Dylan's Christian period

I don't take Dylan as a theologian particularly seriously. As far as the lyrics go from this period, what I like is how mystified Dylan seems by what he's saying. There's conviction there, but whatever he experienced, his lyrical voice was having trouble expressing.

I like the music on Saved a lot more than on Slow Train Coming, on the whole. I think Wexler understood Dylan's vision better on this one.

Shot of Love > Slow Train Coming > Saved

and yeah, the humor on Slow Train Coming is puzzling in the context of this, like, topically heavy album. "Man Gave Names To All The Animals" is a dopey lyric, like a Basement Tapes lyric without the double entendres. But it's still good for a simple laugh. It's corny but that's our Bob.

"Shot of Love > Slow Train Coming > Saved" seems to be the conventional wisdom and I get why that is, but anyone reading who has ears, let them hear Saved again. Although I've tried for years to buy it on CD and never succeeded in finding it.

Has "Saved" been remastered? I've actually never owned it! My older brother had it ...

eMusic has Saved - but I don't know if it's been remastered. I think Saved is better than Slow Train - and the production is definitely a lot less sterile.

I remember hating "Gotta Serve Somebody" in 1979, but I heard it on the radio the other night and thought it sounded great. I love the combination of the air-tight production and that creepy, menacing vocal. I've always resisted getting these albums but I might have to add them on eMusic.

I love the combination of the air-tight production and that creepy, menacing vocal.

yeah this is the kinda contrast (intentional or not) that finally got me to appreciate Steely Dan - this shiny, sleek, perfectly constructed light pop that's set against an actively creepy but sorta funny narrative/singer

Dylan's music is missing the harmonic complexity and jazzy solos of the Steely Dan though - with this kind of production it ends up sounding more like Dire Straits than Steely Dan, unfortunately.

I generally like the slickness of Slow Train, I think it does have a kind of menace to it.

Elsewhere, some of the surreal, Book of Revelations meets Highway 61 lyrics are really incredible -- stuff like the aforementioned 'Angelina', "Caribbean Wind", "Foot of Pride", "Jokerman" etc. Really weird, ambitious writing ...

yeah I'm going to make an extended dive into Bob's 80s this week I think, looking for more of the confusion that's grabbing me on these. By the 2000s I think he's figured out his new lyrical voice and that's probably my favorite Bob overall but I'm intrigued at present by the struggle for a new voice after Street-Legal (I need a copy of Budokan too I think).

Budokan has its moments, but overall it's pretty limp. The later US 1978 tour is waaaay better. Look for the Hush Sweet Charlotte bootleg ...

Dylan's music is missing the harmonic complexity and jazzy solos of the Steely Dan though - with this kind of production it ends up sounding more like Dire Straits than Steely Dan, unfortunately.

OTM -- what I was trying to say upthread.

sounding more like Dire Straits than Steely Dan, unfortunately.

def. the sound of Dire Straits (dunno how unfortunate that is)

A sound I would, of course, expect from the producer of Slow Train Coming.

No, wait -- Knopfler didn't produce STC.

Wexler ennit. altho Dylan specifically was going for Knopfler's sound and wanted him originally iirc

Doesn't Knopfler play on Slow Train, though? Or am I making that up.

He sure does, which explains my confusion (he did produce Infidels).

I said that Wexler better figures out Dylan's vision on Saved than on Slow Train Coming, but a better way to put what I was trying to express is: Wexler helped Dylan realize a better sound for the vision Dylan had, such as they understood it, on Saved than on Slow Train Coming. Dylan may not have agreed, since he dumped Wexler for Plotkin on Shot of Love and then, yeah, Knopfler for Infidels.

This topic has provided the only praise that I have ever seen for the 'Christian' period of Bob Dylan.

I think you'll find that serious (haha) Dylan fans have plenty of good stuff to say about this period. Obviously the evangelism of the lyrics is always going to be a turn-off for some, but it really is a fascinating time for Dylan.

The cover art is great too:

http://www.earthwaverecords.com/pictures/albumimg/d/a0115351.jpg

haha, that cover is nutso. you'd think it was some super-obscure private-press xtian rock record from 1977. But no, it's a BOB DYLAN record.

There's conviction there, but whatever he experienced, his lyrical voice was having trouble expressing.

That sounds about right. The songs seem to be either literal renderings of scripture or these terrifically confused metaphors.

