― Mr. Snrub (Mr. Snrub), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 17:02 (eighteen years ago) link
― Melissa W (Melissa W), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 17:04 (eighteen years ago) link
― M@tt He1geson (Matt Helgeson), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 17:10 (eighteen years ago) link
― Melissa W (Melissa W), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 17:22 (eighteen years ago) link
― mookieproof (mookieproof), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 17:23 (eighteen years ago) link
Something that has already been invented doesn't need reinvention. What already exists and works perfectly should still be used for more.
― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 17:33 (eighteen years ago) link
OTM. Coldplay has always been harmless/ignorable at worst and pleasant at best. Thom still wins of course, but how can someone really hate Coldplay? If you say you do, you are lying. How about that, eh?
― regular roundups (Dave M), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 17:39 (eighteen years ago) link
Geir: Interesting point re:songform... However, would you agree that any given form over time will lose its viability for original creative exploitation as the most succesful permuatations are expended (ie- it gets harder to make something both good and original without changing the template- all the 4 chord patterns and simple melodies have been taken- wondeful as they are). Hence those who keep mining the same template get lucky on ever less frequent occasions...
― gek-opel, Wednesday, 5 April 2006 17:39 (eighteen years ago) link
Are you kidding?
― Melissa W (Melissa W), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 17:43 (eighteen years ago) link
Theoretically, you are right. But that moment has yet to arrive for hundreds of years still, as evidenced by all those brilliant songs bands like Coldplay has brought the world lately - songs that may stylistically sound like songs that have been written in the past, but which still contain competely new brilliant melodies with new hooks that were not written before.
― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 17:44 (eighteen years ago) link
― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 17:45 (eighteen years ago) link
Also- as a man who apparently likes melodic complexity, I don't really get that with Coldplay- catchy yes, but not surprising.. not intricate, and thats down to the predictable 4 chord loops they build their songs on...
― gek-opel, Wednesday, 5 April 2006 17:48 (eighteen years ago) link
xx-post
― erklie (erklie), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 17:50 (eighteen years ago) link
― gek-opel, Wednesday, 5 April 2006 17:50 (eighteen years ago) link
soo OTM. so i'll go with Martin. I mean, I hate top 40 radio as much as the rest of you, but if I have to hear it in a car I want to hear something written with heart + sincerity.
but it's tough to snub Thom Yorke. what an evil question.
― Wrinklepaws (Wrinklepaws), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 18:10 (eighteen years ago) link
― Melissa W (Melissa W), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 18:21 (eighteen years ago) link
But honestly- music with heart + sincerity? Well I agree in principle, but what definition of heart and sincerity- not Chris Martin's! Thom Yorke tho a miserable bugger puts more heart into his work I think (i don't really like radiohead anymore, i have to say, but all the same...).
― gek-opel, Wednesday, 5 April 2006 18:37 (eighteen years ago) link
― Lotta Continua (Damian), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 18:41 (eighteen years ago) link
― Melissa W (Melissa W), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 18:42 (eighteen years ago) link
― Lotta Continua (Damian), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 18:44 (eighteen years ago) link
Compare: Radiohead interviews where they're kind of shady about influences and then pull out some vaguely krautrockish manuevers VS. Coldplay's "WOO, KRAFTWERK!" song that exists despite the band making ridiculous claims ("Kraftwerk are like the original Gorillaz since no one knows what they look like" leads me to believe Martin never saw an album cover).
Melissa, I think Creed's been superseded by Nickelback as the "rock band" of choice of adult contemporary radio.
― mike h. (mike h.), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 18:44 (eighteen years ago) link
― Lotta Continua (Damian), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 18:51 (eighteen years ago) link
― gek-opel, Wednesday, 5 April 2006 18:55 (eighteen years ago) link
Yellow: I-V sus4add6-IV major7-I
Clocks: I-v-v-ii
Fix You: I-iii add6-vi-V sus4
Speed of Sound: I-v-v-IV
Talk: IV-IV-vi-I
The Scientist: iv minor7-IV-I-I sus
one thing that's interesting is that:
Yellow, In My Place, The Scientist, Speed of Sound, Fix You, and Talk (basically every hit of theirs besides clocks) ALL have choruses which begin on the four chord.
More than anything Coldplay could be accused of copying themselves, but I don't think their chord progressions could be accurately described as "3rd hand" or cliched
― RalphTheHardDrive (RalphTheHardDrive), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 18:59 (eighteen years ago) link
You mean "Computer Love"?
