Taking Sides: ACHTUNG BABY by U2 VS. MONSTER by R.E.M

I just got Achtung Baby a few months ago, after many many years of generally dismissing U2 (although I always liked "Discotheque" and one or two other things). It's rapidly become one of my favorite listens, to the point where I fear I may have to give it the victory here, and I'm speaking as a longtime apologist for Monster. The comparison between the two unfortunately brings the flaws of REM's record into focus. What makes AB so good is that U2 brings a strong set of songs to a slight but significant tweak in their sound; REM seems to hope that a totally different sound will write the songs for them. Monster has many good songs spiced throughout, but a lot of times Buck is just leaning on the tremolo pedal and betting that something cool will happen. (One suspects that they needed to do a big tour to let material grow more organically - New Adventures In Hi-Fi, pretty much written and recorded on the Monster tour blows Zooropa out of the water, and can take Achtung in a fair fight.)

Achtung's production, for the most part, is a thickened-up (sometimes spaced-out) modernized version of U2 circa "Gloria," nearly completely bypassing the obnoxious Joshua Tree crap that put me off of them for so long.

It's got its downfalls - there's a sameyness to several tracks, to where you wonder if it's necessary to have "The Fly" AND "Until The End of the World" AND "Acrobat" on the same album ("Until The End of the World" clearly wins the category). But the dizzy disco ripple of "Even Better Than The Real Thing," the punchy gospel of "Mysterious Ways," and the wide-open lament of "So Cruel" - these are some fucking excellent songs! Monster for its part has, again, some great tracks, but most of them are working the same sonic territory (with the exception of "Tongue" and "Strange Currencies") making it feel much more like some sort of genre exercise than a major statement.

As for the posturing involved, miccio pretty much nails it with "You want to punch Bono in the sunglasses, you want REM to just take the damn things off and stop kidding themselves."

Eventually I'll probably overdose on Achtung and not want to hear it for ages, at which point they'll probably be about equal as things I pull out every once in a while and go "Hey, this is a lot better than I remember!"

More overuse of the word "irony." I don't see how R.E.M. deciding to do more of a rock album after Out of Time and Automatic for the People was in the least ironic.

http://rem.sk/news/monster.jpg

I used to have a poster of this, in black and white. REM - tough kids from the mean streets of Athens, GA??? It's just so out of touch with their previous "image" that one wants to read it as some sort of literate, deliberate posture rather than a sincere sell...

. . . and a couple hundred more in the back.!

That's my favorite part of the song! It's one of those stupid ideas executed brilliantly, with diminishing returns, as the years went on.

An even better thread idea might be to compare the albums' first singles: "The Fly" vs "What's the Frequency, Kenneth?" At the time I was less prepared for the U2 song.

Monster's ringers: "You," "Circus Envy," "Bang and Blame."

Prediction: There will come a day when "The Fly" is your favorite song on Achtung Baby. This is what happens.

i like the idea of r.e.m. fans across the country returning en masse a week after monster came out to sell their no-longer-wanted copies

Whereas REM was coming off their Joshua Tree.

this broke my brain.

This kind of leads in the direction of ultimately giving REM more long-term credit, insofar as, even though their albums have gotten less and less consistent, they've steadfastly refused to do a "they've returned to their classic sound!" record - even going so far as to release "Bad Day" just to prove that they could still do it if they wanted to. Whereas, after Pop, U2 seemed to realize they had taken the whole ironic, Euro, dancey, electronicafied, whatever thing, as far as they could...and then couldn't think of anything else so they just went for what they knew wouldn't fail to sell records on Beautiful Day or whatever it was called.

As for whether or not it was an "ironic" period, I'll grant that for REM it's a lot more debateable, but, seriously, PopMart?

Best Album Since Blood On The Tracks

-Bands that became popular in the 1980s

-Bands consisting only of white men

-Bands whose names lack lowercase letters

-Bands whose newest record is consistently "hailed as their best since the last one mattered"

-Bands whose entire discography is owned by my dad

-Bands who I listened to a lot in junior high

-Bands whose music features guitars and drums and a bass and vocals, either in concert or separately

-Bands who have been on the cover of Time magazine

totally off-topic, but i remeber seeing a feelies/rem show at the Felt Forum (lol, what a great name for a concert venue, amirite?) circa 1987. feelies didn't make much of an impression, rem were pretty good, but i had started to lose interest at that point (the Superman album) and then stipe did an ultra-diva pose late in the concert when some teens up front were pushing close to the stage - they walked off and never came back!! i guess they thought it was too dangerous/possibility of someone being crushed or something, but it easily could have been handled by security. that really ended the rem phase of my youth

Always seems important to register dissent re. this position. : D

I wouldn't say Depeche Mode were approaching this sound by "Violator". "Songs Of Faith And Devotion" was very obviously an attempt to sound like "Achtung Baby" era U2, but "Violator" is more of a classic "dark" electropop album, which has also been the case with all of their post SOFAD-efforts.

monster for me is listenable, but fairly forgettable. it doesn't have a great deal of consistency or even a particular standout track (ok, maybe 'crush with eyeliner') to make me reflect on it when it's not playing. i've tried to revisit it a couple of times, but never seem to get more than a minimal kick out of it.

achtung baby is a strange record for me. it really does seem to be built around a few very good songs ('mysterious ways', 'one', 'acrobat', 'the fly') while the rest are either interesting ('love is blindness') or completely expendable ('so cruel', 'trying to throw your arms around the world'). the whole thing sounds great, and when the better tracks merge with the slick production, the record truly shines. really, a bizarre instance of an album where i treasure the highlights and tend to overlook the impact of the weaker tracks, perhaps because they're largely inoffensive and unmemorable. somehow it remains relatively untarnished and a landmark of early 90s rock.

This is OTM in every way. Add "Imitation Of Life" to "Bad Day", though. One of the great "eighties" R.E.M. songs.

(Ha, Just noticed the coincidence with the titles: "Beautiful Day" and "Bad Day" both being attempted -- and successful -- returns to form.)

And - and this is important - the last two U2 records are not returns to their 80s style. The U2 of the 80s were a mainly riff-based rock band, with The Edge's guitar playing the obvious centrepiece of everything, while the U2 of the oughties is more of a melodic pop band, heavily influenced by the classic songwriting style of the Britpop bands.
I obviously prefer the latter, which is why the last two U2 albums have been my favourite albums by then ever.

I'm a Zooropa guy. Though I believe gear (obv. not Geir) will occasionally post in defense of Pop.

Geir, I agree that the last two records are not "returns to form," and I even think They've got some of Teh Edge's coolest playing, but what you're overlooking is that they're also boring and irrelevant. They're like the greatest Remy Zero records ever.

http://cache.kotaku.com/gaming/bono_takes_two.jpg

"...and y'know, I also think we need to sort out the environment because people are affected by that too and...what's this?... Alright, then, Geir has told me that I'm not supposed to talk about the environment. Just stick to poverty, yeah."

"By the way, did anyone buy that song we did with Green Day?... You did? Fookin' suckers!"

"in the wake of the 9/11 attacks, for which their music was often used as an inspirational backdrop."

while the U2 of the oughties is more of a melodic pop band, heavily influenced by the classic songwriting style of the Britpop bands "Acrobat" by U2