If she's a pop star, the production is what counts? Ridiculous.
― abcfsk, Monday, 13 September 2010 09:06 (thirteen years ago) link
lol never thought I'd see someone try to use rockism to argue against taylor
― subtle like the g in 'goole' (dayo), Monday, 13 September 2010 10:34 (thirteen years ago) link
personally her lyrics are what make her for me - sure they're about bog standard things, but the way they play out in lockstep with the music, how she almost seems to write the music to fit the lyrics (instead of the other way around which is what I feel like happens most of the time), that's what's special.
― subtle like the g in 'goole' (dayo), Monday, 13 September 2010 10:35 (thirteen years ago) link
lex (and anyone else who didn't hear it), here's the VMA song:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tF0x2_mXjM4
― ilxor has truly been got at and become an ILXor (ilxor), Monday, 13 September 2010 14:27 (thirteen years ago) link
i've heard it now, she's still not good at hitting notes live, huh
― لوووووووووووووووووووول (lex pretend), Monday, 13 September 2010 14:32 (thirteen years ago) link
Nope... not quite, haha.
― ilxor has truly been got at and become an ILXor (ilxor), Monday, 13 September 2010 14:50 (thirteen years ago) link
She sounded much better at the live show I saw earlier this year than she does on live TV, fwiw.
I like the NYT line about the song being "an extremely savvy insult masquerading as the high road," totally OTM. But whatever she's a bland sucky simplistic writer, blahblah.
I'm w/ jordan, I think the song's great but wish it didn't specifically have to be about last year's VMAs. I love that it sounds like her open-hearted sweetheart thing but manages to also showcase her insanely petty side
― trippin lookin at my portfolio (billy), Monday, 13 September 2010 14:55 (thirteen years ago) link
Yep, the song would've been a hell of a lot better without the more explicit Kanye references ("32 years old" and whatever else) and NOT performed on the VMAs, just put onto the album. She should've played "Mine"!!!
― ilxor has truly been got at and become an ILXor (ilxor), Monday, 13 September 2010 15:01 (thirteen years ago) link
taylor's songs aren't interesting enough for the lyrics to be bad.― christopher dullan (Tape Store), Monday, September 13, 2010 4:12 AM (8 hours ago)
― christopher dullan (Tape Store), Monday, September 13, 2010 4:12 AM (8 hours ago)
http://i52.tinypic.com/20p7fnk.jpg
― markers, Monday, 13 September 2010 16:59 (thirteen years ago) link
http://i56.tinypic.com/2gydor6.jpg
http://theangryblackwoman.com/2010/09/13/white-women-tears-and-coded-images/
― max, Monday, 13 September 2010 17:55 (thirteen years ago) link
Except she’s not expressing those emotions in a vacuum, and she’s well aware of the racial subtext after a year of her fans using racial epithets about Kanye at every turn. She’s had a year to debut this song (especially since according to her camp she wrote it in her diary last year) but she held onto it for a publicity stunt last night. There’s some complicated historical and social subtext tangled up in the use of tears this way, and in the reaction to those tears. It’s a subtext that makes the phrase “White Woman’s Tears” a convenient shorthand for a situation that boils down to a white woman wielding her tears as a weapon against a POC. We’re back to intent and the question of whether those tears (genuine or otherwise) and their ability to derail and/or escalate a situation can be separated out from the emotions that may be prompting them.
― max, Monday, 13 September 2010 17:56 (thirteen years ago) link
I suppose when the two people involed are "innocent little white girl" and "angry black man" it's hard not to view the whole ordeal in a racial context, but honestly I don't really see it that way. Swift-gate had more to do with people being fed up with Kanye's antics over a prolonged period of time than it did with some sort of racialized, "know your place black man" thing. And I don't necessarily think Swift was playing on her race in last night's performance (at least not consciously anyway).So yeah, OFFTM
― one hood ass geometry teacher (The Brainwasher), Monday, 13 September 2010 18:02 (thirteen years ago) link
...than it did with some sort of racialized, "know your place black man" thing.
i read a whole shit-ton of stuff saying exactly this?
― grodyody (goole), Monday, 13 September 2010 18:04 (thirteen years ago) link
http://i54.tinypic.com/2vs5fgj.jpg
― prolego, Monday, 13 September 2010 18:09 (thirteen years ago) link
I think there's a difference here between "Know your place KANYE" and "know your place BLACK MAN," because Kanye had a history of acting like this. Obviously Kanye is a black man, but I don't think the backlash against him was racial (for the most part, I'm sure you can find examples of Swift fans saying racist shit, or Fox News commentators or something...)
