Pretenders: Classic or Dud?

Classic up through Learning to Crawl, mediocre through the lean years of Get Close, Packed, Isle of View and Last of the Independents, and slightly recharged with Viva el Amor and Loose Screw.

Never dud, though. Never.

S/D: Pretenders
POX - Pretenders?

Chrissie Hynde's hair hanging over narrowed eyes look, cruelly tensed mouth, and overall rock chick look - Dud. Send in Trinny & Susannah.

Whatabout Siouxsie? The Plasmatics?

And yet - listen to those early 45s in a row, and how lightly they seem to demolish obstacles, breeze past any doubts. Pastiche is a big element - the bass-strings guitar riffs of 'Kid' feel like George Harrison or the axeman of any neat beat group; it's meta-pop, intelligence is at work somewhere, hard to pin down. But instinct too, the sound they found and didn't muck about with too much, at least at the start, and the grace of how it moves.

TS: the exhilarating key-change burst into the solo of 'Kid' vs the exhilarating same-key, same-melody burst into the solo of 'Don't Get Me Wrong'.

On the taking sides, I'm a sap--"Don't Get Me Wrong"

"Whatabout Siouxsie? The Plasmatics?"

The Pretenders were about before The Plasmatics, weren't they?

In any case, what about Big Brother & The Holding Company (Janis Joplin), Jefferson Airplane (Grace Slick)...?

Pretenders? First album was classic, most of the singles were pretty good and (on the handful of occasions I saw them at least) they were always pretty good live.

'Private Life', 'Millionaires', 'Downtown (Akron)'. 'Criminal' is a good song. I like the tremolo on 'Never Do That'.

There is one song that's a lot like the Banshees! It's on the 45s compilation.

Great line: '2000 miles / ... it's very far!'

love the pretenders, scott's description upthread of the first album as 'exhiliarating' applies to much of their stuff for me.

"Now I see you/All impressed and half undressed/ You got paint stick/ All over the scars and lumps and bumps/ Tattooed love boys/ Have got you where I used to lay/ Well ha ha, too bad/ But you know what they say/ Stop snivelin', you're gonna make some plastic surgeon a rich man/ Oh, but the prestige and the glory/ Another human interest story/ You are that."

Two total classics.

I always thought it was "The beggars just come with the scenery.." ya know, 3rd world .. beggars... I guess I gotta look it up now.

I still like The Pretenders (who played the first and ONLY stadium-sized concert I've ever attended, Detroit's Joe Louis Arena '87, and Chrissie was totally outgoing and charismatic and made an "I'm-not-worthy" wisecrack about sharing the stage with Iggy Pop, who was the opening act, and the main reason I attended) and I still like "Middle Of The Road", but now it leaves a bit of a bad aftertaste, so tell me: Am I misunderstanding or overreacting? And why should it only now bother me 20 years after the fact?

Comments?

are any of their post get close albums worth the time beyond the singles? I remember not liking Packed that much when it came out, and then I don't think I bought anything else. I did get hooked on the VH1Classics Pretenders marathon hour a few weekends ago.

Ray Davies and Chrissie Hynde are a power-mullet couple if I've ever seen one.

I never thought of that lyric as complaining about a fan. I guess you could take it that way if you look at it as a specific piece of autobiography, but "I can't get from the car to the curb without some little jerk on my back" seems a pretty universal sentiment somewhat hyperbolically stated.

i made another pretenders thread somewhere, i like them (her?) a whole lot.

that rules lol

has she written a memoir?

yes, and i read it

It disappointed me. She's such a vivid talker and songwriter and was once a critic that I expected something felicitous.

yeah it was alright, but disappointing

she has some antiquated views about some stuff (and i understand where they come from but they are not sentiments currently in cultural vogue -- she's more caitlin flanagan than people might want her to be), and i don't really identify with her characterization of our hometown, partially because when she lived there was before i was born.
her descriptions of her life in london were pretty interesting, but not dishy.

she's very cool, as you would expect. cool = not into dishing or revealing too much
i don't remember a whole lot about it tbh, not really one of my top memoirs even though as a person she is indeed classic.

"yeah I had this huge pile of CDs to look through, and you guys were the UGLIEST motherfuckers out of all the bands. I figured that you were in it for the music and not the chicks

tbh I'm not really following Hynde's reasoning here

Like, they're clearly in it for the music. Face for radio, etc.

p much everything after the deaths of JHS & PF = DUD

nah, a lot of the 3rd album and get close is great.

The transition from the middle 8 to the verse in Back on the Chain Gang is one of the best things I have ever heard

tbh I'm not really following Hynde's reasoning here

I didn't know until Spotify told me that there's a version of 'Let's get lost' with Neil Tennant. I like it.

I didn't like I'll Stand By You that much, but my dislike of it is based on the fact that it paved the way for Love Can Build A Bridge, the worst thing in the discography of three different artists.

