2010 Magazine's Albums Of The Year Thread For Posting Lists and Discussion

the metal picks are great

There's another band called On?

Who said anything about comprehensive? Let's talk about what's possible. There are some people who do nothing but read or watch tv every waking hour. It's difficult to do anything else while doing those things, other than, say, eat. At least with music you can do housework, walk, run, bike, drive, work, write, read, cook, make love, even doze or nap and let the music marinate in your subconsciousness. Heck, when I was in college and injured during cross country, there were underwater speakers in the pool. I could pop in a tape and listen to music while I swam!

This was me about ten years ago in terms of 'always listening to something' -- as time passed, this is far less true, though I have access to a huge amount of music now as we all do. I've gently refocused my direct attention into other areas of life while still maintaining my interest and my goal to write about what I like as I do. Not everyone will take my path, obviously, but I'm not going to write off the opinions of others who aren't on that wavelength -- I mean, c'mon.

(FWIW -- I haven't heard the new Kanye album yet in full and I'm not in an immediate rush to do so; if that invalidates my thoughts then hey, I can't change your mind, can I?)

Since we are talking about "comprehensive listening" and all that, I'll add that my electronic and world listening were a little slimmer than usual in 2010 and it def shows on my top 100. Though lots of world ish (King Sunny Ade, Red Baraat, Brass Menažeri Balkan Brass Band) just missed the cut

Did anybody on ILX successfully change anybody's mind about anything in 2010?

xp

One wonders.

I think Geir put some people off some white boys with guitars

One example is Nine Inch Nails' Pretty Hate Machine, which I've been thinking about as I've listened to the reissue several times this past week. I remember being annoyed by some reviews that treated it as this revolutionary album that came out of nowhere, and was completely ignorant of the context it came out of -- Killing Joke, Coil, KMFDM, even The The and Big Black. Bad criticism.

how familiar are u w/ millenial-era hip hop that kanye was working with, jay-z's dynasty, kanye's work for beanie sigel, the roc a fella philly/ny axis in general, no i.d. and the chicago scene kanye came from, the ruff ryders / tunnel stuff that kanye's soul steez was a reaction to? just wondering

It has major flaws, but did make my top 200. But I feel that a lot of the critics that gave it a perfect 5 stars or 10 or whatever were seriously missing the bigger picture. Like some of them have maybe listened to less than even a few albums a month. Less than three weeks later, Diddy/Dirty Money released a better album. Yet it's been relatively ignored. Perhaps it was easier to skip it than acknowledge that just maybe the Kanye album wasn't so perfect. Some may say this example is flawed because of deadlines and release dates. Weren't promos released of the Diddy album a few weeks in advance? It should have been enough time for most poll deadlines.

do u really think that even 10% of the critics fawning over kanye would have smacked themselves in the forehead and gone 'i cant believe i missed this!' about a diddy record? i prefer the diddy lp but my values are difft than most critics

i agree w/ the importance of being knowledgeable, but i disagree w/ the idea that being knowledgeable is a simple matter of quantity

like, discernment is a more critical skill, imo

Personally I just can't relate to not having the compulsion to hear the Kanye album, as annoying as some of the hype is about it. I just have a preference for writers who have that compulsion.

i could get not having that compulsion if you weren't interested in hip-hop. or pop. or hadn't enjoyed anything in kanye's career before. or hated the pre-album material so much that you just plain didn't want to hear the album.

Less than three weeks later, Diddy/Dirty Money released a better album. Yet it's been relatively ignored. Perhaps it was easier to skip it than acknowledge that just maybe the Kanye album wasn't so perfect. Some may say this example is flawed because of deadlines and release dates. Weren't promos released of the Diddy album a few weeks in advance? It should have been enough time for most poll deadlines.

haha major label promos released a few weeks in advance of release? in our dreams. i officially haven't received mine yet (its uk release date is this month). but yeah i would like more critics to interrogate why they choose to listen to the albums they do, because i'm pretty sure the decision to listen to kanye but not diddy/dirty money was a pretty common one, and would have been regardless of release dates. i'd actually guess that most critics i know - even the ones on this very thread talking about how many albums they've heard - haven't bothered with half of my 2010 favourites. (fastnbulbous and whiney, did you hear the fantasia, k michelle, ikonika, ciara, busy signal, guido, dj nate, tracey thorn, ellen allien, we love and laura marling albums?)

