2010 Magazine's Albums Of The Year Thread For Posting Lists and Discussion

But gangsta rappers were crossing over back then weren't they? Not even just Biggie and Pac ad Jay-Z but like 3-6 and Master P and Bone Thugs were being listened to and maybe even bought by the '90s equivalent of 'Coldplay fans'. And if gangsta rap isn't reaching those audiences as well anymore--the audiences that still buy albums--I mean, isn't that the definition of a niche market?

― Ned Rag & the Evil Olive Gardens (Drugs A. Money), Thursday, December 30, 2010 2:43 PM (51 seconds ago) Bookmark

i dont really think that they were, no. ime ppl checking u2 records in the late 90s werent fucking w/ rap music. aside from huge huge names like snoop & 50 cent you didnt have that kind of crossover. master p was, despite selling millions and millions of albums, a pretty underground media phenomenon, and middle-aged moms in hoffman estates werent copping their records like they are kanye's now

xp i'm pretty sure my two paragraphs up above do not anywhere add up to 'zing'

('sgood though...)

he was talking about me zinging seether, who i knew nothing about

will smith, actually, they were buying

oh right on

I think it's a p. broad generalization to say that W. Smith is the only rapper that older-ish white rock/pop fans were digging...

(in the 90s)

I knew plenty of people in college in the late 90s that were listening to stuff like Beck and No Doubt as WELL as No Limit shit.

yah but i mean kanye has long passed that crowd -- hes a straight up household name thats like ... snoop dogg, 50 cent ... who else? maybe dr. dre at one point.

im saying that rather than going thru the ranks of rap fans into that crowd, since that crowd is who still moves units, a lot of these rappers are just skipping traditional rap fans altogether & going straight for the joe 12 cd one -- not talking about dudes who liked beck AND no limit

"new york is not the center of the universe"

totally is if you like pizza. and hot fashion models. and rats.

hopefully the rats do not live in the pizza place.

I was going to suggest the suburban moms were buying Lauryn Hill.

im saying that rather than going thru the ranks of rap fans into that crowd, since that crowd is who still moves units, a lot of these rappers are just skipping traditional rap fans altogether & going straight for the joe 12 cd one -- not talking about dudes who liked beck AND no limit

this seems a bit flimsy and ill-thought out--who does this apply to? drake? kanye (kind of)? certainly doesn't apply to wayne (who kind of invented the new paradigm) or eminem or even t.i., though he hasn't released a major-label album in 2 years and so prolley doesn't apply at all to this conversation (yes I know you didn't say 'lol @ talking about 'album sales' in 2008')

also seems to me that 12 cd ppl would the first ones to quit spending money, since they'd have all their needs met with a combination of Livewire and Youtube...

maybe not the suburban moms or the swinging Hangover-type thirtysomethings blasting Kanye on their commute home...

lil wayne t.i. and jay-z are all street rappers -- all three of whom crossed over to that audience to sell more (t.i. the least successfully)

rappers now who 'actually sell' albums either aim for that audience & sell units (BOB) or dont, and dont (yo gotti)

I was going to suggest the suburban moms were buying Lauryn Hill.

― The Reverend, Thursday, December 30, 2010 3:10 PM (14 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

this is otm -- weirdly a (superior, but) strangely similar record to Drake's in its split-the-difference approach to rap & R&B

also seems to me that 12 cd ppl would the first ones to quit spending money, since they'd have all their needs met with a combination of Livewire and Youtube...

― Ned Rag & the Evil Olive Gardens (Drugs A. Money), Thursday, December 30, 2010 3:23 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

who do u think is buying cds? serious question

another question, if anyone can find a source -- id love to know how many cds were sold in 2010 vs. 2000

xp the suburban moms or the swinging Hangover-type thirtysomethings blasting Kanye on their commute home...

actually I have no idea...I'm pretty sure a lot of casual music fans I have come across though are downloading 9/10ths of the music in their possession.

just wanted to point out that chariot choogle has been OTM in this thread

lol that xp was to answer deej's question about who is buying CDs

but srsly my answer is those with enough disposable income...

all the HARDCORE MUSIC OBSESSIVES that Drugs A Money knows are the ones buying Susan Boyle CDs

but srsly my answer is those with enough disposable income...

a demographic which is skewing even older and whiter than usual lately

point made.

