James Blake, Mt Kimbie, CD/SD

heh i get that remixes have a certain bloggability esp when they seem to promise a certain alchemy of crosspollination b/w two seemingly incongruent aesthetics but i kindof feel like that narrative is so burnt out by early bloghouse etc that its kindof not worth talking about anymore

remixes help expand listenership and make for easy press; they're generally cheap to produce and fast to make
when your marketing budget is a shoestring, remixes make good pr sense

Maybe JB's problem isn't the remix itself but the "on spec" mechanism with which most bands/management teams solicit that stuff
i.e. do the work, the remix belongs to you, maybe we'll pay you
Which is fine for some but worthy of criticism

Owen, what's your take on remixes of your work? Do you ever regret handing over the keys to the car? Does it seem to pay dividends in any way, short term or long?

owen otm

I think he just doesn't like to spam out loads of random remixes himself. He only really does them when he's really feeling something. I bet he gets asked to do loads and isn't into doing a bag of them for the sake of it. Same prob goes for other people remixing him.

I'm loathe to defend blake but I definitely think in the last five years or so it feels like the majority of great remixes, edits, what have you, have been productions driven by the remixing artist - e.g. Schwarz doing Bill Withers, yeah, but more generally really deliberate match-ups between dance artists of similar sensibilities on, say, two track vinyl releases - as opposed to the tradition of labels commissioning a bunch of remixers.

Seems to me like the last great mainstream remixers was JLC. The early-to-mid-00s was an awesome time for that in general.

Dubstep/post-dubstep have never really had a proper remix culture either, some unofficial remixes yeah (was it Goth-Trad who did that ace Erykah Badu remix?) but I can't even think of any examples of, say, Hessle Audio putting out a remix (though there may be). So it's kind of gone straight from no remixes to people like Joker, Skream, Rustie, Blake etc being asked to do remixes for major label releases... There's a lot of these at the moment, and the only one that seems to have taken on a life of its own in any big way is the Le Roux remix (ew).

The two sides sort of come together in the sense that electro-house was a great form for teasing out an original song's qualities (very extended mix-y) whereas it's very hard to do a remix in a dubstep or post-dubstep style that doesn't sound just like that. Nothing wrong with that but I could imagine the process becoming frustrating - ironically, given Blake's current style this probably wouldn't apply to him! The complaint seems odd coming from in particular.

uk funky is pretty good at the "commissioning multiple remixes" thing (see e.g. Addictive's "Domino Effect") but, of course, not if you're talking dollars. But again funky is a form fairly sympathetic to songfulness.

Dubstep/post-dubstep have never really had a proper remix culture either

idk i'd disagree with this - can think of a ton of great remixes by ikonika (who's managed to successfully carve out a remixing style that's quite distinct from her own material, pretty varied from track to track, but still recognisably her), and reworking mainstream hits is a huge thing (think brenmar, kingdom, the cassie remix compilation etc).

and in terms of label-commissioned remixes, uk funky producers from crazy cousinz and geeneus through to ill blu and funkystepz have done amazing stuff in that format.

I don't think there has been as big a remix thing as there has been in say electro in... dubstep/post-dubstep... until recently at least. There have been a good amount of remixes but even last year I was finding it hard to pick up on that many that really stood out or had been done. Its just not much of a thing for now. A load of labels/artists will keep doing that no doubt others will push it as far as it'll go cos its good promo and kind of fun to get others involved on your releases. I doubt James Blake will be making remix fodder anytime soon. But you'll sure hear a million Skream remixes, maybe Joker if he goes for it this year... or even a load of the night slugs peeps doing epic amounts. Its just the way they roll. Sometimes it makes for good listening a lot of the time its doesn't its just quality control innit. There is a fine line between blog fodder and good promo though... I just hope post-dubstep peeps walk it fine as they get more hype.

Lex my post was specifically distinguishing between unofficial and official remixes. Kingdom et al specialize in the former really.

Plus yeah I'd already agreed re funky.

u 2

Peak-era electrohouse still feels like the greatest ever period for the pop or indie remix.

Whereas the most annoying thing about dubstep at the moment are the endless dubsteppisations of popular tunes. It's getting like the late-90s when there had to be a ska-punk version of absolutely any hit song ever recorded.

The blaring dubstep Laura Marling remix I heard the other day was so ridiculous as to be beyond the point of self-parody.