One of the benefits you get with listening to a lot of music, is the skill of getting a lot out of the first few listens. It takes practice, and some are better than others, but yes, it is possible to form an intelligent, thorough analysis based on as few as three listens.

actually this is true - i've definitely been able to train myself to listen closely enough to write about something on v few listens, it just takes concentration. obv it's not ideal but it's how this business actually works if you're making a living from it - tim w/all due respect, i don't think you can really ask any professional critic to opt for listening to 4 albums 200 times over 200 albums 4 times.

i agree w/ the importance of being knowledgeable, but i disagree w/ the idea that being knowledgeable is a simple matter of quantity

it isn't, but it's not unconnected - how do you feel about all those indie rock critics who vote for kanye or big boi or whoever as their token hip-hop lp, and blithely proclaim it the best hip-hop release of the year, when they obviously haven't bothered to listen to any other rap albums?

i could get not having that compulsion if you weren't interested in hip-hop. or pop. or hadn't enjoyed anything in kanye's career before. or hated the pre-album material so much that you just plain didn't want to hear the album.

this is ridiculous. i'm not especially interested in post-dubstep or whatever, but if every single critic in every single magazine was unanimously saying that "Ramadanman" was the most amazing record of the year, you bet I'd want to hear it.

A guy I worked with at the beginning of the decade was heavily involved in the Chicago scene and gave me plenty of mixes and CDrs of that stuff, and Kanye's productions. I wasn't into it enough that I remember it all, but if I were to review the Kanye album, I'd probably revisit a lot of it.

A guy I worked with at the beginning of the decade was heavily involved in the Chicago scene and gave me plenty of mixes and CDrs of that stuff, and Kanye's productions. I enjoyed them, but wasn't deep into it enough that I remember it all, but if I were to review the Kanye album, I'd certainly revisit a lot of it.

do u really think that even 10% of the critics fawning over kanye would have smacked themselves in the forehead...

Nope, I don't. Many won't bother to hear it, others won't want to even admit it could possibly even be close to as good as the Kanye, let alone better, after they gave the Kanye a perfect rating.

"Oh Pitchfork and Vibe and Time and People and Stereogum and Spin and Rolling Stone all say this is the greatest record of the year... eh, I'm not into pop."

this is ridiculous. i'm not especially interested in post-dubstep or whatever, but if every single critic in every single magazine was unanimously saying that "Ramadanman" was the most amazing record of the year, you bet I'd want to hear it.

whiney i was kinda being sarcastic! but yeah i could imagine if you're some uber-specialist reviewer of world music or whatever, yeah, why would you care about kanye? i don't think that really applies to anyone here though.

whiney-- great list.

you really want that data dump you talked about upthread?

though having said that, i never bothered to hear lcd soundsystem's latest - though i did hear the single, which is partly WHY i don't want to hear any more - and i don't think its acclaim is a reason to change that. actually the acclaim is the other reason i don't want to hear it.

First italicized paragraph was supposed to be -

how familiar are u w/ millenial-era hip hop that kanye was working with, jay-z's dynasty, kanye's work for beanie...

indie rock critics who vote for kanye or big boi or whoever as their token hip-hop lp, and blithely proclaim it the best hip-hop release of the year, when they obviously haven't bothered to listen to any other rap albums?

^^^this is otm. and happens for metal/world/electronic/dubstep every year

ilxor, i would be honored

it isn't, but it's not unconnected - how do you feel about all those indie rock critics who vote for kanye or big boi or whoever as their token hip-hop lp, and blithely proclaim it the best hip-hop release of the year, when they obviously haven't bothered to listen to any other rap albums?

