should i give the grateful dead a chance?

Lesh didn't sing all that much, I enjoyed the few songs he wrote (esp. Box of Rain, the Eleven). I enjoy his bass playing, and it's really nice on this Cornell thing I cited to restart the thread. I like Weir's voice, but I'm definitely a Jerry guy.

I really can't stand the Velvet Underground.

i agree with bill about everything

I've never heard those words spoken in my life.

I'm too lazy to read the whole thread, but I have a bunch of friends who dig the dead for very few reasons. This being one of them:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVqArOogY-c

Even if you hate them, you have to admit, Hugh Heffner + Jerry = WTF???!

That's great stuff

Re: Phil...personally, I just really do not like his style of playing 'around' the song rather than giving it a good foundation--he noodles around in a very self-indulgent manner, as if he's just listening to himself rather than the song.

FWIW, you can hear him playing "inside" the song from '66 - '72. He didn't pick up the bass until he started w/ GD (came from a trumpet / comp / etc. background). There's a great interview out there where Lesh talks about taking 6-8 years to learn how to play "inside" the song, just to learn how to play "outside" the song. It's funny that you hear it as "self-indulgent" and "listening to himself" -- you have to listen very, VERY closely to play around the rest of the band like that. One reason I love '73/'74 stuff so much is that Godchaux and Lesh do a ton of "outside" playing, which is what gives the music that meandering quality that I love. If you're listening for patterns/grooves, you probably won't be a fan. I always thought that was one of the big draws to '77-'79 GD-- Lesh stays "inside" the songs/jams pretty regularly.

Plus, the more closely you listen, the more you hear each player reacting to another's part.

What's a better description of "inside" and "outside"? Does "inside" have something to do w/ bass players sticking to the root + fifths? Never learneded this.

Another fact that sometimes goes unnoticed is that a majority of the fans are super-familiar w/ the backbone of each song. They come to hear how the band plays off that backbone, and the band lost interest in straight-forward R&B jamming after '70 for the most part.

A couple of nice posts there, Jamesey..

it's still shit. i'm a dead hater, so sue me.

Does Dead-hating include the New Riders? Surely you can't dislike the New Riders s/t.

Dead-hating does not include The New Riders Of The Purple Sage, no.

Then there shall be a peace.

Top 5 songs sung primarily be Bob:

1) "Looks Like Rain"
2) "Jack Straw"
3) "Weather Report Suite"
4) "Estimated Prophet"
5) "Cassidy"

"Re: Phil...personally, I just really do not like his style of playing 'around' the song rather than giving it a good foundation--he noodles around in a very self-indulgent manner, as if he's just listening to himself rather than the song."

I think the thing with Lesh's bass lines is to listen how they interact with Garcia's lead guitar. The Dead was a band with some heavy harmony, as you also have a rhythm guitarist and always one keyboard player, so I don't think there was a great need for him to hang in the back on bass and hold down the root. I think Lesh's lines seem to be weaving in with Garcia and I think they did quite a bit of interplay between them. How the bass worked was one of the more unique things in the bands sound.

If you would have put Duck Dunn in the Dead, it would have worked, grooved and probably sounded good, but then again it wouldn't quite sound like 'the dead'. I think Lesh's style is as unique as say how Peter Hook's playing is in New Order, it isn't really how most bass players play but that is one of the reasons the band sounds a bit different.

otm, xp

grateful dead 4 real

mb/n

undersampled

richest textures in th 70s

i heard anyways. maybe like 1/50 pink floyd tracks

uh yeah hold down tha root

what were the intervals of jerzy garcia would YOU PREFER

were all the lyrics about. what are some good lyrics of theirs if any aren't i don't think

ban mkcaine.

otm

mkciane takin the heat off

ban sturdy banton.

i mean what are some good gd songs

sorry

were they emo or something

what's wrong

http://www.webwhispers.org/newspics/apr06/loopy.jpg

Another great Resonant Frequency from Mark Richardson, this one on the Dead. Any Deadheads have any critiques?

nope! i don't know if his choices, especially in the second list (which i think emphasizes jams more than 'psych', whatever people like to think that is), are precisely-tailored to his audience, but i don't care, either.

