WAKA

first albums are always like that!

particularly in gangster rap

which is kinda why the snoop comparison feels arbitrary - I mean if critics are praising Waka for his unique flow then it makes sense, cuz that was Snoop's saving grace from the get-go.

so are you disagreeing just to disagree then, and hoping the correct argument turns up eventually

um, I'm just saying you're comparing Waka to Snoop by saying Snoop was seen as a hollow, morally bankrupt derivative beat-dependent (as most gangsta rappers initially are). But Snoop was hailed for his unique delivery from the start, was always held out from the pack.

which wasnt at all what you were saying for 90% of this argument

what was I saying?

my first post

people definitely had the usual gangsta rap content issues ("it aint no fun if the homies can't have none" didn't help) but the rolling stone/ew reviews definitely compliment his skills

― da croupier, Tuesday, October 12, 2010 5:34 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark

which is kinda why the snoop comparison feels arbitrary - I mean if critics are praising Waka for his unique flow then it makes sense, cuz that was Snoop's saving grace from the get-go.

― da croupier, Tuesday, October 12, 2010 1:47 PM (18 minutes ago) Bookmark

instead theyre praising it for his unique personality.

^^two diff arguments croupier

if you say so, deej.

and not to troll, but how exactly would you describe his personality and how it's unique? I'm seeing a lot of "yeah personality sells it" in the thread, but what I've heard doesn't sound that outside the norm.

if you say so, deej.

― da croupier, Tuesday, October 12, 2010 2:07 PM (3 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

how is "no one said snoop was a bad rapper" the same argument as "some people said snoop was a bad rapper but they say that about lots of gangster rappers so it doesn't matter"

i dont think your 2nd question is particularly troll-y!! but its also kind of hard! how do you describe too $hort's personality?

imo waka is young exuberant hardheaded raw gangsta rap Id. his personality doesnt seem very constructed or distanced at all from the performance, except in teh way he's constructed a pretty hypermasculine hood persona (which he portrays as being pretty much his ... persona period.) his personality comes through very clearly in a way it doesnt in rappers like Gibbs or KRIT or whoever

im not sure how personalities are supposed to be 'outside the norm.' is miccio 'outside the norm' for ilx? was 50 cent? a distinctive personality doesnt have to necessarily be weird or stand out like that, it could be sorta low-key like curren$y. a strong personality just means that you feel like you're getting a clear picture of the artist not just from what he tells u but by the style & technique in how he tells it, imo

lmao his bet performance

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xf6ixz

how is "no one said snoop was a bad rapper" the same argument as "some people said snoop was a bad rapper but they say that about lots of gangster rappers so it doesn't matter"

I never said "no one said snoop was a bad rapper" or "some said he was a bad rapper but they say that about a lot of people." I said people had the usual gangsta rap complaints about his gangsta rap, but he was pretty universally seen as exceptional within the genre for his flow. So saying "Waka's like Snoop" only makes more sense than "Waka's like Spice 1" or "Waka's like MC Ren" or whatever if he's got an ace up his sleeve. You say critics are praising his unique personality - though I only found Sean F's Voice review calling his vocals anything more than Lil Jon fight chants - and so I asked what was so unique about it. Sounds like the deal is he's exceptionally nonchalant and indifferent to craft even for an I Don't Give A Fuck rapper. Okeydoke.

sounds like your taste in rap is still shitty & your willingness to take it beyond reductive charicature (lol lil boosie sounds like cartman!!!) is still lacking

i dont think 'pretty nonchalant and indifferent to craft' is what i said at all. maybe read again

'waka's like snoop' makes tons more sense than 'waka's like spice 1' or 'waka's like ren' for that matter. snoop is really popular, waka is really popular. not a niche artist. a character that will appeal to a broader audience. spice 1 is one of my favorite rappers but hes totally a niche gangsta rap dude. and ren??? cmon

waka gets a huge amount of hate for his supposed bad rapping, wayyy more than most gangster rapper. this is kind of indisputable! critics IN THIS THREAD are praising his 'unique personality' -- i dont think there's anyone out there who would deny he certainly has a unique um approach. most of them just think its ignorant/offensive/sloppy/unskilled

i just get the feeling that your sensitivity to the rap discourse is about as effective as a cubicle radio antennae

Where does my taste in rap even come into this? the nonchalant thing comes more from Sean F's review than what you wrote, which seemed kinda contradictory. I mean it's not very constructed except in how it's his personality doesnt seem very constructed or distanced at all from the performance, except in teh way he's constructed a pretty hypermasculine hood persona (which he portrays as being pretty much his ... persona period...Sorry I'm being "reductive" and "unsensitive to the rap discouse" compared to that.

woops i think I melded a paraphrase with a quote in there...his personality doesnt seem very constructed or distanced at all from the performance, except in teh way he's constructed a pretty hypermasculine hood persona (which he portrays as being pretty much his ... persona period.)

didn't mean to make it sound more incoherent.

oh man that performance is incredible

btw, deej, waka records prolly sell like ren's records did back in the day

kizz my black azz was like a billboard top 20 record iirc

'sales'

hey whiney i cant believe were still having this conversation but i promise you that waka flocka is more popular than ren ever was

http://www.yelp.com/topic/chicago-chicago-is-the-center-of-the-universe-right-now

yeah my point wasn't about sales figures, just that Snoop was recognized as unique in the genre by like, Time on down. So far the Waka reviews are varying degrees of "I fuck with these dumb chants". You can say they're missing the boat, but it didn't seem like people were missing Snoop's.

his personality doesnt seem very constructed or distanced at all from the performance, except in teh way he's constructed a pretty hypermasculine hood persona (which he portrays as being pretty much his ... persona period.)