― lex diamonds (lex pretend), Monday, January 3, 2011 1:02 PM (8 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

we could probably ask them, since some of them are arguing with me in this thread lol

i'm more asking you whether you think they should listen to more rap!

i certainly think that the critics who only listened to janelle monáe and no other r&b releases should listen to a LOT more r&b

(which is sort of my point ... this celebration of 'quantity' isnt nearly as equitable as it pretends to be ... it professes some sort of superior awareness but can be just as blind to its own biases as a dude who hears 40 albums in one year)

this is ridiculous. i'm not especially interested in post-dubstep or whatever, but if every single critic in every single magazine was unanimously saying that "Ramadanman" was the most amazing record of the year, you bet I'd want to hear it.

― darwin deej (Whiney G. Weingarten), Monday, January 3, 2011 1:04 PM (8 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

this is exactly why these lists end up being an echo chamber type deal, dude

^^yeah i'd agree with that - even if you're listening to 200 albums per year you're going to have to self-select to an extent and you're going to overlook stuff beloved by other critics

xp to deej re: blind spots

fantasia, k michelle, ikonika [#279], ciara, busy signal, guido [#230], dj nate, tracey thorn, ellen allien [#182], we love and laura marling [#73]

I put in brackets where the ones were ranked in my list above. I heard We Love and Ciara, but they didn't make it. I should listen to them again. I just do this for fun ;)

xxxp

tim w/all due respect, i don't think you can really ask any professional critic to opt for listening to 4 albums 200 times over 200 albums 4 times.

maybe this is part of the argument we're having too? practically those who are getting paid to write need to listen to a couple hundred/thousands of album per year because that is their full-time job. but again, is this because there's something inherently valuable in 'more' or because they have the opportunity to listen to more.

it isn't, but it's not unconnected - how do you feel about all those indie rock critics who vote for kanye or big boi or whoever as their token hip-hop lp, and blithely proclaim it the best hip-hop release of the year, when they obviously haven't bothered to listen to any other rap albums?

I feel that they definitely haven't listened to enough to proclaim something the best hip-hop release of the year, but if this is what we are arguing about then we aren't TALKING about what makes someone a good critic, we're arguing about what makes someone qualified to talk about a specific genre or niche! and again, i'd quibble with the discourse of 'best'. Or at least argue that the entire ridiculous venture of 'ordered lists of the BEST of the year' is the real culprit here, not some ideal type of music critic.

it's not the 'best' albums of the year. it's that person's favourite albums of the year. and if we were able to talk about lists like that instead of being such /guys/ about it then maybe the focus on end-of-year wrap ups would be more about interesting things that slipped under the radar, and selling each other on the merits of our personal favourites rather than arguing and complaining about whether something really merits #34 vs. #38 on a god damn list.

like, choosing what to listen to is as much about choosing what NOT to listen to as it is deciding you're going to focus in a certain area. why should i care what critics are celebrating in the world of dubstep if that genre as a whole has little interest to me? some kind of dilletantish faux-knowledge? in an era where there are critics going in depth to discuss that genre, why front authority about ramadanman being the best of a genre i dont listen to?

"Lots of critics liking something" is not a particularly reliable yardstick, hasn't been for decades.

i mean, i think outsider perspectives can be valuable, but if your outsider perspective is 'agree with what every other critic has picked as the token representative of this genre,' then it barely qualifies as an outsider perspective

i think what im arguing here tho is that the generalist approach trying to cover a multitude of genres w/ some sort of 'objectivity' is an increasingly anachronistic style of criticism

or maybe im just saying its not very interesting to me.

deej, i'm saying yes it's ok to ignore "oh hai we like James Blake now" flubstep shit, but to purposefully ignore a pop movement like kanye is intentional contrarianianism

i agree that "well-rounded" is increasingly anachronistic businesswise, but I still think it's more honorable to be a well-rounded culture critic like Ann Powers or Caramanica than some uk funky otaku.