Think Clapton has probably done worse

Pretenders influence can be felt in some newer bands like dum dum girls, alvvays, Laura marling and especially stories from the city

The most enjoyment I've gotten out of Arcade Fire in over a decade:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqFvqYcYD3Y

Stop your sobbing is one of the best approximations of the spirit of doo-wop. Man does that guitarist rip too, lovers of today melts my face off

Classic!

"Birds of Paradise" came up on random shuffle for me today. A minor Pretenders song, sure, but man is it gorgeous.

^ yeah!

Gonna sample brass in pockets intro, down pitch it and loop it into a hip hop beat. Think it would sound dope

Gonna use MAH MAH MAH.

You listed the correct post-80s record.

I'm finding it difficult to accept the notion that Hynde has a limited voice.

― lihaperäpukamat (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Saturday, October 24, 2009 8:09 AM (nine years ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Alfred she sings flat about half the time. It's a charming flat, but it's flat.

― a full circle lol (J0hn D.), Saturday, October 24, 2009 8:26 AM (nine years ago)

lol someone added this to her wikipedia page:

Artistry
This section needs expansion. You can help by adding to it. (January 2015)
Hynde has a contralto vocal range.[ 50 ] Until 1978, shortly before the advent of The Pretenders, Hynde had little idea what she sounded like.[ 51 ] Attributing her distinctive time signatures to an inability to count, and her distinctive amusia to an inability to hear, she eschews formal voice training saying that, "distinctive voices in rock are trained through years of many things: frustration, fear, loneliness, anger, insecurity, arrogance, narcissism, or just sheer perseverance – anything but a teacher."[ 51 ]

did Hynde and Petty ever cross paths? Was thinking about how they are kinda similar, both part of the last wave of "classic rock", shading into new wave. shag haircuts, idiosyncratic voices, classicists but also p odd.

In which our hero, Chrissie Hynde, kisses Trump's ass in order to encourage him to ... help Julian Assange.

ew! no! what are you talking about?

An open Letter to @realDonaldTrump, President of the United States.

Dear Mr. President,

I often think of how much my father, Melville “Bud” Hynde, who proudly served his country as a Marine on Guadalcanal, would have enjoyed your Presidency. [p1.]

— Chrissie Hynde (@ChrissieHynde) February 17, 2020

Melville "Bud" Hynde would probably have voted for Trump, listened to Rush, bopped to "My City is Gone."

ugh

first pj harvey now CH

assange sucks

what did PJ do?!?! my god
what is happening

Assange is a cause celebre. Kissing Trump's ass is a different thing (even if Hynde is clever for recognizing how President Mike Teavee works.)

You may be right.

more like kissy hind amirite

Oh in 2017 PJ participated in pro Assange event

https://consequenceofsound.net/2017/04/patti-smith-pj-harvey-brian-eno-participated-in-free-julian-assange-conference/

eh that's stupid but whatever
kissing trump's ass in any way is the offense

lol kissy hinde

Has plenty of potential for this thread: Band names that are parodies of other bands' names.

But certainly not for this one: Worst band/musician with a name that is pun based on other bands/musicians

Kiss B. Hynde

Still haven't gotten around to the new album yet, but this, from her ongoing "Dylan Lockdown Series", is lovely:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBUhaj76B_U

It didn't need the last shot, but I found that video unexpectedly moving. Beautiful cover too.

Anyone else heard the Dylan covers album that Chrissie put out today? Kudos to her for selecting some less obvious song choices, I guess, but I don't know if she always went with his strongest material (two songs each from Shot of Love and Infidels!). At the very least, I am grateful to finally have a version of that "Love Minus Zero/No Limit" cover that I liked so much from last year on record.

yeah wow that seems like a natural for her to cover!

I would have loved to hear her salvage "Caribbean Wind." The one on Biograph sucks but on the old bootlegged outtake (which wasn't included on Trouble No More), it sounded like Dylan's phrasing could have been inspired by Chrissie.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=audUHTtPi1I

The awkward arrangement needs to be re-done, but I could see the original Pretenders fixing this and making something great out of it.

Greil loves the "Blind Willie McTell" cover (and really hates Dylan's Infidels FWIW).

Anyone read/have anything to say about this?: https://utpress.utexas.edu/books/adam-sobsey-chrissie-hynde

Excerpt from a recorded 1981 phone interview with James Honeyman-Scott

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-blEXEO4qSY

played the 7th street entry (capacity 250) in mpls last night and apparently everyone was blown away

Happy birthday, girl. One of my favorites:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9T0_MZEVCE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xeWVAj0akkU

New Pitchfork Sunday Review of Learning to Crawl is a good read: https://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/the-pretenders-learning-to-crawl/

That's a pretty good encapsulation of Hynde and album alike.

September 23 was always the biggest birthday among music legends to me as it's shared by Ray Charles, John Coltrane and Bruce Springsteen, but I didn't realize today was pretty impressive as well: Chrissie Hynde turns 74, Sonny Rollins turns 95, and Buddy Holly would've been 89. (Crazy to think Buddy could feasibly be alive today if he hadn't taken that plane.)

So many talented Virgo babies!!