Gah, that harmonized guitar lick from Fire on the Mountain just popped into my head for the first time in years, and with it an image of this one stupid hippie girl with her stupid hippie facial expression and smelly dreads doing the wavey arm dance.

i mean the girl is doing the wavey arm dance, not her dreads. Well actually kind of both.

I liked the article. I would have gone with different records, and I don't think the Dead were miserable in the studio in general. But it was nice to read an enthusiastic young person on the Dead.

and the 1972 shows were by no means *just* rootsy affairs; there are some spaced-out "Dark Star"s and so on that year; that's why those shows ought to be such a gateway for people looking for those two sides of the Dead (the country-folk-blues side and the space jam side).

The Wall of SOund was a technical marvel.

st. stevens, cumberland blues, sage and spirit (flutes), box of rain, friend of the devil (slow version from Dead Set) - I can see these songs being enjoyed by people who say they don't like the grateful dead... agree, disagree, other suggestions? I like grateful dead so it's hard to choose songs. Maybe cosmic charlie?

Here's a funny little experiment to try on Grateful Dead fans:

Ask them to name more than 1 Grateful Dead song. Hardly anyone can do it.

Truckin & Dark Star?

An average show might find Jerry Garcia, about 50 lbs. overweight, wearing an XXXXL tiedye, barely moving as he played;

Garcia never wore tie-dyes. Hanes black Ts you tard.

Also:
I would have gone with different records, and I don't think the Dead were miserable in the studio in general.

Euler is on the money here. I think the Grateful Dead's rep for bad studio work comes mostly from fans who are disappointed to hear versions of the songs that are shortened/not jammed out/played in tune. While the ones he mentions are classics, I wouldn't let that steer you away from Wake of the Flood, Blues for Allah, Go to Heaven, or the others.

I'm pretty surprised that he doesn't mention Anthem of the Sun at all, since the whole live music c&p'd with Stockhausen-influenced sound-collage thing would probably go over well with Pitchforkers.

this new band the Donkeys, hyped out on Pitchfork this morning, sounds a lot like the Dead. Which is cool with me, because I like that sound. The drummer could maybe use a kick in the ass but I am digging them generally.

also yeah there's lots of good studio Dead as I've learned over the past couple of years - I think post-American Beauty, many of their albums would have made better EPs, but they would have been great EP's. "Help Is On the Way/Slipknot"/"Franklin's Tower"/"Sage & Spirit" = a 12" I would buy twice

An average show might find Jerry Garcia, about 50 lbs. overweight, wearing an XXXXL tiedye, barely moving as he played;

Garcia never wore tie-dyes. Hanes black Ts you tard.

Acutally he wore many between '70 and '72. The bio Garcia has a photo of him wearing one.

Here's a funny little experiment to try on Grateful Dead fans:

Ask them to name more than 1 Grateful Dead song. Hardly anyone can do it.

This simply isn't true, especially considering the archival nature of so many Deadheads.

this new band the Donkeys, hyped out on Pitchfork this morning, sounds a lot like the Dead. Which is cool with me, because I like that sound. The drummer could maybe use a kick in the ass but I am digging them generally.

They're pretty cool, but I agree about the rhythm section. Bands that try to get all West Coast often confuse spacey/dreamy and sleepy. I'm more impressed by the new Warmer Milks album, Soft Walks, on Animal Disguise. It's more rooted in Neil Young by way of Palace, yet it taps a similar brand of early '70s Americana. Plus, WM goes for the Dead's expansive aesthetic. There's everything from country-rock pop tunes to jammy, free-form exploration. Good stuff.

Here's a funny little experiment to try on Grateful Dead fans:
Ask them to name more than 1 Grateful Dead song. Hardly anyone can do it.
This is what the Dead Heads do to the noobs/posers to out them! Duh!

It's more rooted in Neil Young by way of Palace,

Does this mean they do the cracky-voice thing? I can't deal with that.

fwiw will oldham doesn't really do that cracky voice thing anymore and hasn't for quite awhile. he's improvdd considerably in range and polish as a singer over the years.

noted