Pretty much.
― drop it like it's hot, Elena (HI DERE), Friday, 4 June 2010 15:43 (thirteen years ago) link
If you go back to the NME/Melody Maker reviews of the second Clash album, you actually see pretty much the same arguments [nabisco] is making about casual use of revolutionary violence. It's Joe Strummer's Red Brigade shirt all over again.
― Haunted Clocks For Sale (Dorianlynskey), Friday, 4 June 2010 15:56 (thirteen years ago) link
nabiscos essay is v smart and i agree with it, but can pitchfork not afford em-dashes or something
I once asked Nabisco himself why Pitchfork's style is "blah blah-- excuse me-- blah blah" rather than "blah blah -- excuse me -- blah blah" and he said it had to do with line breaks (you wouldn't want to split one of those double hyphens), but yeah I don't know why they don't just use em-dashes.
― jaymc, Friday, 4 June 2010 16:02 (thirteen years ago) link
i knew you'd be with me on that, jaymc
― max, Friday, 4 June 2010 16:04 (thirteen years ago) link
MIAdashes
― NUDE. MAYNE. (s1ocki), Friday, 4 June 2010 16:04 (thirteen years ago) link
this drives me insane.
― strongohulkingtonsghost, Friday, 4 June 2010 16:05 (thirteen years ago) link
trying to keep up with everybody's great jokes?
― NUDE. MAYNE. (s1ocki), Friday, 4 June 2010 16:06 (thirteen years ago) link
somewhere between lack of em dashes and m.i.a.
― strongohulkingtonsghost, Friday, 4 June 2010 16:10 (thirteen years ago) link
btw this week's Talk Of The Town section finally makes clear that in the New Yorker's style guide, 'douche bag' is written as two words.
― Yes! Yes! Hammerheads! (Jon Lewis), Friday, 4 June 2010 16:13 (thirteen years ago) link
new yorker's style guide is pretty wacky though, right? every issue i come across some new word that has umlauts, apparently. like just last week: "trüffle fries"
― tylerw, Friday, 4 June 2010 16:17 (thirteen years ago) link
Yeah their umlauts crack me up. There's probs a dedicated thread for NYer style I suppose.
― Yes! Yes! Hammerheads! (Jon Lewis), Friday, 4 June 2010 16:19 (thirteen years ago) link
I love their tenacity with the umlauts, like they're worried people will read reentry rather than reëntry and freak out.
― Haunted Clocks For Sale (Dorianlynskey), Friday, 4 June 2010 16:25 (thirteen years ago) link
REEN-tree
― the british must pay for this (HI DERE), Friday, 4 June 2010 16:26 (thirteen years ago) link
COORD-inated.
― Yes! Yes! Hammerheads! (Jon Lewis), Friday, 4 June 2010 16:28 (thirteen years ago) link
"what in the hell does 'kewperate' mean!?"
― tylerw, Friday, 4 June 2010 16:28 (thirteen years ago) link
It has something to do with noted devil dice artist Coop.
― Yes! Yes! Hammerheads! (Jon Lewis), Friday, 4 June 2010 16:29 (thirteen years ago) link
i LOVE the nyt diaeresis, really wish more publications would follow suit
― لوووووووووووووووووووول (lex pretend), Friday, 4 June 2010 16:37 (thirteen years ago) link
Ha, Jaymc, that explanation basically comes from asking Ryan why it's that way -- I think it's a question he's answered a lot. As I recall, the answer goes:
(a) when he started the site, you couldn't count on browsers handling real em-dashes, hence the double hyphens(b) if you spaced them out -- like this -- some browsers would wrap the line between the two hyphens, so it'd be like
blah blah blah -- blah blah blah
(c) so he ran them up against the first word, to fix that
And I guess eventually it just became the kind of quirk you run with? I admit, at this point it'd be kinda weird to me to read Pitchfork and see real em-dashes.
― oɔsıqɐu (nabisco), Friday, 4 June 2010 16:44 (thirteen years ago) link
hey the site didn't have videos of indie bands rambling on about their favorite tacos back then, either. GIVE US EM-DASHES.
― strongohulkingtonsghost, Friday, 4 June 2010 16:52 (thirteen years ago) link
ah since you're here nabisco, i liked your piece, but i still take issue with the "everyone realises that m.i.a. isn't a sophisticated thinker" line - i mean we do, on ilx, but most mainstream media outlets take her persona at unquestioning face value - she says she's a Political Artist with a Serious Message and mostly she gets reported as such, and the message itself or its presentation or most pertinently the actual LACK of message in her material is rarely interrogated. (the reasons for this are pretty interesting - i think a lot of arts editors and even music writers still feel a real need to legitimise pop artists by reporting their "serious"/political sides.) hirschberg wasn't "exposing" m.i.a. to music writers, she was writing for a general audience under the impression that m.i.a. is a sophisticated political artist.
that is all!
― لوووووووووووووووووووول (lex pretend), Friday, 4 June 2010 16:52 (thirteen years ago) link
"she was writing for a general audience under the impression that m.i.a. is a sophisticated political artist"
Who? They believe what?
― Fig On A Plate Cart (Alex in SF), Friday, 4 June 2010 16:56 (thirteen years ago) link
lol wtf Lex
― in my day we had to walk 10 miles in the snow for VU bootleg (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:00 (thirteen years ago) link
most mainstream media outlets take her persona at unquestioning face value -
newsflash - most mainstream outlets take EVERY pop star's persona at unquestioning face value
Lady GaGa is WEIRD fyi!
