Rideshare services - Uber, Lyft, Hailo, etc.

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This is the thread for talking about your experiences with rideshare services/apps. Which ones you like, which ones you don't. The peculiar legal ramifications and restrictions in some cities (e.g. did you know that rideshare services need a taxi license to operate in Minneapolis but not in St. Paul? http://www.theatlanticcities.com/commute/2014/04/twin-cities-are-taking-very-different-approaches-lyft-and-uberx/8830/).

Immediate Follower (NA), Wednesday, 23 April 2014 15:30 (five years ago) link

i use uber all the time

seems like a shitty company but i also pay james dolan money for cable so \(o_O)/

le goon (J0rdan S.), Wednesday, 23 April 2014 15:31 (five years ago) link

Lyft seems embarrassing.

Immediate Follower (NA), Wednesday, 23 April 2014 15:39 (five years ago) link

I like how all of those giant pink mustaches lasted like a month on the front end of cars in Chicago weather before being demoted to the dashboards.

djenter the dragon? (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Wednesday, 23 April 2014 16:12 (five years ago) link

whats wrong with a taxi

idontknowanythingabouttechnlolgeez (waterface), Wednesday, 23 April 2014 16:15 (five years ago) link

My one experience with Uber was a mixed bag; basically, don't use them for transportation away from big events unless you are made out of money.

Wahaca Flocka Flame (DJP), Wednesday, 23 April 2014 16:21 (five years ago) link

Uber and Lyft just launched in Cleveland this month. Haven't tried them, and can't imagine any circumstance where I would.

bi-polar uncle (its OK-he's dead) (Phil D.), Wednesday, 23 April 2014 16:26 (five years ago) link

hey, taxi

idontknowanythingabouttechnlolgeez (waterface), Wednesday, 23 April 2014 16:29 (five years ago) link


idontknowanythingabouttechnlolgeez (waterface), Wednesday, 23 April 2014 16:29 (five years ago) link

it amazes me that nouveau tech people are so credulous as to willingly throw away decades of accumulated consumer protections and regulations for the novelty of calling an unlicensed cab with an iphone app.

adam, Wednesday, 23 April 2014 16:33 (five years ago) link

yeah but you can do it with your phone

idontknowanythingabouttechnlolgeez (waterface), Wednesday, 23 April 2014 16:36 (five years ago) link

And you don't have to accidentally touch some peon by handing them money.

bi-polar uncle (its OK-he's dead) (Phil D.), Wednesday, 23 April 2014 16:37 (five years ago) link

everyone who drives for lyft looks like they're pomplamoose roadies

christmas candy bar (al leong), Wednesday, 23 April 2014 16:38 (five years ago) link

let's all move to our own islands and have no government

idontknowanythingabouttechnlolgeez (waterface), Wednesday, 23 April 2014 16:38 (five years ago) link

whats wrong with a taxi

taxis are great if you can get one

ugh (lukas), Wednesday, 23 April 2014 16:46 (five years ago) link

you can say the same about Uber tho, and depending on where/when you contact them it can end up being ten times more expensive

Wahaca Flocka Flame (DJP), Wednesday, 23 April 2014 16:48 (five years ago) link

I know some people who drive for Lyft, I would never set foot in a car with them behind the wheel.

dan m, Wednesday, 23 April 2014 16:51 (five years ago) link

ny doesn't have $1m taxi medallions because consumer protections just cost so much - so it's great that the pretty terrible industry (which just did its best to prevent people from the outer boroughs from getting *regulated* taxis) is getting ""disrupted""

otoh I generally don't have trouble finding a taxi the rare times that I do need to get one (even more true thanks to the green cabs) so I have no desire to dl an app so I can pay more money for the privilege.

iatee, Wednesday, 23 April 2014 16:52 (five years ago) link

My one experience with Uber (after a wedding on St. Patrick's Day), the poor guy got pulled over by a cop as he was pulling up to the bar to pick us up.

