That's it! The only ism I want to come out of your mouths is jism. Overacademic Bullshit Must Die.

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oh fuck I had a big long paragraph but GODDAMN THAT PIC! *vomits*

(hey! Ironically "Rollin'" just came up on my mixtape THIS VERY SECOND!)

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:10 (twenty-three years ago)

Greil Marcus and Sterling Clover? This is the army you're fighting? Again, any pervasive critical atmosphere that isn't represented in the pages of Rolling Stone, Spin, Vibe, etc. (ie. literally EVERY American pop culture glossy) is hardly pervasive at all. Show me the Rolling Stone article that assumes as much of it's audience as any ESPN column. Christ, ESPN's columns assume more of it's readers POP knowledge than most pop mags. (ie. Peter Gammons doesn't feel the need to explain his Smiths references on the off chance some 13 yr. old won't know what he's talking about).

― James Blount (James Blount), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:10 (twenty-three years ago)

if i knew sports writers put in smiths references my high school years would have been so much easier.

― jess (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:11 (twenty-three years ago)

"One of the major mistakes people make is that they think manners are only the expression of happy ideas. There is a whole range of behavior that can be expressed in a mannerly way. That's what civilization is all about […] In civilization there have to be some restraints. If we followed every impulse, we'd be killing one another."

― Ally (mlescaut), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:12 (twenty-three years ago)

Are on the verge of having a well-thought-out, intellectual argument about the value of well-thought-out, intellectual arguments?

― oops (Oops), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:12 (twenty-three years ago)

THE HORROR!

― James Blount (James Blount), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:12 (twenty-three years ago)

Not if I can do anything about it.

― Ally (mlescaut), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:13 (twenty-three years ago)

you pieces of shit

― jess (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:13 (twenty-three years ago)

There comes a time when you realize that Beavis and Butthead were the most economical and perceptive critics ever.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:14 (twenty-three years ago)

Ned is OTM.

― Ally (mlescaut), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:15 (twenty-three years ago)

hmmm...perhaps I am just Fred Durst ripping apart a cardboard cutout of Janeane Garofalo. But I thought you were allowed to do that on ILM (home of the "damn! I hate that song and its fans!" threads) without the unusual suspects getting so riled. Touchy!

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:15 (twenty-three years ago)

*gets out the violin*

― Ally (mlescaut), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:16 (twenty-three years ago)

it IS horrible. you shouldn't have to justify yr dislike of academia by using its tools.

― oops (Oops), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:16 (twenty-three years ago)

it's tools: language, reason, computers

― James Blount (James Blount), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:17 (twenty-three years ago)

Maybe, maybe not. But why would a book of his criticisms be located in a grade school library (under the 6th - 8th grade section), in that case? And I know he reviewed quite a few obscure-ish artists, but I wouldn't have read those, obviously, so they were in the popular albums' reviews as well.

Of course, with the invasion of the Internet and the fact that almost anything can be Googled into understanding, this point may be at present moot. There was no such thing as the Internet for the average Jane/Joe back then, however. There weren't even computers at the grade school I went to back then. So it wasn't as if I could look up "Robyn Hitchcock" as easily as I could look up "redoubtable" back then, just to name an example.

I just think that when it comes to criticism that would've been read by a wide audience back in the Dark Ages Before the Internet Was Available in Any Public Library, people should've worked hard to not include elements in the opinion piece that would've been damned impossible to look up. Words are one thing -- I mean, everyone in here has had a dictionary in their possession for all eternity, right? Even slightly obscure historical events could've been found out through a quick interrogation of one's favorite history teacher. But trying to figure out who the hell "G.G. Allin" is/was back then -- I think I would've had much better luck finding out through my teachers what happened during the Second Peloponnesian War.

p.s.: I knew who The Smiths were back when I was 13. I should've -- I was a fan of theirs back then. (Still am, in fact. Ever loyal me.)