― in my day we had to walk 10 miles in the snow for VU bootleg (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:01 (thirteen years ago) link
I am still trying to figure out exactly who this audience is, Lex. If you're talking about rabid M.I.A. fans, that probably is an even split between jaded old people who see the pattern in her incoherency that's been played out multiple times of the course of pop/rock music history (The Clash, Morrissey, Rage Against the Machine, Public Enemy and KRS-One all come to mind, let alone more fringy people like Diamanda Galas) and nicheseekers who are going to uncritically love her until she makes a musical misstep or becomes too popular to be a sign of nichedom. If you're talking about people who like "Paper Planes", I would wager a fuckton of money that most of them have no idea and don't care about what her political stances are.
― the british must pay for this (HI DERE), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:03 (thirteen years ago) link
lex OTM, actually.
― I just wish he hadn't adopted the "ilxor" moniker (ilxor), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:04 (thirteen years ago) link
I think nabisco's "everyone" should be read as "everyone who cares".
― the british must pay for this (HI DERE), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:06 (thirteen years ago) link
All those people who have been basing their entire understanding of geopolitics on MIA lyrics can now thank Lynn Hirschberg for blasting the scales from their eyes.
― Haunted Clocks For Sale (Dorianlynskey), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:08 (thirteen years ago) link
i don't think lex was talking about rabid mia fans actually
― call all destroyer, Friday, 4 June 2010 17:08 (thirteen years ago) link
and i think there's prob a decent amount of casual/paper planes fans who have an impression of her as a serious political artist.
― call all destroyer, Friday, 4 June 2010 17:09 (thirteen years ago) link
y'know I've never really understood that phrase - scales? over eyes? what's that about?
don't mind me
xp
― in my day we had to walk 10 miles in the snow for VU bootleg (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:09 (thirteen years ago) link
I don't even know what a serious political artists is.
― Fig On A Plate Cart (Alex in SF), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:10 (thirteen years ago) link
shakey read yr bible
― call all destroyer, Friday, 4 June 2010 17:11 (thirteen years ago) link
How is Diamanda Galás politically incoherent?
― silence is a rhythm too (Turangalila), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:12 (thirteen years ago) link
Bible in vague incoherency shockah (yes I am familiar with the passage ref Saul's blindness)
― in my day we had to walk 10 miles in the snow for VU bootleg (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:15 (thirteen years ago) link
well, denigrating someone's cultural tourism and thievery by being really fucking racist is kind of incoherent in my book (scroll down to "Diamanda vs Timbaland")
― the british must pay for this (HI DERE), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:15 (thirteen years ago) link
Leni Riefenstahl
― in my day we had to walk 10 miles in the snow for VU bootleg (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:16 (thirteen years ago) link
Leni was pretty incoherent.
― Fig On A Plate Cart (Alex in SF), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:18 (thirteen years ago) link
oh well lol if youre asking us to explain some weirdness from the bible. but scales over eyes always sounded really gross to me.
― call all destroyer, Friday, 4 June 2010 17:19 (thirteen years ago) link
@call all destroyer Really? My impression is that most people are so overwhelmingly cynical about politicised musicians - far more so than at any time in the past - that it's hard to believe anyone is taking MIA super-seriously on that level. More the case that they like the music and don't much give a shit if the politics are scrambled. I just don't know who Lex is talking about.
― Haunted Clocks For Sale (Dorianlynskey), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:19 (thirteen years ago) link
short answer is "college students" but really that only lasts for like 18 months
― the british must pay for this (HI DERE), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:20 (thirteen years ago) link
i dunno i think people (esp. younger people) still like the idea of listening to a "political" artist w/out really critically examining what said artist is saying vs. what they are doing etc. imo rage against the machine is a great example of this.
― call all destroyer, Friday, 4 June 2010 17:20 (thirteen years ago) link
mountain climbing, rats, shiny uniforms - it all comes together!
― in my day we had to walk 10 miles in the snow for VU bootleg (Shakey Mo Collier), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:21 (thirteen years ago) link
College students politics are pretty incoherent.
― Fig On A Plate Cart (Alex in SF), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:21 (thirteen years ago) link
Diamanda really bringing the crazy in that letter to Timbaland.
You convert our Gold! into Mr. Fatbro's Fecal Dump, madcow. You the man, P.I.G., and so I got my SUPERNOVA UNCLEAN EYE on you. I got LOTSA time, a whole LIFE of extra time waiting for us to meet. So WATCH OUT. Unlike YOU, I come alone.TA MATIA SOU? 666, mamafucker.
― Haunted Clocks For Sale (Dorianlynskey), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:22 (thirteen years ago) link
i'd like to hear her sing that
― tylerw, Friday, 4 June 2010 17:23 (thirteen years ago) link
I'd like to hear Rodd Keith sing that!
― Yes! Yes! Hammerheads! (Jon Lewis), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:24 (thirteen years ago) link
HI DERE, ah, yeah. I thought you were referring to the AIDS & genocide stuff, which has been prevalent throughout her career. That thing she wrote makes very little sense - maybe senility is finally kicking in.
― silence is a rhythm too (Turangalila), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:24 (thirteen years ago) link
I wasn't going to read the letter, but that quote is making me think I should now.
― Fig On A Plate Cart (Alex in SF), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:24 (thirteen years ago) link
favorite taco is al fresco style with roasted sweet potatoes and/or cassava with lettuce, radish, pickled carrots & a good salsa on a corn tortilla just fyi
― get your bucket of free wings (underrated aerosmith albums I have loved), Friday, 4 June 2010 17:24 (thirteen years ago) link