Kiarostami bag (milo z), Wednesday, 23 April 2014 16:55 (five years ago) link

I'm going to be irritatingly pedantic for a minute. This is at least how it works in Chicago. Taxi regulations are very locally specific:

Hailo isn't a ride share service. It's basically a decentralized, app-based dispatching service for legal, licensed taxicabs. It's another way to call a cab that isn't cab company-specific and leaves out the middle-person dispatcher. It's also a convenient, hassle-free way to pay for a cab with a credit card. Also safer to use a credit card this way since taxi CC machines are sketchy as heck.

Uber has three components - a decentralized, app-based dispatching service through which you can call licensed taxis; a private car service, like a chauffer service; and a private car ride share service called Uber X.

Lyft is just a private ride share service.

So I like the Hailo and Uber taxi-hailing apps a lot. It's not impossible to hail a cab on the street where we live, but you could end up standing around for ten minutes or so or fighting with people on other corners so it's really nice to be able to get a guaranteed taxi. I have had problems with availability of cabs through both apps, and I've had drivers cancel on me for no reason, which is frustrating.

I've never used Uber's black car service because that shit's expensive and I'm not a rock star.

I used Uber X twice - once by accident because I had a credit and thought it was for the cab hailing part, and once with Jeff on purpose because he had the same credit. I never would have used it by myself if I'd realized what was going on. Call me paranoid, but fuck getting into some stranger's unregulated, unlicensed personal car for a god damn ride somewhere. I feel the same way about Lyft. I think there are also some major labor issues to consider with Uber X and Lyft as far as the drivers being classified as independent contractors and not having workers' comp coverage or being covered by wage and hour or overtime laws. Basically they can be paid exploitation rates of pay for what they do, and would have to drive A LOT to make a living.

carl agatha, Wednesday, 23 April 2014 16:56 (five years ago) link

iatee, in NYC you can only hail yellow cabs on the street, right? And if you want to call for a ride you've got to call a chauffeur service like Uber's black car?

carl agatha, Wednesday, 23 April 2014 16:58 (five years ago) link

The one person I know who drives for Lyft only does it for a few hours a night a couple nights a week and on one weekend night—purely for supplemental income.

Johnny Fever, Wednesday, 23 April 2014 16:58 (five years ago) link

There's also potentially massive liability issues with Lyft and Uber X drivers, just because of the unlicensed and unregulated nature of the services.

There are big problems with the way cabs are licensed and regulated (Chicago fares are some of the lowest urban fares in the nation and drivers don't get paid shit, making it really difficult for them to make a living as well, plus there has been reams of litigation about whether drivers are independent contractors or employees and thus afforded certain legal protections) so I get the appeal of something like Lyft or Uber X disrupting all of that (and again, I'm looking at this from a Chicago perspective, which is a different taxi setup than in other cities) but the whole thing is just too potentially sketchy and fraught for me to trust it.

carl agatha, Wednesday, 23 April 2014 17:02 (five years ago) link

the idea of being an occasional Lyft driver crossed my mind solely because the idea of putting that horrific mustache on the front of my car cracked me up

Wahaca Flocka Flame (DJP), Wednesday, 23 April 2014 17:05 (five years ago) link

legally yeah but in the outer boroughs the lack of yellow cabs meant that hailing black cabs was the norm not the exception. bloomberg created green cabs (which can only be hailed in the outer boroughs / upper manhattan) to legalize/regulate what was already happening and the taxi industry fought it in courts, but eventually lost.

black cabs still exist and still get hailed tho, both in the boroughs and in manhattan.


iatee, Wednesday, 23 April 2014 17:06 (five years ago) link

and while some drivers might make more money w/ uber atm than they do in places w/ fucked up regulations, in the long term the price/wages are gonna be driven down...though I guess soon enough they'll be replaced by google car so

iatee, Wednesday, 23 April 2014 17:13 (five years ago) link

if you mean the driverless car that will never happen

idontknowanythingabouttechnlolgeez (waterface), Wednesday, 23 April 2014 18:02 (five years ago) link

The one person I know who drives for Lyft only does it for a few hours a night a couple nights a week and on one weekend night—purely for supplemental income.

