting in a friend's house near a railway station, and I heard a train. And I said, "Oooh, that's nice." There's something about the sound of a train that's very romantic and nostalgic and hopeful. Anyway, I guess my point is that facts can be turned into art if one is artful enough.
― saint dominic's p4k review (Eazy), Tuesday, 9 August 2011 21:27 (twelve years ago) link
gotta co-sign this, interviews are so fucking boring these days
― Richard Nixon's Field of Warmth (Shakey Mo Collier), Tuesday, 9 August 2011 21:32 (twelve years ago) link
great interview btw
― Richard Nixon's Field of Warmth (Shakey Mo Collier), Tuesday, 9 August 2011 22:10 (twelve years ago) link
that uh, Playboy one linked above
wow, I had to go away for a few days and I'm surprised to see all of the discussion that the thrown-off Cohen comment caused. But I think I can better clarify what I was getting at.
I think of Simon as coming from a Brill Building background, then moving into an interest in the folk revival, and his legacy sits kind of oddly between those two worlds. Post-Dylan, he clearly had ambitions to become Dylan's equal and I was using Cohen as an example of somebody who managed to build a somewhat underground career as a "serious" folk singer-songwriter in the Dylan mold. But Simon wrote all of these big catchy pop hits and beautiful sentimental ballads that make it difficult to separate his work from the world of Brill Building pop standards.
So which of his contemporaries would you compare him to? Neil Diamond and Billy Joel? Commercially, that makes sense, but his work seems a little more sophisticated, so in that context he would seem underrated. Nillson, Newman, Fred Neil, Van Dyke Parks? They all have had a touch of the overlooked-genius cred that Simon doesn't get, so compared to them he's underrated in a sense as well. James Taylor, Jackson Browne type singer-songwriters? They're a later generation, plus Simon towers over them imo. I don't see how he could be overrated compared to them.
And yeah, I realize the OP was a dumb troll thread, but I think it would be tough to seriously argue that Simon is overrated. Personally I don't get the love for most of the solo stuff beyond the hits, but it doesn't really seem that wildly overrated. Some people with really bad taste inexplicably dig it (joeking Simonites. put down your pitchforks) but pitchfork only ranked Graceland the 85th best album of the '80s so, you know.
He seems like one of those artists who's rated just exactly where he belongs.
― the wheelie king (wk), Wednesday, 10 August 2011 07:24 (twelve years ago) link
I assure you, I am not a troll ... .
― Alamac, Wednesday, 10 August 2011 19:37 (twelve years ago) link
Even non-trolls can start troll threads. Any thread called "I'm sorry but (___________) is so overrated" is a troll thread, imo.
― L.P. Hovercraft (WmC), Wednesday, 10 August 2011 20:30 (twelve years ago) link
So Alamac, which of his contemporaries working in a similar vein do you think are underrated compared to Simon?
― the wheelie king (wk), Wednesday, 10 August 2011 20:34 (twelve years ago) link
i assure you, i am not a troll... i just happen to live under a bridge over troubled waters.
― estela, Wednesday, 10 August 2011 20:36 (twelve years ago) link
I'm a mere collection of hearts and bones.
― a 'catch-all', almost humorous, 'Jeez' quality (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 10 August 2011 20:37 (twelve years ago) link
lol, estela, A++
― L.P. Hovercraft (WmC), Wednesday, 10 August 2011 20:40 (twelve years ago) link
alamac is a man of honor, of that i am certain
― buzza, Wednesday, 10 August 2011 20:43 (twelve years ago) link
Please define troll thread, Hovercraft.
― Alamac, Wednesday, 10 August 2011 20:51 (twelve years ago) link
hell no, I'm busy reading the rest of the internet
― L.P. Hovercraft (WmC), Wednesday, 10 August 2011 20:52 (twelve years ago) link
Well wheelie king, that is a difficult question, I would certainly say that Leonard Cohen deserves more kudos and accolades than he got. Jorma Kaukonen as well. But I would also say that James Taylor is VASTLY overrated...