Count me as a fan of Budokan (since someone referenced it upthread)--to a point. It seems like a bit of a conceptual coup, actually: rendering his '60s songs, including some protest numbers, as fully-arranged, showstopping Vegas numbers. Actually it sort of anticipates his Perry Como-esque Xmas album in its nonchalant mindfuckery.

Also, I thought the brief segment w/Christian Bale in I'm Not There captured this era of Dylan pretty well/amusingly. Although I am not a big fan of that film as a whole.

Yeah, I actually thought that the I'm Not There/Christian (!) Bale segment was the most successful in that movie. Just the utter sincerity of Bale's performance caught something vital about this period in Dylan's career. Of course, the sincerity is just another mask, but it's maybe one of the more convincing masks.

you guys are nuts that movie is awesome

"look its Allen Ginsberg!"

oh i liked it! it's like catnip for Dylan nerds.

did you guys catch moondog in the greenwich village sequence??

i've been trying to get my gf (not a Dylan nerd) to watch it so I can get a neutral assessment

yeah i honestly don't think anyone not steeped (DEEPLY steeped) in Dylan lore would get a whole lot out of the movie. Maybe I'm wrong ...

Film nerds, maybe ...

btw i'm not kidding about moondog, haynes sticks a guy in a moondog costume in one of the quick panning shots of the early '60s village. i kind of want to hug haynes for that.

I saw the film with two folks I wouldn't really characterize as Dylan nerds (ie, my wife and an old gay buddy of ours) and they both really dug it. They don't hate his music or anything but they're hardly obsessives (y'know my wife has some sorta weird childhood associations with Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid, buddy likes early 70s Dylan, etc.)

I think I was the only one of the three of us who was excited about all the detail/ephemera tho.

and yeah I spotted Moondog

yeah it's possible that I actually didn't appreciate the movie as a "movie" just because of the Dylan trivia overload that is practically every frame.

I didn't enjoy it as much the second time - it kinda lacks some narrative motion, there's no real arc to it. But it is fun and I love that Haynes does this kind of thing (I am also a big fan of Velvet Goldmine)

it was real splashy and my immediate reaction was overstimulation and enthusiasm, but within minutes i was like, "what was that all about?" and my impression began to sour. i should see it again.

I've still not seen the film (or heard the soundtrack, though I'm less excited about the latter---I fell for too many tributes in the 90s)...mostly because I don't watch any films these days. I'll try to check it out in the next few years, though; I've heard lots good about it.

Soundtrack has some duds, but is overall pretty good. Willie Nelson w/ Calexico doing "Senor" is probably my fave.

oh "Angelina" is really great, isn't it? The organ playing is terrific, and overall the playing is very sympathetic to what Dylan is trying to get across: a lament, presumably for a woman; but it's much more sympathetic to the woman than his 60s songs about women (and more sympathetic than the Blood on the Tracks too I think). Her relationship with God is confusing Dylan: she's surrounded by God's angels, but she doesn't seek God, exactly. But Bob isn't sure about his relationship to her: she can read his mind, but she's wearing a blindfold too. There is too much occlusion, but he'll do anything for her in God's truth.

oh man it's so good.
Do I need your permission to turn the other cheek?
If you can read my mind, why must I speak?

A Better Contract: November 16, 1979 @ Warfield, SF...wow. Dylan's singing on "I Believe In You" sounds like it comes from a very deep place, like crying somehow expressed as a moaning shout. There are none of the "greatest hits" on this show: just the new gospel songs, and the playing is hot; not so different from the 1978 live sound (that we talked about sorta recently on the Street-Legal thread), but more focused. The crowd seems into it, too!

What ferocious courage he has! his preaching at the end of "Precious Angel", going into "Slow Train", about how the world is going to be destroyed & Christ is going to set up his kingdom in Jerusalem for a thousand years; & after the crowd erupts he asks, "Do you believe those things?" and they just shout back, & it's hard to tell what they really think. But I'd gather that a typical Dylan show in San Francisco is not going to attract a lot of people believing those things. It's pretty in-your-face!

i don't think i've heard that one -- is it a good recording?
euro tour from 1981 is probably the best gospel-era tour recordings I've heard.