― Lotta Continua (Damian), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 19:01 (eighteen years ago) link
The beginning on the fourth chord, (or turning the last chord of the verse into the beginning of the chorus) trick is to save time having to think of some more chords! Its pure laziness... all those plodding 4 chord progressions, or reaching towards obvious resolution... its utterly utterly moribund.
― gek-opel, Wednesday, 5 April 2006 19:06 (eighteen years ago) link
― A representative of the Aja / Dante diaspora, Wednesday, 5 April 2006 19:14 (eighteen years ago) link
Maybe they should switch bands.
― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 19:15 (eighteen years ago) link
― Lotta Continua (Damian), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 19:23 (eighteen years ago) link
Also, I think Talk has an original chord progression, just the riff is taken from kraftwerk.
― RalphTheHardDrive (RalphTheHardDrive), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 19:32 (eighteen years ago) link
Talk takes its chords directly from the synthbass on the original...
I lioke what Radiohead attempt to be even if I haven't liked their actual music from Amnesiac onwards... (too half arsed, not weird enough, not angry enough) and their fans are cunts, tis true, actually walked outof the last one of their gigs i went to cos the fans were pissing me off too much...
Coldplay are extremely conventional, on their last album Martin is frequently flat especially on his falsetto, and their lyrics are bilge to an incredible, risible degree. Guitarwise they exist entirely within a U2 / Bunnymen matrix. Dull dull dull, achingly, bedwettingly, prematurely ejaculatingly, flacidly dull. I know rubbishing them is almost as dull, but just cos they're an easy target doesn't mean they're not a perfectly valid one.
― gek-opel, Wednesday, 5 April 2006 19:48 (eighteen years ago) link
(Um, not that there isn't definitely a cunt contingent.)
― Melissa W (Melissa W), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 20:12 (eighteen years ago) link
A verse or a chorus may build on a 4 chord loop, but if the rest of the song does not (like the bridge, for instance, most of their songs have a somewhat contrasting bridge, which is also a sign that they know something about classic quality songwriting) build on the same 4 chords, then the entire song isn't based on a 4 chord loop even if part of it is.
Interestingly, though, the most harmonically repetitive Coldplay songs often tend to be rhythmically "interesting", which is why a lot of ILM'ers not very into Coldplay may pick exactly those songs as their favourite ("Clocks", for instance, which IMO is among their weakest and most repetitive songs)
― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 20:28 (eighteen years ago) link
― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 20:31 (eighteen years ago) link
― grapple (grapple), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 23:08 (eighteen years ago) link
ah, mr. snrub. you appear with the tedious inevitability of an unloved season.
Okay, so I never thought I'd see a Moonraker quote on here...
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 23:15 (eighteen years ago) link
― mookieproof (mookieproof), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 23:22 (eighteen years ago) link
i am clearly lurking on alternate-universe ILM today.
― A|ex P@reene (Pareene), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 23:31 (eighteen years ago) link
You put me on a shelf And kept me for yourself I can only blame myself You can only blame me
And I could write a song A hundred miles long Well that's where I belong And you belong with me
And I could write it down And spread it all around Get lost and then get found or swallowed in the sea
You put me on a line And hung me out to dry And darling, that's when I decided to go see
You cut me down to size And opened up my eyes Made me realize What I could not see
And I could write a book The one they'll say that shook The world and then it took It took it back from me
And I could write it down And spread it all around Get lost and then get found And you'll come back to me Not swallowed in the sea
The streets you're walking on A thousand houses long Well, that's where I belong And you belong with me
Oh, what good is it to live With nothing left to give Forget, but not forgive Not loving all you see
All the streets you're walking on A thousand houses long Well, that's where I belong And you belong with me Not swallowed in the sea
You belong with me Not swallowed in the sea Yeah, you belong with me Not swallowed in the sea
Mmmyes, well, I'm touched.
― Lotta Continua (Damian), Wednesday, 5 April 2006 23:38 (eighteen years ago) link
I don't listen to lyrics much, so I had no idea they were *that* bad. Jesus.
― Melissa W (Melissa W), Thursday, 6 April 2006 00:06 (eighteen years ago) link
I am aware of this, but that doesn't mean it's a valid reason to dislike something. Just ignore it. Reminds me of high school and kids who "just think ugliness is like, really beautiful in a way, you know?"