― Dee the Semi-Lurker (Dee the Lurker), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:18 (twenty-three years ago)

you never see people whine 'sports journalists just write for other sports journalists', and the average sports column assumes alot more of its readers intelligence and interest in sports than the average music column does of its readers interest in music

I'm sorry, the "average sports column" is total dreck! What are you thinking of here?

― Kris (aqueduct), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:19 (twenty-three years ago)

I think I would've had much better luck finding out through my teachers what happened during the Second Peloponnesian War.

These days even the teachers would have to google for that.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:20 (twenty-three years ago)

I first heard about G.G. Allin through an article in my local paper about Squirrel Bait.

― hstencil, Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:21 (twenty-three years ago)

James, why are you so upset about this thread? Good lord. Don't worry, posting stills from the "Heartbreaker" video doesn't count as ludicrious psuedo-intellectualism. The whole thing about the sports column is bizarre, by the way, Kris is OTM.

― Ally (mlescaut), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:21 (twenty-three years ago)

I think that article ran when I was like 11-12 or something.

― hstencil, Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:22 (twenty-three years ago)

So it wasn't as if I could look up "Robyn Hitchcock" as easily as I could look up "redoubtable" back then, just to name an example.

Hey, me neither, but that was part of the fun/mystique! You found out stuff however you could, bit by bit, maybe going through the microfiche Rolling Stone collection at the library, or reading a 100-word review in a Trouser Press guide.

― Jody Beth Rosen (Jody Beth Rosen), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:22 (twenty-three years ago)

"The only possible starting point: the strange fact of one's own invincible apathy—that if the proofs were proved and God presented himself, nothing would be changed. Here is the strangest fact of all.

Abraham saw signs of God and believed. Now the only sign is that all the signs in the world make no difference. Is this God's ironic revenge? But I am onto him."

― Walker Percy (tracerhand), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:24 (twenty-three years ago)

Math is hard!

― Miccio Barbie, Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:25 (twenty-three years ago)

Kris - I'm thinking of how the average page 2 column is gonna be fairly 'impenetrable' to anyone who doesn't follow sports, but how this doesn't hinder them since they assume that hey, if you're reading a sports column, just maybe you're actually interested in (and know something about) sports. They can take certain things as a given and move on from there. Meanwhile most (95% - Miccio: "not enough!") pop journalism is writing for 13 year olds.

― James Blount (James Blount), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:28 (twenty-three years ago)

I did that too, Jody (microfiche, trouser press, under 12, all that). And I ended up as a rock crit person. So did you. Again, it has not been proven that non-rockcrits care to dig this deeply. Or should have to.

I want a miccio barbie so bad.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:28 (twenty-three years ago)

My mo/ther died/when I/was five
And all/I did/was sit/and cry
I cried/and cried/and cried/all day
Until/the neigh/bors went/away

― Madonna (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:28 (twenty-three years ago)

dear Miccio,

I am not a rock critic. I post and read ILM. I don't really care if someone uses "overacademic bullshit" language or not. So quit assuming you speak for anybody else.

Thanks,

hstencil

― hstencil, Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:31 (twenty-three years ago)

Again, it has not been proven that non-rockcrits care to dig this deeply.

Was I a rockcrit when I was 12? No.

Anyway, your argt stinks. "I can't name any --> they don't exist."

― Jody Beth Rosen (Jody Beth Rosen), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:31 (twenty-three years ago)

Miccio, should there be NO music criticism geared toward people who are very interested in music?

― James Blount (James Blount), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:33 (twenty-three years ago)

He states that the right of nature is a system of every man for himself: in essence, man is a self-serving beast at heart like any other, and he will do what is necessary within his own judgment to preserve his own power and existence , or as Hobbes puts it, without a sovereign power to uphold law, "the notions of right and wrong, justice and injustice have there no place." It is an existence of amorality by the standards of those living in a modern society, because in the natural state, man lives by his passions—appetite, desire, love, aversion, hate, joy, and grief—and these passions result in emotions like confidence, anger, covetousness, ambition, lust, and fear, not the more societal constructs of justice and injustice. In the natural structure, man's passions lead to a constant struggle to gain and retain the status of alpha male: "to have servants, is power; to have friends, is power" . The idea of gaining foothold over another human being is, in Hobbes's view, a deeply defined animalistic instinct held by all men equally.

