Swans: Classic or Dud?

Yup.

the new angels of light is fucking awesome by the way

I love SWANS.

Alex in NYC OTM.

I refuse to be forced to choose between any of their sounds/periods (early! cathartic! melodic! apocalyptic!) though. They all rule in their own way.

Cheers, Alex! I was just thinking of Swans today while walking around outside on my lunch break, funnily enough. I started singing that lyric "Nothing inside you is real" from "You're Not Real, Girl". It was the only thing that kindof shook me out of a bad mood, today.

A few months ago at work, I was immersed in "Holy Money" when my coworker appeared at the door of my cube, grinning. I removed my headphones, and she said, "Didn't you hear the fire alarm? Didn't you leave the building?"

Immolated in a sterile grey cubical, while the coworkers wander off... Would have been a Giraesque way to go.

COP!

The sex in your soul will damn you to hell

Feel Good Now version of "Sex God Sex" is epic.

Feel Good Now version of "Sex God Sex" is epic.

Just to be clear again, Swans were not Goths. Ever.

Classic. Personally their one of the most important bands in regards to what I’m interested in. Children of God and Filth should be in everyones collections.

I'll say it again...

I LOVE SWANS

Just to be clear again, Swans were not Goths. Ever.

While this is technically true, I never knew an 80s goth who didn't have much love for Swans, and Jarboe brought the goth flavor to the stage throughout The Great Annihilator tour. They certainly transcend the genre, but the overlap is pretty undeniable.

Swans are less goth than Killing Joke, but like Killing Joke, they're still only a few steps away from goth proper.

the first two world of skin albums were totally goth. in a good way. i think i talked about the goth/swans thing on some thread. maybe this one. swans/gira still one of the few acts where i love/loved EVERYTHING they/he did. can't say that about too many people. jarboe on her own can be hit or miss (depending on who she is collaborating with), but she's put out some amazing post-swans stuff too.

Scott, have you heard the Blackmouth disc that's her and two of the guys from Trust/Obey? V. good, been a while since I've listened -- might dig it out here tonight!

nope, never heard it. she has lots of stuff i haven't heard. i still want to get her mystery of faith swans/skin comp too. and i'm curious about her men album. had blixa on it and alan from low doing a song with her. i really liked her anhedoniac album. crazy stuff. the early stuff i wasn't that big on. the 13 masks album and the beautiful people ltd. album. kinda patchy.

i liked the neurosis/jarboe album too. i thought that was really cool.

my love is for the Sacrificial Cake album that Alternative Tentacles put out. Anhedonic is cool too, only listened to it once so far. I saw her in a church on this tour:

MOBILIZATION TOUR 2006 (Blixa Bargeld, Jarboe, Savage Republic)

She had a piano player and another guitarist, played some Swans songs even!

also she has great early cassette noise stuff like on the first Dry Lungs comp.

I think it's hilarious the way Alex always feels the need to play Goth Police around here. It's even more hilarious because honestly I don't care if EVERY band is goth, Swans included! But you know, to each his own.

I met a guy last week at my work who had a Neurosis/Jarboe shirt on. Ah, the benefits of no dress code.

While this is technically true, I never knew an 80s goth who didn't have much love for Swans

I knew a bona fide Goth that liked Chris DeBurgh --- does that make Mr."Lady In Red" a goth too, then?

you knew one bona fide goth who liked Chris DeBurgh

you & I both went to Swans shows and saw the places packed out to the walls with goths

in your heart you know I'm right!

"I knew a bona fide Goth that liked Chris DeBurgh --- does that make Mr."Lady In Red" a goth too, then?"

It was late at night on the open road, speeding like a man on the run
A lifetime spent preparing for the journey.
He is closer now and the search is on, reading from a map in the mind:
Yes there's that ragged hill and there's a boat on the river.

And when the rain came down, he heard a wild dog howl
There were voices in the night
(Don't do it!)
Voices out of sight
(Dont't do it!)
Too many men have failed before, whatever you do;

Don't pay the ferryman!
Don't even fix a price!
Don't pay the ferryman
Until he gets you to the other side.

In the rolling mist, then he gets on board, now there'll be no turning back
Beware that hooded old man at the rudder.
And then the lightning flashed and the thunder roared,
and people calling out his name,
And dancing bones that jabbered-and-a-moaned on the water.