― Johnny Fever, Wednesday, April 23, 2014 11:58 AM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

This is what the people I know do. They also use it to drive drunk people around and find out where the party is, then park their cars and get fucked up until the morning comes.

dan m, Wednesday, 23 April 2014 18:05 (five years ago) link

whats wrong with a taxi

taxis are great if you can get one


the day upworthy breaks the story of the lyft murderer who drove his victims to an airbnb death dungeon is the day u know ur paradigm has truly been disrupted

adam, Wednesday, 23 April 2014 18:19 (five years ago) link

"Please rate your driver"

Echoing that taxis are fine if you can get them -- in SF, depending on where you are and what time it is, sometimes you might as well walk. Lyft has the app and the ease of taking care of everything that way. However, the drivers don't generally know the city as well as taxi cab drivers (though they also don't typically drive as recklessly).

Dominique, Wednesday, 23 April 2014 18:22 (five years ago) link

two months pass...

1. there was a big taxi protest in DC today:

Drivers in and around downtown D.C. were gridlocked in traffic Wednesday as a caravan of angry taxi drivers made its way from East Potomac Park to Freedom Plaza — in a protest against app-based ride sharing services such as UberX.

the taxis all honked constantly for about 2-3 hours outside of my work. they weren't little short honks but rather of the HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONK, HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONK, HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONK variety. one one hand, the drivers achieved their goal of getting people to think about the Uber/Lyft/Sidecar issue and to talk about it. on the other hand, the most common thing i heard among pedestrians and workers in the area was "SHUT THE FUCK UP! GODDAMIT, SHUT THE FUCK UP!!"

i want to be sympathetic toward the taxi drivers. but even though i've never used Uber-like services as i don't use taxis very often at all, they clearly seem to be better on a technological level. when a rottweiler munched on my shin and calf a few weeks ago, it took calls to 3 different taxi companies before someone was able to pick up the phone and then agree to send someone to my house. 40 minutes passed before it finally arrived, and i live in DC proper, not way out in the suburbs or something. when the driver showed up, he refused to shut the fuck up even though i made it clear that i was bleeding and in a great deal of pain. he was physically unable to shut the fuck up. then he refused to take me to the nearest hospital (howard university) because "that's not a good hospital". instead he took me to a hospital across town, during rush hour, so the ride took forever. the entire time he talked about how much he loved money and also gave me advice about dog bites. he also, of course, spent a good chunk of time complaining about Uber.

anywhere, clearly an anecdote about a terrible taxi ride doesn't build a very strong case against taxi drivers, but pretty much every time i take a taxi i end up with the most terrible human beings of all time. i haven't used Uber but i've heard that they actually show up, you can tell when they'll arrive using an app, and that they don't talk much. sounds heavenly.

Karl Malone, Wednesday, 25 June 2014 20:13 (five years ago) link

My god, Karl, I hope you called to complain about that driver! The delay is absurd and part of why I am in favor of the decentralized dispatch services provided by Uber and Hailo, but him not taking you to your requested destination is not only straight up awful but must violate some kind of DC consumer services regulation. Is there a complaint number to call? That guy is a god damn menace.

carl agatha, Wednesday, 25 June 2014 20:18 (five years ago) link

when a rottweiler munched on my shin and calf a few weeks ago, it took calls to 3 different taxi companies before someone was able to pick up the phone and then agree to send someone to my house. 40 minutes passed before it finally arrived, and i live in DC proper, not way out in the suburbs or something. when the driver showed up, he refused to shut the fuck up even though i made it clear that i was bleeding and in a great deal of pain.

sounds like a shitty situation and i feel for you karl malone but you didn't want to call an ambulance?

marcos, Wednesday, 25 June 2014 20:24 (five years ago) link

i was more concerned about the pulsing pain and shooting blood from my leg then taking his taxi ID number or whatever. i kept saying "yeah i'm in a lot of pain right now" as my response to his running monologue about how much he loved money that was occasionally sprinkled with questions to confirm that i agreed that money was awesome as well.

Karl Malone, Wednesday, 25 June 2014 20:26 (five years ago) link

hard to explain, but i was in enough pain and bleeding enough to need to go to the hospital, but not enough to feel the need to pay several hundred dollars for an ambulance ride.