The only boot from that era I have is Rock Solid - the Massey Hall 1980 show. Absolute stunner.

yeah, that's a killer show -- the 81 stuff is a little less fire n brimstone (he mixes in older material), but the arrangements/band are very nice.

The recording is pretty ace, as far as I can hear---they could put it on a Bootleg Series. Actually a comp of this with the Massey Hall show would make a great Bootleg Series.

yeah, a gospel bootleg series would be welcome. one of the rare pre neverending tour eras not represented by a live album ... guess there's no official petty/dylan live album.

The 30th anniversary show is a Dylan/Petty show of sorts, no?

My band is actually working up a version of “Man Gave Names...” It’s not a song we find stupid, or funny or whatever. We just like it.

Cool, please post at some point. For some dark reason, my computer will no longer let me post YouTubes, but
here's this round-up (it's also on spotify, apple, play)
https://www.google.com/search?q=Townes+Van+Zandt+Man+Gave+Names+To+All+The+Animals&oq=Townes+Van+Zandt+Man+Gave+Names+To+All+The+Animals&aqs=chrome..69i57.31557j0j1&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

shot of love may be the best one of these, and i love them all! "property of jesus," what a jam!!!!

eh idk if it's the *best*... I mean, it has Lenny Bruce on it

count me among the few weirdos who likes "lenny bruce." the lyric is.... yeah, but the arrangement feels kinda proto-paul westerberg solo somehow

trouble no more is, forgive me, a revelation

shot of love may be the best one of these, and i love them all! "property of jesus," what a jam!!!!

― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson),

Pleasantly ephemeral -- I like the gutbucket mix. "Every Grain of Sand" and "in the Summertime" though.

"every grain of sand" has been one of my fav dylan songs ever since i heard emmylou harris' cover, i was happy to love his version. "in the summertime" is amazing. heavy van morrison energy to these records (i guess it's all the gospel?)

supposedly there's a Clash version of "In the Summertime" with a howling Joe Strummer plonking away on the piano

I mixed this down to a wieldy 4hrs w/ segues and some other odds-and-ends, it never leaves my phone

hmu anybody if you would like!

https://i.imgur.com/zqquwMw.jpg

1 Ain't No Man Righteous, No Not One Take 6
2 When He Returns Take 2
3 Slow Train Toronto April 18-19 1980
4 Dead Man, Dead Man Outtake
5 Making a Liar Out of Me Rehearsal
6 Are You Ready? Toronto April 18-19 1980
7 Ain't Gonna Go to Hell for Anybody Toronto April 18-19 1980
8 Watered-Down Love Outtake
9 When You Gonna Wake Up? Oslo, July 9
10 You Changed My Life Take 4
11 Do Right To Me Baby Toronto April 18-19 1980
12 Cover Down, Pray Through Toronto April 18-19 1980
13 Stand By Faith Rehearsal
14 Gotta Serve Somebody Bad Segeberg [July 15]
15 In the Summertime Boston [October 21]
16 Groom's Still Waiting at the Altar Take 2
17 Precious Angel Toronto April 18-19 1980
18 Solid Rock Toronto April 18-19 1980
19 I Believe in You Toronto April 18-19 1980
20 Shot of Love Outtake
21 City of Gold San Francisco, CA, November 22
22 Gonna Change My Way of Thinking Memphis [January 31]
23 What Can I Do For You? Toronto April 18-19 1980
24 Man Gave Names To All The Animals London, June 27
25 Slow Train London [June 29]
26 Caribbean Wind Rehearsal (pedal Steel)
27 Jesus Is The One Lorelei, Germany, July 17
28 Rise Again Rehearsal
29 Knockin' On Heaven's Door London, June 27
30 Saving Grace Toronto April 18-19
31 Radio Spot Portland, January 1980
32 Blowin' In The Wind London, June 27
33 Gotta Serve Somebody London, June 27
34 When He Returns Toronto April 18-19
35 Thief On The Cross New Orleans, LA, November 10
36 Covenant Woman Take 3
37 Dead Man, Dead Man London, June 27, 1981
38 Trouble in Mind Take 1
39 Pressing On Take 1
40 Blessed Is The Name Santa Monica [November 20]
41 Groom's Still Waiting at the Altar San Francisco [November 13]
42 Solid Rock San Diego [November 1981]/Philadelphia [October 1979]
43 I Believe In You London, June 27
44 Ballad of a Thin Man London, June 27
45 Shot of Love Avignon [July 25]
46 Help Me Understand Soundcheck
47 Caribbean Wind San Francisco [November 12]
48 Ye Shall Be Changed Outtake
49 Every Grain of Sand Rehearsal
50 Slow Train San Francisco [November 16]
51 Gotta Serve Somebody Take 1
52 Band Introduction London, June 27, 1981
53 Like a Rolling Stone London, June 27, 1981
54 Pressing On Toronto April 18-19