^^^sorry this just wasnt clear. obv everyone's persona is a 'construct,' in music & real life -- i just meant that beyond the hypermasucline hood persona, he doesn't come across like he's trying to do much else. most rappers are! i mean, jeezy is similarly limited in his ability to articulate w/ nuance -- he's no t.i. etc. -- but hes more in the vein of a post-pac street prophet keep it real type rapper, 'walk a mile in these air forces,' going for more ambitious messaging. waka's ambition seems to be simply to embody this archetype as fully as possible without trying to add introspection, or incorporate pastor troy's preacher-isms, or complexities. there is no attempt to add on, simply to be the young ('young' def describes his persona here - hes not even bothering to learn to rap 'properly'!) hood gangster rap archetype & turn it up to 11 without trying to move outside of that

http://www.yelp.com/topic/chicago-chicago-is-the-center-of-the-universe-right-now

― interk3llar overdrive (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, October 12, 2010 9:11 PM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

you are such an idiot dude.

yeah my point wasn't about sales figures, just that Snoop was recognized as unique in the genre by like, Time on down. So far the Waka reviews are varying degrees of "I fuck with these dumb chants". You can say they're missing the boat, but it didn't seem like people were missing Snoop's.

― da croupier, Tuesday, October 12, 2010 9:11 PM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

i think your view of this is highly distorted by time. snoop didnt become a universal icon right away -- he was just another thug rapper! he had a murder charge!

did you even go into a record store in 1992 or were u too busy at volleyball practice?

im not saying waka is gonna end up being a pop culture icon, although apparently thats all you remember snoop as

did you even go into a record store in 1992 or were u too busy at volleyball practice?

― interk3llar overdrive (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, October 12, 2010 9:17 PM (7 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:DDD_YxmEq11AiM:http://www.sepiamutiny.com/sepia/MissedTarget---small.gif&t=1

for fuck's sake, guys

i for one am a big fan of whiney's attempts to smear me as someone who liked sports

im not saying waka is gonna end up being a pop culture icon, although apparently thats all you remember snoop as

I remember him as a rapper whose flow was recognized as unique by everybody! what does "pop culture icon" have to do with it?

everybody

deej when are u gonna admit that u weren't actively fucking with rap music in 1992 and were prolly collecting little league trophies and watching Legends Of The Hidden Temple with a mouth full of Fruit By The Foot

everybody

So pop out that high-profile "poor man's slick rick" piece already, everything I've found seems pretty complimentary of his mic-handling if not his interest in making sure the homies have some.

shouldn't even be that hard to find some armond white type who took the bait that was actually covering "La Di Da Di" on the album.

im googling around right now to find some examples we'll see if i can pull up any reviews

whiney stfu & go listen to chuck eddy's favorite crunk record

shouldn't even be that hard to find some armond white type who took the bait that was actually covering "La Di Da Di" on the album.

― da croupier, Tuesday, October 12, 2010 9:24 PM (37 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

i havent actually found any reviews from the period that werent xgau's

whiney stfu & go listen to chuck eddy's favorite crunk record

― trollin trollin trollin we aint slept in weeks (deej), Tuesday, October 12, 2010 10:25 PM (35 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

is this about me liking "Cadillac's On 22s"?

i love your posturing BS of "that's what ROCK CRITICS like" as if a) you're not a rock critic yourself and b) you run every rap song through the official deej panel of multi-culti chicago teenagers you know IRL.

actually wait -- xgau never even reviewed doggystyle he just gave it the 'bomb' icon -- although a few albums later he did manage "Anyone who counts him a major artist because he can drawl and pronounce consonants at the same time should give equal time to Mariah Carey's high notes and George Winston's magic fingers." -- hardly an exacting defense of his rapping abilities

i love your posturing BS of "that's what ROCK CRITICS like" as if a) you're not a rock critic yourself and b) you run every rap song through the official deej panel of multi-culti chicago teenagers you know IRL.

― interk3llar overdrive (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, October 12, 2010 9:27 PM (46 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

a) at least im not a fucking parody of a mid-90s Spin rock critic getting excited about 'electronica' and green day b) when have i ever fucking done this you fucking idiot

seriously, dude, fuck off

although a few albums later he did manage "Anyone who counts him a major artist because he can drawl and pronounce consonants at the same time should give equal time to Mariah Carey's high notes and George Winston's magic fingers." -- hardly an exacting defense of his rapping abilities

seems like a pretty direct acknowledgment of a unique flow!