Karl Malone, Wednesday, 25 June 2014 20:28 (five years ago) link

i (as well as several friends) have been using Uber X and Lyft fairly regularly for months now and they are a thousand times better than your typical taxi service in nearly every conceivable way.

circa1916, Wednesday, 25 June 2014 20:29 (five years ago) link

i want to be sympathetic toward the taxi drivers. but even though i've never used Uber-like services as i don't use taxis very often at all, they clearly seem to be better on a technological level. when a rottweiler munched on my shin and calf a few weeks ago, it took calls to 3 different taxi companies before someone was able to pick up the phone and then agree to send someone to my house. 40 minutes passed before it finally arrived, and i live in DC proper, not way out in the suburbs or something.

it took me a while to understand this in my area, being a very infrequent taxi user who never had any of them around growing up, but i think basically taxi companies have a lot of unspoken ways of doing things that they require you to deal with if you want their convenience. factor in having to deal with a lot of demanding erratic customers who don't understand these things and i guess i can understand why they can get kind of fuck-you sometimes.

i'm thinking things like expectations about when people travel, under what circumstances it's reasonable to expect a fast pickup, where they expect you to go (wrt taxis being around you and finding fares wherever they end up).

recently i had an injury and had to take more taxis than i could afford because i didn't have any other way, and i got quite a range of service. some drivers had very slick smartphone apps, a square thingy. some knew where they were going. some couldn't find me standing at the opposite corner from where they expected. one guy had to fill out a card charge on fuckin carbon-copied slips by hand, but when i saw the phone he was working with, and figured what he must be making driving the cab, i really couldn't be irritated at him - anyone who could afford it would leap at the conveniences that would probably help them pull down more tips and other desirables. once i got picked up on a street corner by a passing cabbie i flagged down (apparently this does not really work much) who was ok with dumping me in the front seat with another fare in the back, only to have the actual cab i had called (there were a LOT driving past that night) swoop in and get irritated at the other one, and at me, for taking the fare he had oked. but how was i to know?? i was just standing in a snowstorm with a bum foot miles from home! etc.

j., Wednesday, 25 June 2014 22:00 (five years ago) link

i was more concerned about the pulsing pain and shooting blood from my leg then taking his taxi ID number or whatever. i kept saying "yeah i'm in a lot of pain right now" as my response to his running monologue about how much he loved money that was occasionally sprinkled with questions to confirm that i agreed that money was awesome as well.

I'm sorry. I didn't mean to imply that you had any sort of responsibility to report this guy. It was more of a "Justice for Karl Malone!" kind of thing. I get that way when I get angry at something on someone's behalf.

carl agatha, Wednesday, 25 June 2014 23:23 (five years ago) link

Oh no, it's cool! Believe me, as I sat I sat in the backseat I thought "what would a more direct person do here? Most people wouldn't stand for this." It's totally reasonable. People's thresholds for bullshit change over time, and I hope that when I'm an older man I'll have the courage to call out bullshit like that.

Karl Malone, Wednesday, 25 June 2014 23:50 (five years ago) link

three weeks pass...

anyone used relayrides? looks pretty sweet.

this is probably a dumb question but if you get pulled over what are you supposed to show for insurance?

mattresslessness, Monday, 21 July 2014 20:09 (five years ago) link

I use Uber and Hailo for calling real cabs. I don't use the ride sharing services, probably because I just use the real cabs, they always seem more plentiful. But I like the idea of them and fully support them.

Jeff, Monday, 21 July 2014 20:32 (five years ago) link

relayrides = car rental

mattresslessness, Monday, 21 July 2014 20:33 (five years ago) link

cab drivers i'm sentimental about but i truly hope car rental companies get disrupted out of existence by this thing

mattresslessness, Monday, 21 July 2014 20:36 (five years ago) link

three months pass...

what exactly did this guy say? I can't track it down anywhere, just reactions to it.

akm, Tuesday, 18 November 2014 19:18 (four years ago) link

fuck these services

Οὖτις, Tuesday, 18 November 2014 19:21 (four years ago) link

no way in hell am I entrusting the lives of my children with some unlicensed uninsured asshole with a handlebar mustache

Οὖτις, Tuesday, 18 November 2014 19:24 (four years ago) link

A pink handlebar mustache pasted to the front of his car, even.

carl agatha, Tuesday, 18 November 2014 19:30 (four years ago) link

lmao https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2018-01-18/the-fall-of-travis-kalanick-was-a-lot-weirder-and-darker-than-you-thought

Kalanick was unable or unwilling to right himself. If anything, his judgment deteriorated. He decided that he should apologize privately to Kamel, the driver he berated on video. The plan was simple: meet with Kamel at some neutral and nonthreatening location, engage in five minutes of pleasantries, say sorry, and leave.