And then the ferryman said "There is trouble ahead,
So you must pay me now."
(Don't do it!)
"You must pay me now."
(Don't do it!)
And still that voice came from beyond, whatever you do;

Don't pay the ferryman!
Don't even fix a price!
Don't pay the ferryman
Until he gets you to the other side.

http://swans.pair.com/GALLERY/87/1987jarboe2.html

what happened to mine image, BB code is totally non-goth

http://swans.pair.com/GALLERY/87/1987jarboe2.html

i joined jarboe's swans e-mail list in 1999 and most of the people on it were definitely more on the industrial side of things than the goth side. i have to say, they were almost all very brainy folks who listened to all kinds of music. but definitely HUGE love for the whole current 93/coil/NWW world on there. and also swans-like crescendo-rock like mogwai and godspeed and the like. and godflesh. what you would expect, i guess. probably lots of goth stuff too. i can't remember. beauty = darkness, etc. i have no problem with swans being goth-friendly or goth-identified. call them whatever you like. i prefer the term "freak folk" myself.

The second I hit "submit response," I *JUST KNEW* someone was going to cite "Don't Pay The Ferryman." CHRIS DEBURGH IS A GOTH, OKAY, I ADMIT IT!

I also knew a kid in college who was a total hardcore punk, but also loved Rush -- i.e. DOES THIS MAKE RUSH A HARDCORE PUNK BAND???

The answer: Fuck no.

Look, yes -- Swans' audiences were crawling with Goths, certainly. Does that make the band goth? Not necessarily. I'll admit that Jarboe added an element to the proceedings that leant uncomfortably towards that crowd, but Michael Gira is no goth -- never was, never will be.

At the end of the day, I suppose it really depends on one's definition of "Goth." As far as I'm concerned, wearing black and having a less than cheeful sensibility shouldn't *AUTOMATICALLY* render one a "goth."

Michael Gira is no goth

Well, of course I agree with this; as I say, I think they transcend the label, which carries all kinds of only-and-exclusively-about-itself connotations. But in the goth family tree, they're a near branch - nearer than the Gun Club, say, but a little further out than the Fields of the Nephilim. The old saying about knowing a man by the company he keeps applies. If we wanted to posit a Non-Silly Goth category that would help, but really all we'd be doing is repeating the old saw about 90% of everything being crap. I mean: emo sucks, right? But Rites of Spring didn't suck at all, even though they're emo as fuck.

Fair enough.

i think for almost anything that was at one time labelled "industrial" you've got a goth fanbase of some size. skinny puppy, neubaten, etc.

crescendo-rock

Ha ha! Is Southern Gothic goth? That one's always confused me.

I wonder if anyone remembers "Public Castration Is A Good Idea", another live (and double) album like "Feel Good Now". Strangely I don't remember anything about it at all, except that it had material from the first part of their career. I do remember that the sleeve was gray at its base with yellow and silver put in or something like that. Damn I wish I had that LP now!

I saw someone recently somewhere on the net who said they couldn't concentrate on Cop if they tried or some paraphrased thing like that, and I totally agreed. Cop is hard to bear, even though I love everything else they've done. Except I admit the first EP is a totally different thing and rather dull, as it happens.

yep - just listened to it about a month ago too

http://swans.pair.com/IMG_PRODUCTS/public.jpg

Fuck goddamnit yeah
HOW I MISS THE VINYL!
I MIGHT CRY!

( review by Mr. Ned)

Who doesn't like Cop?!?!?!?

Public Castration... is now quite rare (as are -- sadly -- many albums in their catalog).

...but, I should point out, it can be had it its unwieldly entiretly (sonically, at least) via iTunes.

entirety

Does anybody get made very very sleepy by early Swans (which is so beautiful I could never force myself to listen to the later stuff, I only have an imagined version in my head but some things can't be corrupted). Seriously, Cop is really relaxing, the louder the better, obv.

Haven't listened to it for years, but, yes, I can see what you mean. Works like massage.

I fell asleep at a bus stop once with it on my headphones. I had to walk three hours in the dark to get home (I got cold hitching) with a bag.

probably of interest:

http://www.theomegaorder.com/s.nl/it.A/id.18990/.f

Nice.

Yesterday a copy of Anonymous Bodies sold on eBay for $160...

I couldn't really get in to the J2 album. Not like I got into the Neurosis/Jarboe album. I think I was hoping for more rock and less Justin as beatscaper stuff.

has anybody seen that youtube video where some guy has put Cop to a slideshow of Paris Hilton photos

I FINALLY GOT SWANS ARE DEAD I FINALLY GOT SWANS ARE DEAD I FINALLY GOT SWANS ARE DEAD I FINALLY GOT SWANS ARE DEAD I FINALLY GOT SWANS ARE DEAD I FINALLY GOT SWANS ARE DEAD I FINALLY GOT SWANS ARE DEAD I FINALLY

Good, innit?

Fuck yeah are you kidding? I'm flipping my lid.