Yo P&J, I'm really happy for you, Imma let you finish, but ILX had the greatest 2009 poll of all time! All time! (2009 ILX Trax Poll Results: TOP TEN TODAY)

fwiw, obviously i _do_ think it's worth taking the time to engage with hip hop; but everybody gotta start somewhere
and the "moralizing" stuff is there solely to suggest why an open minded person of taste might knowingly shy away from working hard to get too acquainted with the underlying meaning of the music; who wants to find out that some griot is actually singing about pro-genocidal tendencies or that the musette is seriously racist

Before I officially looked it up, I had assumed "trap" was a reference to one's domicile, or perhaps neighborhood, esp. as those things pertain to a certain subset of illicit activity. It turns out it basically means "crackhouse." Mind = blown.

to your points on repetition and exposure, I seriously think it's a case of people finding the words difficult to decipher! I know lots of people (white, btw) who would describe themselves as rap fans who can't determine wtf even a relatively clearly articulate rapper like TI is saying. I think for a lot of people the exact lyrics are vastly secondary to beat and flow and, while that's not how I enjoy listening to music, I think it's overly protective to act like that's not a "real" way to appreciate a song.

for better or worse, pillbox's response of "mind=blown" has been the majority one I get with non-hardcore fans. Even (maybe even especially!) among people who work music industry. you goons have a unique and great way of appreciating the genre, but it is absolutely not the way most people do.

This is like that episode of beauty and the geek when the girl asked one of them about how much booty they had got and they were all like 'wtf i've never found pirate treasure, what are you on about crazy girl'

btw thx for the pill linx, forks.

"booty" = slang that originated in the 1920's, long since culturally ubiquitous
"going ham" = slang that originated in the 2000's, not generally well known

i'm just looking to make converts. i know i'm corny. but i like the music!

^one for posts v. much in character btw

the thing about food metaphors in rap songs is that they're mostly pretty boneheaded and suface-level anyway, so people treating them like a secret handshake to some profound inner meaning to the song need to chill the fuck out

i mean it's not really the same thing as knowing how apartheid informed District 9 tbh

so people treating them like a secret handshake to some profound inner meaning to the song need to chill the fuck out

― alf shumway (some dude), Sunday, January 31, 2010 4:16 PM (2 minutes ago)

tbf this was more a mischaracterization of what we (or at least i) were saying than the actual argument

"HMMM WOW A RAP SONG ABOUT AN INDEPENDENT COFFEE HOUSE. SUCK ON THIS STARBUCKS!" or "HMMM A RAP SONG ABOUT LUNCH MEAT!"

how is that new paul barman album anyway?

i mean part of the charm of "coffee shop" is obviously how everyone including yung joc can pretend it's about a coffee shop, right, though granted the humour here is dependent on knowing that it's not

i guess, it's kinda hard to tell what's going on after the ridiculous dogpile

yeah it's just...that's why good slang is good slang!

there is charm in "coffee shop"?

it sounds like a nursery rhyme, you'd think charm is at least part of what they're going for

i think it is a nursery rhyme

right but i mean they fail obv

terius wrote that hook i'm pretty sure

would explain a lot!

i.e. catchiness

http://charm.urbanup.com/4137706
http://slang.urbanup.com/962557

trying to imagine how a neophyte would make any sense out of the food oriented imagery in hip hop
http://tbohiphop.net/upload/files/18/pics/GucciMane.jpg
To say nothing of the arm and hammer pendant.

ah, here it is
http://www.radricdavis.com/images/gucci-mane-chains.jpg

the better drug reference chain is his egg beater one

sorry for joining this stupid dogpile, but can I just draw a distinction between a casual rap fan like pillbox not getting it (perfectly ok) and a rap thread regular like forks not getting it (kinda willful)

Suprisingly, cooking up stovetop crack looks a lot like cooking stovetop oatmeal to my eyes (at least judging from the Trap Goin' Ham vid). Never cooked up crack myself so I can't say how closely the vid hews to the reality of actually cooking up some crack.

ha, ok, i never got the egg beater chain link! i just thought it was a lol gucci is awesome chain idea.

forks and pillbox, i take it all back.

hmm just realised i don't know whether young dro's constant seafood references are slang or not, have been happily assuming he just likes tilapia a lot

..happily assuming he just likes tilapia a lot

or how about:

Me and Eric B, and a nice big plate of
Fish, which is my favorite dish

Is Rakim *really* talking about condoms filled w/ heroin here?

haha, no that's yams, not fish!
but maybe we should discuss fishscale now

lols at "StoveTop Crack"

If you are referring to the rarefied variety of cocaine that is the titular subject of the 2006 Ghostface album, than I, sir, am hip to your jargon.

i hereby call this meeting of the music nerd/street slang society to a close. seconded?

"

you shoould have heard hundreds of songs that reference "trap"

yeah this is what i meant.

think why people have a chip on their shoulder about people tipping a toe into hip hop is that your enjoyment of increases expodentially with immersion. it's endlessly recursive and presents, defines, its innovations in the face of all that went before it.

it's not like, "this sounds a bit like sonic youth"

In my defense, I'm not actually the rap noob that I'm coming across as. For years I was all about golden age/native tongues/backpacker/indie type stuff & I still like some of that (the Finale record was on my top albums list), but it has only been in the last five years or so that I've embraced post-mid-90s hardcore/gangsta stuff (which I had avoided for ethical reasons which were probably pretentious to begin with, but seemed esp. negligible when I realized a lot of the stuff I was missing out on was totally slammin). And it has only been since about the release of Underground Kingz that I've taken an especial interest in dirty south stuff, new & old, so yeah, I'm def a novice to the sub-genre in which the word "trap" would typically be exchanged, tho not necessarily so to rap as a whole.

gatekeeping in full effect itt!

finale record is real good, but i think i picked up a bad mix or rip, the vocals don't stand out like i think they're supposed to, either that or i can't seem to focus on them. been meaning to pick up another copy so thanks for the reminder. if you ever see that EA advert with Pete Rock, check out his T-shirt!

the opposite jabba imo

xxp: duly noted

now my turn to look ignorant. what is Finale?

detroit rapper, production by black milk, dilla, detroit usual suspects

funny how detroit picked up where NY fell off, gives creedence to dallas penn's "most hip hop cities in america" theory where the more fucked you are, the better the hip hop

album A Pipedream and a Promise

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLUBqx1tGWk

i can go for really long periods of time without understanding rap slang after i've been exposed to it. sometimes the metaphors are too obvious to ignore, but sometimes it's kind of a fun mystery.

i think people itt are giving ESOM a much harder time than it deserves. yes there's at least two too many hova verses, and they do get worse as the song goes on, but it's a fully functional pop song that's fun to listen to mostly because of the great chorus but also because of the bouncy, sunny beat. i don't agree with number one single of the year, and i'd probably prefer if it were out of the ILM top 10, but can we just admit it's not a bad song? sometimes people here are too grumpy for their own good.