i guess tim will have to answer that accusation himself, but it seems to me that the kanye record is pretty irrelevant to his worldview / style of criticism

isn't tim a pop critic?

i dunno i thought u just said he was a uk funky otaku

i wasn't talking about Tim, I was just making some critic up

hes the one who said he wasnt gonna listen to kanye tho

well it was a coincidence

ilxor just emailed me his breakdown of my top 100 <3

it isn't, but it's not unconnected - how do you feel about all those indie rock critics who vote for kanye or big boi or whoever as their token hip-hop lp, and blithely proclaim it the best hip-hop release of the year, when they obviously haven't bothered to listen to any other rap albums?

― lex diamonds (lex pretend), Monday, January 3, 2011 1:02 PM (8 minutes ago)

this is true & accurate etc. but it's wrong to assume these ppl haven't listened to more than big boi/kanye just because they end up putting one of these on top. i mean, i'm not a critic/writer of any type, just an enthusiastic listener who posts on ilx. i heard at least 25-30 hip-hop albums in 2010. and big boi tops my list. it doesn't mean i didnt bother to listen to any other hip-hop, it means that big boi put out the best album i heard, of 2-3 dozen.

hahah xp <3 back at ya

some uk funky otaku

Tim F. can this plz be yr display name?

this is true & accurate etc. but it's wrong to assume these ppl haven't listened to more than big boi/kanye just because they end up putting one of these on top. i mean, i'm not a critic/writer of any type, just an enthusiastic listener who posts on ilx. i heard at least 25-30 hip-hop albums in 2010. and big boi tops my list. it doesn't mean i didnt bother to listen to any other hip-hop, it means that big boi put out the best album i heard, of 2-3 dozen.

― slouching, unshaven, thick-necked, unstylish, pig-eyed (ilxor), Monday, 3 January 2011 20:02 (48 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

yeah I was gonna say, not sure I've actually seen much or any of the blithe proclaiming being decried here

I don't doubt that there are plenty of indie-rock specialists or other types of critics who don't listen to much hip-hop who will vote for the Kanye record, but I think it's pretty shaky to assume that one album from a particular genre on a Top Ten list (i.e., PnJ ballot) is a "token" pick. Ten is a small number of records and if you're even a quasi-generalist critic you're gonna have some genres land only one album on a Top Ten and sometimes (maybe often) have genres you care about not land any.

For me, I'd say my core listening (maybe 80%) is rock/hip-hop/country, with heavier pop and R&B listening for singles and somewhat lighter pop/R&B for albums. And then some decent dabbling in Afropop, folk/blues, and more song-oriented dance/techno/whatever stuff. Sometimes a modern jazz or reggae or Latin record or whatever will enter my life in some meaningful way, but not often. And I pretty much never listen to hard metal.

Make of that what you will, but I've had years when I've had one hip-hop album on my PnJ ballot. Two this year, three last year, sometimes one. Hip-hop has been a core part of my listening as long as I've listened to music, since buying the first Run-D.M.C. on cassette and Whodini and U.T.F.O. on 45. But guess what, you can listen to a lot of hip-hop (or any other genre) and still only find one (or zero) albums that would crack your 10 faves. So what. I've got three country records this year. Some years one. Some years none. So what.

And there seems to be an implication that being more generalist is a career strategy or about trying to duplicate the critical consensus (the consensus is often right, and also often wrong) or whatever. Which is silly. For most people I know who listen to and are interested in different types of music, it's natural. It's an outgrowth of being interested in culture broadly. The combination of pluralism and intimacy is the best thing about pop music. Being interested in different kinds of music is an outgrowth of being interested in different types of people.

Write about what you want, but only caring about one specialized genre or musical subculture is some Trekkie stuff to me.

are we predicting BLANK for the P&J this year (Beach House/LCD/Arcade Fire/National/Kanye)?

1. Kanye
2. Arcade
3. Monae

is my guess, but I'm probably over-estimating the Monae.