Every so often someone posts one of these things up on Facebook and it's kinda LOL the first time until you realise all these remixes are exactly the same. I guess that's just what's always happened in dance music.

xpost there is not a Laura Marling dubstep remix, surely? How severe.

There is a dubstep remix of everything if you just type it into youtube with the word dubstep at the end. There is a whole shitty lolyoutubedubstepremixlol culture on there and its horrible. I like to think its a seperate thing to the rest of the scene since you never hear it in clubs or outside of either youtube or people making fun of it on forums haha

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTIKbUXV7RU

Oh my...

There is a whole shitty lolyoutubedubstepremixlol culture on there and its horrible

I had noticed this but I hadn't realised the extent and horror of it. "Dubstep Snowman" made me want to avoid Youtube for the rest of my life.

DO NOT CLICK UNLESS YOU WANT TO WITNESS THE NADIR OF WESTERN CULTURE

oh god. i can't listen to that at work and i'm kinda glad.

http://mostlyjunkfood.com/treats/2010/12/home-alone.png

That. Is. Horrific.

I only noticed this 'phenomenon' today and now it's seemingly everywhere and I already want it to stop.

You know what the funniest thing about lolyoutubedubsteplol is though...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtlluJjApYM

That kind of thing happens.

Does it seem to pay dividends in any way, short term or long?

I don't know about dividends.
Remixes are a nice way to celebrate a single or album's release by giving some money to a friend/musician you think is really talented
At least, that's my take on it, the way I play it
If I were James Blake and got a remix request, I'd check my schedule and ask for at least 2K

if i may interrupt the ridiculous daily mail style 'oh im just so outraged!' outburts, yeah blake sounds like a rockist with his 'ray charles didnt need remixes' attitude, but erm, this is a guy whos done quite a lot of remixing of pop hits he likes for his own bootlegs, so hes hardly someone who believes in the definitive purity of the original. and hes right, most remixes these days you get from dubstep/whatever producers/remixers on major labels are pointless or just a really bad fit. nothing new of course, but nothing that good either. you just get the song retooled tick-box-style for diff genres.

dubstep is a bit more about the definitive original than most dance genres i would say, they are pretty strict about just getting anyone to put out remixes of their stuff (its more about stuff like kode 9 remixing skeng where its remixes by someone close who understands the music, and as an aside, thats a remix which blake has played in sets), but even taking into account blakes part of/not part of membership of the scene, theres been great stuff like coki's richie spice remix so i doubt hes that divorced from dance culture, sorry guys. he doesnt like remixing for remixing sake but i doubt he hears a great remix and immediately thinks 'sacrilege!'

*outbursts

otm titch.

I've heard Blake DJ a few times and he defo loves and plays remixes haha He may have even played that Coki remix you mention, he loves a bit of Coki.

He's just not into remixes for the sake of remixes, I mean is anyone apart from wanky labels trying to squeeze every inch of life out of something until it breaks? Oh and blogs...

I think the main problem, and Blake might be referring to this, is that things like online remix competitions are becoming huge promotional bandwagons for labels. hundreds of demos will be submitted with one winner gets chosen while the track receives loads of hype and attention. Record labels win, nearly everyone else loses while a glut of terrible tracks flood the internet.

maybe. but really he just doesnt see the point in remixes for remixes sake. i mean, really, is that THAT controversial or damning? seems like hes just stating the obvious. i mean, i actually prefer a lot of ukg remixes of R&B songs from that period to the originals, but a lot of the best ones were just bootlegs made by the producers off their own backs (iirc), something i think still holds true for funky or dubstep or grime (maybe house and techno too , i dont know). maybe some (insert genre) djs like having shit (insert genre) remixes of a shit chart tune just to please the punters in some town centre pub late on a sat night and i can def see the purpose there - you want stuff thats going to work in your selection - but its hardly great stuff and its what leads to things like amy winehouse getting dubstep remixes! someone like blake who has a bit of integrity (yes rofl etc etc) is obv only going to be in favour of remixes that are more than just dj-set/cd single filler (fwiw im not a fan of many of his remixes - the lil wayne one removed everything that made the original so good.

