Rolling Metal Thread 2010

AG: V. good, I initially presumed they must have either been from my old manor St Helens or the Pitcairn Islands but they're from America apparently.

man I try not engage Phil on his La Mancha anti-Decibel stuff but...

So here, in alphabetical order, are 20 albums Decibel didn't think were worthy of year-end consideration, the absence of many of which (Iron Maiden? HELLO?!?) throws their whole modus operandi and worldview into question, frankly.

It's a poll. Of a lot of writers. If the modus operandi being thrown into question is "polling one's writers," OK, cool enough, I don't submit year-end ballots for exactly this reason, but somehow I think that's not the objection here.

The assertion of a "worldview" gleaned from a poll of writers as disparate as Jeanne Fury & Jeff Treppel & Adem Tepedelen & Liz Brenner as is, frankly, laughable. My favorite albums aren't on the list, either; boo hoo.

as

when will i stop being amazed that ppl value year end lists as anything other than a consumers guide

Presenting the poll results as a flat list encourages readers to treat it like a single editorial construct (like Phil does in his response). Put it online, with vote-counts and links to the actual ballots, so that people can actually poke around in it and see who said what, and it would be both more understandable and more useful.

I don't have the issue to hand. Is the fact that it's a poll not made plain in an intro graf?

Exactly what Glenn said. As someone who compiled year-end lists from writers' balloting, once the list becomes a list, it ceases to be the sum of its parts and becomes an institutional verdict...and should be critiqued as such. The Voice's approach, where each writer's individual ballot is viewable online, is immensely preferable.

I've heard very good things about NOMEANSNO and Black Breath gigs this week. Gutted to have missed both of these shows due to influenza. A friend who went to see NMN for the first time in London last night drove up to Leeds to see them again today such was the impression they made upon him.

Looking forward to seeing them at ATP.

I get what you're saying Aerosmith - and speaking logically you're entirely correct - but it is fucking insane that Iron Maiden's joint best album in two decades isn't on the end of year list of a mainstream and well respected metal mag... to the extent that it's comment worthy and you can't really blame people for throwing their hands up in disgust.

Of course, as aero hints, I do just like poking at Decibel.

(If only there were some software in the world that made it easy to publish ballots and tabulations and whatnot, all linked up together with, like, sorting and searching and stuff...)

http://i.bnet.com/blogs/horse-race.jpg

Horse number one has no legs.

Explains why he has a long face.

xp every joke I had in response to that was completely tasteless

so what are the really horrible albums on the decibel list? are there any? i've heard, like, two of them. i'm all about the agalloch and body albums. though i still have to buy a real copy of the agalloch. only listened to a supersecret download and that was months ago. i never would have heard the body album if they hadn't played at my store. cuz i bought one from them.

i still need to hear the triptykon album too. need to buy it.

The ones that I think are either flat-out terrible, or just undeserving of their spots, are Agalloch (boring boring boring), Watain (I hate this band), Enslaved (boring boring boring - deserves a spot on the list, but in the bottom 10), Torche (sub-QOTSA tripe), The Austerity Program (fuck this band), Burzum (fuck this guy, plus the Xasthur album was way better), Father Befouled (can't believe Incantation hasn't cease-and-desisted this band out of existence), Early Graves (sorry that dude got killed, but the debut was much better), and Darkthrone (who I've just never liked, in any of their incarnations).

Enslaved should be in the top spot every year they release an album for the same reason you rep for Maiden. Except that Enslaved is more consistent than Maiden and has released more great albums at this point.

in before nuclear apolocalpyse in response to nate's post

agalloch don't bore me at all. and i've heard lots of boring music. i can dig people not liking them though. plenty of stuff i don't like out there. but ashes is seriously, like, one of the few modern records that i have played a hundred times. i fell hard for that thing.

"and Darkthrone (who I've just never liked, in any of their incarnations)."

can't even really argue with this kinda statement! i dunno, people like different stuff.

And without getting myself in any trouble by commenting on it's quality, i'd suggest that Agalloch's high placement on the DB list is mostly due to great anticipation and timing of release in close proximity to year-end polls. Which is much more a Profound Lore chess move than it is the band's. Agalloch could not care less about these polls. They operate in a bubble and that also seems to score points with a lot of folks.

I can also reveal that it placed much lower on the Terroizer list, placing far below Christian Mistress and narrowly beating Ludicra. I wonder about European tastes vs American...