― Alamac, Wednesday, 10 August 2011 20:59 (twelve years ago) link
Leonard Cohen deserves more kudos and accolades than he got
Since he began touring again in 2008, I would say Cohen has received more ecstatic reviews and plaudits than just about any other artist from his era.
― ban this sick stunt (anagram), Wednesday, 10 August 2011 21:00 (twelve years ago) link
Well, ban this, hindsight is 20/20. But was he revered at the time of his heyday? I think not.
― Alamac, Wednesday, 10 August 2011 21:05 (twelve years ago) link
in Europe he's always been revered
― ban this sick stunt (anagram), Wednesday, 10 August 2011 21:06 (twelve years ago) link
Even if this weren't true, who cares?
― a 'catch-all', almost humorous, 'Jeez' quality (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 10 August 2011 21:07 (twelve years ago) link
Cohen's never been commercially successful, but he's ALWAYS been revered
― Richard Nixon's Field of Warmth (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 10 August 2011 21:08 (twelve years ago) link
a catch-all: I don't, but someone asked.
― Alamac, Wednesday, 10 August 2011 21:13 (twelve years ago) link
i kinda remember cohen being a bit of a punchline for rock critics in the early 80s because his style of folk was very unfashionable and "dated" in that period but by the end of the decade he was back to being revered
― buzza, Wednesday, 10 August 2011 21:16 (twelve years ago) link
you're right but that was largely because he reinvented himself with I'm Your Man, which was the most direct and commercial record he'd ever made
― ban this sick stunt (anagram), Wednesday, 10 August 2011 21:21 (twelve years ago) link
also everyone loved Pump Up The Volume
― Richard Nixon's Field of Warmth (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 10 August 2011 21:23 (twelve years ago) link
All that movie needed was a scene of shirtless Leonard spinning around in an office chair.
― a 'catch-all', almost humorous, 'Jeez' quality (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 10 August 2011 21:31 (twelve years ago) link
In fact, he did his best work after the '70s!
He did most of his best work in the 70s. His very best work was done in 1983 (and late 60s if you count "Bookends"). However, what he has done since 1986 is largely a good bit overrated.
― Hongroe (Geir Hongro), Thursday, 11 August 2011 00:37 (twelve years ago) link
Paul Simon >>>>>>>>>>>> Art Garfunkel though.
― Hongroe (Geir Hongro), Thursday, 11 August 2011 00:38 (twelve years ago) link
yo i just found this and all i can say is god damn
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=46bkXgxb66E
― call all destroyer, Thursday, 11 August 2011 02:46 (twelve years ago) link
simons dork brio is otherworldly
― ice cr?m, Thursday, 11 August 2011 03:39 (twelve years ago) link
haha yes
he changed "four in the morning, crapped out, yawning" to "tapped out," which is a bummer
― horseshoe, Thursday, 11 August 2011 03:41 (twelve years ago) link
His very best work was done in 1983 (and late 60s)
Thought you meant Cohen here, 'cause I'd say that's true too.
I'd say Cohen is Yeats and Simon is Eliot.
― saint dominic's p4k review (Eazy), Thursday, 11 August 2011 03:44 (twelve years ago) link
cohen is missy and simon is elliot
― ice cr?m, Thursday, 11 August 2011 03:46 (twelve years ago) link
his early 70s longish hair w/ combover look was something to behold
― buzza, Thursday, 11 August 2011 03:46 (twelve years ago) link
cohen is e.t. and simon is eliot
― max, Thursday, 11 August 2011 03:47 (twelve years ago) link
late 70s i guess but
http://permanentplastichelmet.files.wordpress.com/2010/11/paul-simon.jpg
― horseshoe, Thursday, 11 August 2011 03:48 (twelve years ago) link
xp there it is
cohen is robert culp and simon is elliott (gould)
― horseshoe, Thursday, 11 August 2011 03:49 (twelve years ago) link
cohen is dickens and simon is eliot
― horseshoe, Thursday, 11 August 2011 03:52 (twelve years ago) link