― regular roundups (Dave M), Thursday, 6 April 2006 00:21 (eighteen years ago) link
Especially since they broke up and released their last album five years ago.
― Mr. Snrub (Mr. Snrub), Thursday, 6 April 2006 00:28 (eighteen years ago) link
― latebloomer: someone's been drinking my youth! (latebloomer), Thursday, 6 April 2006 00:58 (eighteen years ago) link
― latebloomer: someone's been drinking my youth! (latebloomer), Thursday, 6 April 2006 00:59 (eighteen years ago) link
Ah, there's the rub. They are harmless, since U2 IS THE MOST POWERFUL BAND IN THE WORLD AND WILL NEVER BE STOPPED OR REPLACED AS THE SOUNDTRACK TO NEO-LIBERAL KAPITAL!!!!!! You don't need a bench if your starters are invincible AND immortal.
― regular roundups (Dave M), Thursday, 6 April 2006 05:11 (eighteen years ago) link
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 6 April 2006 05:24 (eighteen years ago) link
― Pandas At War (pandas at war), Thursday, 6 April 2006 12:09 (eighteen years ago) link
― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Thursday, 6 April 2006 13:00 (eighteen years ago) link
― Real Goths Don't Wear Black (Enrique), Thursday, 6 April 2006 13:04 (eighteen years ago) link
― mark grout (mark grout), Thursday, 6 April 2006 13:17 (eighteen years ago) link
that's ok.
sorry i ahve never seen either band live.
do you think echo and the bunnymen, sigur ros or stump are the most important of coldplay and radiohead's shared influences?
― pscott (elwisty), Thursday, 18 May 2006 01:12 (eighteen years ago) link
Sigur ros - has a bit of their sounds but you know who they actually sound like to me? The Flaming Lips... as to who influenced who there - no idea.
― Johny B, Thursday, 18 May 2006 01:26 (eighteen years ago) link
― Johnny B, Thursday, 18 May 2006 03:14 (eighteen years ago) link
― Sick Mouthy (Nick Southall), Thursday, 18 May 2006 07:55 (eighteen years ago) link
― Action Tim Vision (noodle vague), Thursday, 18 May 2006 07:58 (eighteen years ago) link
― Tuomas (Tuomas), Thursday, 18 May 2006 08:21 (eighteen years ago) link
-- Sick Mouthy (sickmouthy
better than dave matthews, not as good as madge vs janet j.
TIHS THRAED FAILS H TE TURING TEST!!! TZZT TZZT TZZT ZTTZ. !!!1
― Pashmina (Pashmina), Thursday, 18 May 2006 11:10 (eighteen years ago) link
stay on TOPIC!!!
― alias: alfonse (The Giant Mechanical Ant), Thursday, 18 May 2006 13:13 (eighteen years ago) link
it's nice to get some support in a music chatroom like this - no, i don't 'get' why some people use sarcasm either Johnny - they're not like that at Yahoo. Personally i think it lowers the tone, even if that means we're never going to be one of the 'in crowd'. wouldn't the world be a nicer place if we all just said what we meant??
personally i prefer Coldplay. They've got a much better understanding of harmony - Radiohead seem to have lost their way a bit since their glory days - sometimes i want to say to them: GET A PROPER GUITAR TUNER!! i know that maybe seems a bit harsh to some people, but there are 12 notes in the western scale and it's just not right to go breaking the rules like that. Rules are there for a reason Tom!!! Coldplay never play the wrong notes on purpose.
― Beeble, Thursday, 18 May 2006 18:13 (eighteen years ago) link
Beeble - about the comment on Radiohead sounding detuned... well they experiment a bit with some less than traditional chord progressions and sound mixining needless to say but most of the time I think the result is good. But I do know some folks who think it can be annoying so I guess it is very debateable. (like some people who loved the bends and ok computer really don`t like the albums after) but also the one thing I have found is that if people listen to them enough, the later albums grow on them. I guess they don`t have immediate appeal when hearing like the earlier albums did.