The only Darkthrone I've ever loved is Soulside Journey which I bought on vinyl for $5 in 1994 from Earl Root. It stands up because there are songs, musicianship, and production value. Never got why they abandoned those things and quit gigging live...

awwww rip earl :(

Eh? Panzerfaust is ORESOME.

darn it, Phil. and here i was hoping you would've done the bitching about the "lame" dB album choices on yer blog piece instead of on ilm. oh well.

but seriously, if we can't moan, bitch, and/or whine over some rock rag's goofy year-end poll results... well, we may as well wrap shit up and head on home.

(also: payolla mongers should note that Iron Maiden did get a dB cover this year, and still didn't make the year-end cut. hmmm...)

cmon nate, I love enslaved too, but iron maiden are an amazingly consistent band!

but I don't even hate the blaze records, so it's entirely possible that I just have no taste

and darkthrone abandoned all the things you listed due to an unwavering dedication to trance-inducing riffs. fine by me, tbh.

also, siegbran is dead-on about that arckanum album. (ÞÞÞÞÞÞÞÞÞÞÞ) was tipped by him evangelizing in another thread and it does indeed kill.

aaaaaaand immortal/absu tickets for the NY show are $52! fukkin' expensive but I'll still prob go.

The only Enslaved misstep was ISA. Maiden have blown it at least 5 times...

maiden have also been around since the mid-seventies!

I won't defend everything they've done but they have a huge back catalog and much of it is quite good. including their latest.

JD, we need to make up for me missing you at SSonic by meeting up at ATP. I will propose something once the schedule gets published?

Agalloch boring, Phil? Wow, I'm just the opposite, I find the new one thrilling, life-affirming practically.

Aesop on drums really helps. Just as with Ludicra, he gives them some swing. I wouldn't have guessed they needed it but it really keeps everything moving quite nicely. I do think it's more of a grower than Ashes was; I'm enjoying it more and more each time through.

^exactly my belated reaction.

I think maybe Phil is more interested in the visceral experience of music than the ceremonial, but perhaps I'm just projecting. I intuit that drinking mead & listening to Agalloch by candlelight triggers his built-in bullshit alarm. For better or for worse.

@ Alan--Maiden was at their best in the 70s!

I've heard very good things about NOMEANSNO

I didn't go to the gig this week but I saw them last year and they were AWESOME.

Unfortunately this year I'm going to Bowlie 2 so I won't get to see them at ATP.

Nomeansno is one of the best live bands out there. Period. Go see them any chance you get.

I'm already making plans to catch 3-4 NW shows next time they do the OR/WA tour circuit. They always hit a lot of small towns and this is a band I'm determined to follow next chance I get.

May even see them at ATP if the flights work out!

Aldo: For sure. Drop me a line a few days beforehand.

I think maybe Phil is more interested in the visceral experience of music than the ceremonial

This is true, but only when it comes to metal. Various types of music serve different purposes for me. Metal is for when I'm out for a walk, or have work to do. When I'm in that ritualistic/meditative frame of mind, I gravitate toward classical - Beethoven string quartets, or Morton Feldman if I've got a couple of hours free. When I feel like really focused listening, isolating one instrument out of the mix and really examining how the music comes together, I go for prog or jazz.

But I think my biggest problem with Agalloch is that they're black metal. And black metal just has too many qualities I don't like - it takes a lot for a black metal band to win me over. I hate the drumming, for example. It's just way too unrelieved and monotonous. The guitars are almost as bad - there's no release, just endless hypnotically cycling riffs. I need catharsis, and black metal doesn't provide it. Plus, the vocals suck. (Not just in Agalloch, but in black metal as a whole.)

i don't even think of agalloch as a black metal band.

and agalloch are all about catharsis and release for me!

i don't even think of agalloch as a black metal band.

All I can hear is the black metal stuff when I listen to them. The folky bullshit that their fans grab onto seems like the merest frippery.

i guess i would call them blackened doom. or folky black doom. or something. doom black folk. whatever. they have really pretty clean vocals too.

so wait you don't actually hear the acoustic stuff when its playing? i don't get it. i mean some songs are half acoustic and half electric. its not like a flourish or an acoustic intro or something.

I wasn't an Agalloch fan before this, but I like Marrow of the Spirit a lot, too. I have low tolerance for black metal in which the drumming or vocals (it's usually one of those) drain the music of rhythm or dynamism, but Agalloch doesn't seem to me to be doing that.

I like the Enslaved a lot, too, and would be happy to see either of those on anybody's 2010 list. Whether they'll make mine, I'm not sure yet. It's been a really good year.

The only term I've ever known them to get behind is "Dark Metal." They certainly don't consider themselves to be black metal. I think they draw influence from a lot of black metal, but also classical, folk, industrial, etc. John is the biggest fan I know of Rush Power Windows.

But I would never tell Phil he needs to like/understand Agalloch better. Music is so subjective. And he hears more of it than most people ever will.