― Overacademic Bullshit (mlescaut), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:35 (twenty-three years ago)

it should be written all good and stuff, Blount.

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:35 (twenty-three years ago)

(look at all the intellectuals squirm!)

― oops (Oops), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:36 (twenty-three years ago)

(yeah you really got us now!)

― hstencil, Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:37 (twenty-three years ago)

(We look smarter when we write in brackets!)

― Ally (mlescaut), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:39 (twenty-three years ago)

( http://www.limpbizkit.com/uploaded_media/Fred%20in%20Wig%20.jpg )

― Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:40 (twenty-three years ago)

(they're parantheses)
/overacademic bullshit

(and like i was talking about you, hstencil)
/good-natured ribbing

― oops (Oops), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:41 (twenty-three years ago)

― James Blount (James Blount), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:42 (twenty-three years ago)

leave my Neuropsych. professor outta this!

― oops (Oops), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:44 (twenty-three years ago)

Your professor is Fred Durst?! Sweet!

― Ally (mlescaut), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:47 (twenty-three years ago)

Nope. My professor is that wig.

― oops (Oops), Tuesday, 20 May 2003 23:51 (twenty-three years ago)

TS: Anthony DeCurtis vs. Skip Bayless?

A: Even my dad knows Skip Bayless is an idiot.

― Kris (aqueduct), Wednesday, 21 May 2003 01:53 (twenty-three years ago)

Page 2 is typical sportswriting like Freaky Trigger is typical pop writing.

― Kris (aqueduct), Wednesday, 21 May 2003 01:56 (twenty-three years ago)

However, I hear Skip Bayless's Mexican restaurants in Chicago are excellent.

― oops (Oops), Wednesday, 21 May 2003 02:56 (twenty-three years ago)

It's Taco Bell or nothing for me

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 21 May 2003 03:02 (twenty-three years ago)

the worst is like, from my current vantage point within academia, the age of theory is over but unfortunately people are sloooow at accepting that b/c if you stake yr career on producing indecipherable postmodern readings that show poof!, the text deconstructs itself (and so what?), you have a pretty strong incentive to keep indecipherable postmodern theory around.
don't get me wrong though, I am all for having a big deleuze rave party inside(and outside) a baroque edifice so we can all revel in the flashing lights and allegories of perception.

― daria g, Wednesday, 21 May 2003 04:16 (twenty-three years ago)

dem is some big words, dem is

― oops (Oops), Wednesday, 21 May 2003 04:19 (twenty-three years ago)

The really fucking funny part is that nobody cited on this thread is "postmodern" in any usable sense.

― Sterling Clover (s_clover), Wednesday, 21 May 2003 04:36 (twenty-three years ago)

yeah, my sides are splitting

― oops (Oops), Wednesday, 21 May 2003 05:02 (twenty-three years ago)

What was meant as a firework thrown in the middle of a boring study hall TWO DAYS ago is now being treated like a serious stance that must be dealt with humorlessly.

If academia has proven anything, it's that throwing a firework into a boring study hall always produces more boring study halls than it does fireworks. Did you really expect us all to say 'shit, he's right!', throw the A through K section of our bookshelves out into the street and never come back?

And Daria, isn't theory the development of ideas? How can you get rid of that in an academic environment?

(and someone please answer one more question: what thread sparked this one? i want to read it)

― Dave M. (rotten03), Wednesday, 21 May 2003 05:57 (twenty-three years ago)

arguing with people who are afraid to say what their point is, classic or dud?

― Ronan (Ronan), Wednesday, 21 May 2003 13:21 (twenty-three years ago)

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