― Johnny B, Thursday, 18 May 2006 19:21 (eighteen years ago) link
― Johnny B, Thursday, 18 May 2006 19:24 (eighteen years ago) link
― Beeble, Thursday, 18 May 2006 19:42 (eighteen years ago) link
― Chris Bee (Cee Bee), Thursday, 18 May 2006 20:09 (eighteen years ago) link
― Tim Rutherford-Johnson (Rambler), Thursday, 18 May 2006 21:47 (eighteen years ago) link
I don`t know enough about blogs to have Jouster`s premonitions, but I am learning :)
But back on topic, here is a question for all... which is the best song from Radiohead or Coldplay in your opinion and why?
― Johnny B, Thursday, 18 May 2006 22:26 (eighteen years ago) link
― Enrique IX: The Mediator (Enrique), Friday, 19 May 2006 10:14 (eighteen years ago) link
In terms of Radiohead songs, too hard to pick one... I just don`t tire of any of there stuff aside from a few songs on Kid A and Amnesiac. Pretty much anything on The Bends, Ok Computer and Airbag: How is My Driving is great. Huge classics I would say are songs like Lucky, Airbag, A Reminder and Fake Plastic Trees. But really hard to pick them even over a dozen of other songs that are timeless too.
The big test for me is that I toss a CD in the car and see how long I can endure it. Stuff I liked like Coldplay`s Parachutes, Beatles albums, Stones, White Stripes, some of the Brian Jonestown Massacre albums etc etc would do well for 1-3 months before I tired of listening to them almost daily. The Bends and Ok Computer have been in the car CD changer for 4 years now, and I am not even close to being tired of either of them yet...
― Johnny B, Friday, 19 May 2006 20:22 (eighteen years ago) link
― jed_ (jed), Friday, 19 May 2006 20:25 (eighteen years ago) link
so why don`t you focus a bit - tell us which song from which band you like... or anything on the topic of this blog for that matter...
come on, surprise us buddy!
― Johnny B, Friday, 19 May 2006 20:59 (eighteen years ago) link
The point is though: when comparing Coldplay to Radiohead there is no doubt that Radiohead is the more talented band hands down. It seems to me that Coldplay only started out for something to do with their free time, like a lot of bands, but have never really gotten over that or tried to challenge themselves too much. I don't see, though, why everyone is so intent on hating Coldplay just because of how popular they have become in their mediocracy. How were they to know they would become so mainstream? Can't blame them for it, so I don't see why there has to be any sort of hostility towards them for that.
I'm just wondering why the topic is Thom Yorke vs. Chris Martin when most people (including myself) are talking about the bands and music as a whole, and not the individual. If I really want to stay on topic, my answer would be Thom Yorke, just because I have seem many interviews about the guy and have read Dead Air Space and his blogs and all that. I know almost nothing about Chris Martin and his personality.
Sorry that was so long and choppy, inconsistant, etc etc. Just some opinion because I'm really bored at the moment.
― Happy Plant, Saturday, 20 May 2006 23:33 (eighteen years ago) link
Thanks for being on topic!!
― Johnny B, Sunday, 21 May 2006 20:46 (eighteen years ago) link
>:(
― fandango (fandango), Sunday, 21 May 2006 20:53 (eighteen years ago) link
― Tuomas (Tuomas), Sunday, 21 May 2006 20:56 (eighteen years ago) link
― gekoppel (Gekoppel), Sunday, 21 May 2006 21:52 (eighteen years ago) link
I still choose Radiohead over them any day though.
― Happy Plant, Sunday, 21 May 2006 23:30 (eighteen years ago) link
― Checkpoint Charlie, Monday, 22 May 2006 00:09 (eighteen years ago) link
― Emily Brown, Monday, 22 May 2006 01:46 (eighteen years ago) link
― Johnny B, Monday, 22 May 2006 17:30 (eighteen years ago) link
pscott - I got a chance to spend a bit more time with Echo and the Bunnymen music. I must say thanks for the lead, I hadn`t really heard much of their stuff before as I stated to you earlier. Of the three bands you had mentioned no doubt if any influened Yorke it would be this one.
I also wasn`t surprised to see them as a recommended item to hear on Anton Newcombe`s band`s site. I think they influenced the BJM no doubt too and probably many others for that matter.
thanks again for the lead.
― Johnny B, Friday, 26 May 2006 00:29 (eighteen years ago) link
― Enrique IX: The Mediator (Enrique), Friday, 26 May 2006 07:50 (eighteen years ago) link
Now do you have anything productive at all to say or not ?
― Johnny B, Friday, 26 May 2006 21:00 (eighteen years ago) link