(response to dog latin - jimi otm)

the ~remixes 4 cash~ structure can still provide great stuff though - ill blu, funkystepz and crazy cousinz prove it more than any dubstep producer though - and obv even ~labour of love~ remixes can be shit. and that's always been the case, how many classic house remixes were done for £££ or at a label's behest? it doesn't really make sense to slag off anything so sweepingly. obviously tons of shit, uninspired remixes do the rounds, as ever, but imo they're relatively harmless - it's rare that the really rote stuff gets a great deal of airplay or attention, and if it earns some producers money that they may not necessarily get off their own tunes, that's not a bad thing.

Y'see, I actually like artists to have strong opinions about stuff. I enjoy a bit of purist dogma every now and then.

yeah, its much better than artists being so fucking reasonable all the time, agreed. just cos someones a 'dance' producer doesnt mean he cant be a raving rockist. but fair point, lex. the dj q remix of dizzees flex was fabulous and no doubt just a case of XL trying to get some bassline action.

Cynical commissioning can produce some great remixes if the combination is right but I can see why someone would think, fuck this. I bet some of the artists who have approached Blake would make Lex's hair curl.

aww yeahh i'd forgotten that remix! so good.

pretty sure carl craig remixing siobhan donaghy and armand van helden on sneaker pimps/tori amos back in the day were label-driven too - and i've interviewed several producers who are known for their remix work (henrik schwarz and tensnake spring to mind) and they've just shrugged their shoulders and gone "i just remix whoever rings up and offers to pay".

xp

i guess some remixers prefer to see cynical remixes-4-cash of horrific artists as a challenge? that, or just grit your teeth and work out how much you need the money - i don't have a fit of the vapours when i need to do some corporate copy to pay the bills innit.

blake will give in soon enough i reckon. its ok for him right now cos his name is riding high (even if his bank balance isnt) but in a while, once its no longer important for him to establish his cred, hell prob think 'oh fuck it' and remix some bullshit fearne cotton favourites. i dont really see it as being THAT sinful. i remember reading some factmag review of jokers tron, saying that joker wasnt that special anymore as his recent remixes were a bit shit, but i mean, you sort of expect them to be dont you?! you cant hold a producer known for his own work to the standard of his jobsworth remixes! (obv when i was in my teens and buying anything dj premier remixed i wd have disagreed but those days have long gone thank god)

I know the old idea of the "sell out" is dead but t's getting pretty fucked up when a musician is actually being attacked for declining to do hack work for cash. No disrespect to those who do that work, and who make a great job out of it, but come on.

well music fans are boring realists these days.

a musician is actually being attacked for declining to do hack work for cash

i'm not attacking him for this! if he doesn't need the £££ and doesn't want to do the work, more power to him. i'm criticising him for dismissing the whole exercise like he did, w/o acknowledging that a) great music can result from the process, b) even if it doesn't, other producers might not be as lucky he obviously is financially.

http://991.com/newgallery/Aphex-Twin-26-Mixes-For-Cash-234844.jpg

James Blake made 2 good EP's and one incredibly shit album. This guy will be remixing for cash in less than 3 years, right after his 2nd album flops.

has a hyped artist ever been as dreary as this? watching him "perform" on the culture show just now was like having the life slowly leached out of you over the course of five minutes.

still love this album, but i lolled at too much time on ilx moment

...ubiquitous pop critic Christopher R. Weingarten tweeted: “LOST: JAMES BLAKE’S BALLS. CANNOT OFFER CASH REWARD BUT CAN OFFER CRED POINTS.”

http://newyork.timeout.com/music-nightlife/music/984127/james-blake#ixzz1GEN10egg

ugh websites that autoplay full screen adverts are the worst. why why why was that permitted to happen.

I think there should be a slightly higher standard for describing a backlash than two jokey tweets. It's not even clear that Geoff Barrow meant Blake (the tweet seems to fit but he denies it). Not to say that there isn't a backlash but I don't like this new journalistic habit of quoting tweets as if they carry significant weight.

i've always disliked the term "backlash" anyway - in most cases it's, like, some critics like a thing, and others dislike it - this happens all the time and is not notable. and obviously those who like it got to hype it first! a true "backlash" should be when the same people who previously praised an artist turn against him/her.

and if the people crying "backlash" had actually paid attention they'd have known that there were people saying blake wasn't all that, like, 6 months ago. and the kanye album didn't have a "backlash" either, the same people who disliked it had done so from the off.

OTM. It's a lazy, annoying, usually meaningless angle.