Pressing On is my jam

also one of the few songs from this period where I actually think the album version is the best one

Trouble No More is the perfect soundtrack to these times. "When you gonna wake up?"

coming at you chinaski

D/l now - should keep me plenty busy. An immense thank you.

"caribbean wind" is a great song, should've been on shot of love

The cry of the peacock, flies buzz my head
Ceiling fan broken, there’s a heat in my bed
Street band playing “Nearer My God to Thee”
We met at the steeple where the mission bells ring
She said, “I know what you’re thinking, but there ain’t a thing
You can do about it, so let us just agree to agree”

fuckin amazing

xxp you're welcome!

every time i hear "when he returns," no matter the arrangement, studio or live, it's the best song i've ever heard, but the live version with the burning organ on it and the second studio take on trouble no more really hammer it home

Yeah, Caribbean Wind has an amazing cinematic quality to it like some of the stuff off Desire.

Those lines Brad quoted are nearly a screenplay.

just watched the trouble no more film! bob's harmonica solo during "what can i do for you?"! literally transcendent

That is one of my favorite things of this entire period. Like he is channelling the holy spirit.

Fuck yeah brad otm wrt Caribbean Wind, just floored me the first time I heard it on Biograph

i know i said upthread that shot of love was maybe the best of these but that was initial excitement i think, even though "property of jesus" and "in the summertime" really knock me out. saved is the best one imo and is swiftly becoming... my... favorite... dylan... record?

both of the complete live shows in the box set are AMAZING. toronto 1980 is perfect, and then just the next year at earl's court all the arrangements are completely fuckin different!

Agree that Saved is the best studio and that Toronto 1980 show is the best period.

Bob Dylan acting out "Shot of Love."

If I've said it once, I've said it a thousand times: Interpretive Dance Bob Dylan is the best Bob Dylan. pic.twitter.com/QLRWlmnvN4

— HarryHew (@harryhew) August 30, 2023

Gestures aside, I find this musically scintillating.

Extraordinary that he had this much vitality after almost 20 years and numerous other career phases.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QI3xRnihh4c

Randomly popping up on my YouTube feed today, someone posted a couple of TV news stories from Pittsburgh from when Bob came through for one of the gospel tours. Guessing Slow Train Coming era? Not only did Bob give them an interview, but features some fantastic footage of unsuspecting fans walking out in the middle of the show.

haven't seen that before — pretty great stuff. would love to see the uncut interview there.

Interesting that he said the same thing about his old stuff in 1979 as he did in No Direction Home. "I don't know how I wrote it" as if it was a different person that did it.

Love this thread. I bet a full 65% of the most insightful and hilarious commentary written about these albums is right here (and the percentage would be higher if not for Christopher Ricks' Visions of Sin)

I listened to Slow Train Coming start to finish for the first time in a long time today. It's been one of my "five favorite albums of all time" for something like thirteen or fourteen years, and while my take on the title track has always been "real great, but not as outlandishly great as most of the rest of this stuff is," today it blew my head right off. What a magnificent rant. Yes, absolutely written in all caps.

A REAL SUICIDE CASE BUT THERE WAS NOTHING I COULD DO TO STOP IT

Trouble No More is the perfect soundtrack to these times. "When you gonna wake up?"

― Why, I would make a fantastic Nero! (PBKR), Thursday, March 19, 2020 7:32 PM (five years ago) bookmarkflaglink

This is also making me want to crack open the sealed 70s copy of this Jews for Jesus album that my Dad had and never opened:

https://www.discogs.com/release/26620745-The-Liberated-Wailing-Wall-We-Were-Like-Dreamers

Maybe some day.

Yeah, When You Gonna Wake Up is perennial. Never stops meaning something important, and I've been listening for thirteen years.

HE UNLEASHED HIS POWER
AT AN UNKNOWN HOUR

......THAT NO ONE KNEW