A couple Bachar Mar-Khalife track's. The whole album is not as proggy as this first track, and the second one here is best at the end. I don't completely love the distorted vocals on it, but they are okay, I guess:

Bachar mar-Khalifé - Distance
Bachar mar-Khalifé - Distance

(I wish they would have posted "Democratia.")

all the HARDCORE MUSIC OBSESSIVES that Drugs A Money knows are the ones buying Susan Boyle CDs

#1 on my list

(actually it was the fact that the article mentioned her that struck my ire in the 1st place and led me to say 'right on deej'. I wasn't even thinking about illegal downloads/Youtube hits/last.fm at all; I was just annoyed that the author seemed to want to see Boyle and BEP at the top of these lists...)

though, if you want to talk about Youtube hits...

drugs & rev have already nailed this shut, but since i already typed it out:

I'm pretty sure a lot of casual music fans I have come across though are downloading 9/10ths of the music in their possession.

― Ned Rag & the Evil Olive Gardens (Drugs A. Money), Thursday, December 30, 2010 1:30 PM (42 seconds ago) Bookmark

understanding that anecdotal experience is just that, perhaps meaningless in any larger sense, i have found that most seattle people in my "crowd" (largely white, middle class, indie culture 20-to-40-somethings, passive to avid music fans) buy music. they buy a lot of it. and they're kind of uncomfortable, a lot of them, with the idea of illegally downloading it. i buy a lot of music myself, but i also steal audition it, and i think i'm more rare in that than those among my peers who pay for most everything they listen to. this attitude, and the relative affluence behind it, is part of the culture, my culture.

but i'm kind of old, thus isolated, out of touch with younger fans and music cultures. wouldn't be at all surprised to learn that kids are much more likely to steal music than to buy it, or that things are different in other demographic niches. it's probably true, however, that if thug rap was (still?) crossing over to my peer group, it'd be selling more.

i said it before but you really can't underestimate the normal/average people casual/impulse starbucks/best buy/walmart/etc $7.99 ON SALE! purchases that people make. cuz people still buy stuff like that all the time. and thats a big chunk of album sales too, i'll bet. most people don't even walk into chain or non-chain music stores unless they are fanatics. lots of casual folks buy CDs at the drugstore and the convenience store. along with DVDs and large bottles of yoo hoo.

(largely white, middle class, indie culture 20-to-40-somethings, passive to avid music fans)

this is still just a fraction of like "white 20-to-40-somethings," let alone the rest of americs

oh yeah, no doubt, not claiming to speak for anything but my small circle of friends

my world of people

vinyl selection at this best buy (wherever it is) is kinda cool

http://theonlinephotographer.typepad.com/.a/6a00df351e888f883401348896f76e970c-800wi

and more astutely curated then the newbury comix store near me. as far as nostalgia/impulse vinyl buying goes.

continuing...

but i do think that the group i'm speaking for (and other vaguely similar groups, a cluster of overlapping circles) buys a LOT of music and, in seattle at least, drives the city's most visible music culture. what they're interested in gets played on KEXP, gets booked at sasquatch and other high-profile festivals, gets prominent display in high-traffic stores, sells. sucks that it's mostly the arcade fire and the national or whatever, but i'd think they'd be an attractive target audience for anyone wanting to actually, you know, make money via music sales.

I went to Best Buy and they were selling Rihanna's Loud on vinyl for $40 (FORTY DOLLARS). I was thinking to myself "who the hell would pay that much for that," and then two girls passed by me, saw it, and were like "OOH I WANT THAT"

xxp Yeah, I would totally cop some Pac & Bad Brains vinyl if they were in front of me and the right price.

(Oops, second link I posted was for Marée Noire. scott seward, I think you would like those Bachar Mar-Khalife tracks.)

Haha so much for "the right price".

shocked that vinyl display is at best buy.

not so shocked b/c everything there is at least $30

it is a pretty great little pocket lesson on how to sell vinyl to best buy shoppers

It doesn't look too difficult after all.

i listened to that thing you like, Rudi the Rockist. i don't know what to make of it yet. i will listen again. kinda liked it more before the beats came in. but i'm at work and listening to *Fairy Cakes For Tea (Fairytales Can Come True Vol.2) - 20 Previously Uncomped Popsike Gems 1966-71* at the moment too and that might have coloured my opinion of the youtube thing.

I should have quit while I was ahead, "Manos Arriba 2.0."

Top 10 Reggae Songs from Large Up: http://largeup.okayplayer.com/2010/12/30/toppa-top-10-top-reggae-singles-of-2010/

I may actually listen to all those! #2 on that list made my Pazz & Jop ballot, and the guy who did #4 put a single on my Pazz & Jop ballot last year. So maybe my reggae tastes are not stupid after all.

Anyone been in an Urban Outfitters recently? Their vinyl selection looks a lot like that Best Buy display.

i did some lists:

http://alexmacpherson.tumblr.com/post/2540857715/top-30-albums-of-2010
http://alexmacpherson.tumblr.com/post/2540874379/top-111-tracks-of-2010