― one hood ass geometry teacher (The Brainwasher), Monday, 13 September 2010 18:10 (thirteen years ago) link
ok well the exact wording wasn't "black man" either
― grodyody (goole), Monday, 13 September 2010 18:11 (thirteen years ago) link
i have a tough time saying that taylor was playing the victim when she was being so patronising
― لوووووووووووووووووووول (lex pretend), Monday, 13 September 2010 18:22 (thirteen years ago) link
yeah true, but the way the performance was framed (the somber intro replaying the vid from last year and then *sad serious taylor face*) was very "HEY GUYS REMEMBER WHAT HAPPENED FEEL SORRY FOR ME"
― one hood ass geometry teacher (The Brainwasher), Monday, 13 September 2010 18:25 (thirteen years ago) link
ok i just read the lyrics to the song and nowhere in it does she play the victim or express feeling even mildly wounded or hurt! not one line! she tries to present it as simpatico but the entire song is basically a slightly pitying "oh, grow up kanye".
― لوووووووووووووووووووول (lex pretend), Monday, 13 September 2010 18:34 (thirteen years ago) link
This verse in the lyrics:
Wasn’t it easier in your firefly catching days?And everything out of reach someone picked up and brought down to youWasn’t it beautiful running wild ‘til you fell asleepBefore the monsters caught up to you?
Super smart reference going on here?
― prolego, Monday, 13 September 2010 19:17 (thirteen years ago) link
totally noticed that! wonder how long it's been industry knowledge that kanye had a new song called "monster".
― لوووووووووووووووووووول (lex pretend), Monday, 13 September 2010 19:22 (thirteen years ago) link
"the other side of the door" is awesome! haven't got mentioned on ILM.
― dan138zig (Durrr Durrr Durrrrrr), Saturday, 18 September 2010 01:30 (thirteen years ago) link
Cosign!
― ilxor has truly been got at and become an ILXor (ilxor), Saturday, 18 September 2010 02:33 (thirteen years ago) link
1. Mine 03:49 2. Sparks 04:20 3. Back To December 04:53 4. Speak Now 04:00 5. Dear John 06:43 6. Mean 03:57 7. The Story Of Us 04:25 8. Never Grow Up 04:50 9. Enchanted 05:52 10. Better Than Revenge 03:37 11. Innocent 05:02 12. Haunted 04:02 13. Last Kiss 06:07 14. Long Live 05:17
― abcfsk, Tuesday, 21 September 2010 16:55 (thirteen years ago) link
kinda excited by these long songs
i hope this album will be her tusk
― groovemaaan, Tuesday, 21 September 2010 18:13 (thirteen years ago) link
"Mine" holds up very well indeed. Like the tracks on 'Fearless' that seemed slightly anonymous to me at first it's revealed its power gradually. Never going to doubt her again.
And here is her 'Mine' performance at the All for the Hall thing with Kris and Emmylou & Co, proving again how much better her vocals are when she's just on stage with her guitar and not in an award show setting.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFnO4NaMh3Y
― abcfsk, Tuesday, 28 September 2010 10:58 (thirteen years ago) link
Yeah, my issue with Taylor Swift has always been this over-eager effort to craft her into some sort of young Faith Hill crossover monster, when she seems to be at her best at her most comfortable, which is to say, at her most low-key. Getting caught up in this awards show/what-is-she-wearing frenzy is doing her no favors.
― Josh in Chicago, Tuesday, 28 September 2010 11:45 (thirteen years ago) link
if I may speak now about the debut briefly, I bought a karaoke video game last week with "I'm Only Me When I'm With You", which is from the "deluxe" version of the debut & thus I'd never heard it before. & it's great! It's a bridge between the twangier material of the debut & the streamlined pop of Fearless: it has the quiet/loud dynamics of "Love Story" & "You Belong With Me", but the pedal steel is more prominent than's typical on Fearless as is the fiddle riff after the burst of the chorus. I can see why she left it off the debut: the lyric is more trite than anything on the album (or on Fearless). But it's still a great rush.
― Euler, Tuesday, 28 September 2010 14:34 (thirteen years ago) link
in a similar vein, I have been really jamming 'untouchable' which is off the deluxe edition of Fearless
― tumlbrah (dayo), Tuesday, 28 September 2010 14:41 (thirteen years ago) link
Seconding the love for "I'm Only Me When I'm with You" which is fantaaaaaaaaaaassticcc!
― ilxor has truly been got at and become an ILXor (ilxor), Tuesday, 28 September 2010 14:42 (thirteen years ago) link
Also that performance of "Mine" upthread a bit is frickin' awesome.
― ilxor has truly been got at and become an ILXor (ilxor), Tuesday, 28 September 2010 14:43 (thirteen years ago) link
From the same show:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zg556inyAFw
and
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FhXUQg1_qe4
― ilxor has truly been got at and become an ILXor (ilxor), Tuesday, 28 September 2010 15:04 (thirteen years ago) link
So..."Speak Now"
Not sure what I was expecting after 'Mine', but it wasn't this? There's something about this that feels quite different from her other stuff - not sure if it's a production touch, or vocals or something, but there's something kind of demo-ish or live about this. It's a nice sound for her.
― The SBurbs (Alex in Montreal), Tuesday, 5 October 2010 05:02 (thirteen years ago) link
LINK
the fuck is wrong with you
― J0rdan S., Tuesday, 5 October 2010 05:23 (thirteen years ago) link
iTunes.
― The SBurbs (Alex in Montreal), Tuesday, 5 October 2010 05:24 (thirteen years ago) link
It's the single, not the album, to clarify.
They are doing the same sort of countdown to the LP they did w/ fearless. one song a week until the release date
― The SBurbs (Alex in Montreal), Tuesday, 5 October 2010 05:25 (thirteen years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XnalIapimec
― The SBurbs (Alex in Montreal), Tuesday, 5 October 2010 05:26 (thirteen years ago) link
word thankig u
― J0rdan S., Tuesday, 5 October 2010 05:27 (thirteen years ago) link
(i wouldn't ask for a link to an album link btw -- not on the board at least)
this does sound like a demo!
i'm not sure what i think of it
― J0rdan S., Tuesday, 5 October 2010 05:28 (thirteen years ago) link
Lyrics:
I am not the kind of girlWho should be rudely barging in on a white veil occasionBut you are not the kind of boyWho should be marrying the wrong girl
I sneak in and see your friendsAnd her snotty little family all dressed in pastelAnd she is yelling at a bridesmaidSomewhere back inside a room wearing a gown shaped like a pastry
This is surely not what you thought it would beI lose myself in a daydreamWhere I stand and say
Don't say, "Yes"; run away nowI'll meet you when you're out of the church at the back doorDon't wait, or say a single vowYou need to hear me outAnd they said, "Speak Now"
Fond gestures are exchangedAnd the organ starts to play a song that sounds like a death marchAnd I am hiding in the curtainsIt seems that I was uninvited by your lovely bride-to-be
She floats down the aisle like a pageant queenBut I know you wish it was me,You wish it was me, don't you?
Don't say, "Yes"; run away nowI'll meet you when you're out of the church at the back doorDon't wait, or say a single vowYour time is running outAnd they said, "Speak Now"
I hear the preacher say speak now or forever hold your peaceThere's a silenceThere's my last chanceI stand up with shaking handsAll eyes on me.
Horrified looks from everyone in the room But I'm only looking at you
So don't say, "Yes"; run away nowI'll meet you when you're out of the church at the back doorDon't wait, or say a single vowYou need to hear me outAnd they said, "Speak Now"
And you say, "Let's run away now;I'll meet you when I'm out of my tux at the back door.Baby, I didn't say the vowSo glad you were aroundWhen they said, "Speak Now"
― The SBurbs (Alex in Montreal), Tuesday, 5 October 2010 05:32 (thirteen years ago) link
I like the live feel. The melody seems sort of blah at first, but like Mine is grows on you. This is far more awkward charm of Taylor 1.0 than polished Taylor of Fearless - I like this look for her. Also, while some lines are wordier than they might have been with a pro backing her up on songwriting, I quite like "rudely barging in on a white veil occasion."
― The SBurbs (Alex in Montreal), Tuesday, 5 October 2010 05:33 (thirteen years ago) link
*but like "Mine", IT grows on you.
― The SBurbs (Alex in Montreal), Tuesday, 5 October 2010 05:34 (thirteen years ago) link
is it feminist to steal another chick's dude?
― J0rdan S., Tuesday, 5 October 2010 05:34 (thirteen years ago) link
is it holy and puritan and christian to interrupt a wedding? and to take the groom's tux off in the parking lot?
― The SBurbs (Alex in Montreal), Tuesday, 5 October 2010 05:37 (thirteen years ago) link
...and other future posts on Jezebel.
― The SBurbs (Alex in Montreal), Tuesday, 5 October 2010 05:38 (thirteen years ago) link
"And the organ starts to play a song that sounds like a death march"
Oh that is great.
― Brad Nelson (BradNelson), Tuesday, 5 October 2010 05:50 (thirteen years ago) link