The meeting went on for more than an hour, with Kalanick re-debating Kamel over Uber’s pricing policies. Somehow, by the end, Kalanick suggested that he give the driver Uber stock, according to people familiar with the discussion.

𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Thursday, 18 January 2018 16:04 (one year ago) link

Even in top-level conversations where Kalanick appeared to be absent, other executives and board members suspected that Huffington was serving as his proxy. The founder of the Huffington Post was a constant presence at Uber’s offices, making suggestions that seemed to promote her new wellness company, Thrive Global Holdings LLC. For example, she wanted to put “nap pods” at driver hubs and give drivers meditation wristbands. Huffington’s company received $50,000 in consulting fees from Uber. The perceived self-dealing didn’t go over well internally, and she had the money returned, according to a person familiar with the matter. A spokesperson for Huffington says that Thrive provided services at cost, and that Huffington refunded the fees when events required her to take on a more active role at Uber.

𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Thursday, 18 January 2018 16:08 (one year ago) link

xp the next section is even worse! I had no idea Uber's SF lead was also present

Wayne Ting, who ran Uber’s San Francisco business, was in the room with Kalanick and Kamel. In an email later circulated among employees and directors, Ting said he was deeply disturbed by what he saw. He told people he called his own father to seek moral counsel. He worried that paying the driver off with Uber’s own shares was financially irresponsible—would Uber compensate all of its drivers who felt mistreated? To Ting, the incident reeked of a lack of self-control. In the email, he wrote that Kalanick “no longer had the moral standing” to lead Uber. After Uber’s lawyers insisted the company wouldn’t pay Kamel to clean up Kalanick’s personal scandal, Kalanick agreed to pay Kamel $200,000 out of his own pocket, according to a person familiar with the matter. “The meeting ended on a positive note, and Travis appreciated Mr. Kamel’s openness and forgiveness,” a spokesperson for Kalanick said in a statement.

mh, Thursday, 18 January 2018 16:09 (one year ago) link

two weeks pass...

my score went from 4.91 to 4.89 and i cannot think why

rove mcmanus island (Autumn Almanac), Sunday, 4 February 2018 01:20 (one year ago) link

I’m 4.77

Jeff, Sunday, 4 February 2018 01:38 (one year ago) link

one month passes...

funny how ebay has basically just been doing the same thing forever so it's not cool to talk about it anymore but it's actual profits are way higher than amazon

It's not delivery, it's Adorno! (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 6 March 2018 19:33 (one year ago) link

I figured this was going to be about the study that showed Uber drivers make an average of $3.37/hour. It's pretty remarkable that they can lose $4.5 billion while paying drivers $3.37/hour -- a taxi company paying that little would be making a killing.

Fedora Dostoyevsky (man alive), Tuesday, 6 March 2018 20:07 (one year ago) link

xp, to be fair amazon as a business is deliberately set up to make as close to $0 profit as possible.

𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Tuesday, 6 March 2018 20:13 (one year ago) link

interesting long piece about mass transit, class/race segregation, and the future of buses

In a 2009 U.S. Department of Transportation survey, Los Angeles commuters ranked big diesel-electric commuter trains as the most desirable form of transit, with light rail, a category that includes subways and fixed-rail streetcars, right below them. At the very bottom was the humble bus. One might expect that bus rapid transit systems — conventional bus service modified to work more like light rail, with dedicated lanes and station-side ticketing — would be more popular, but they ranked barely above ordinary buses. When researchers asked why bus rapid transit ranked below light rail “even though they are essentially the same mode at approximately the same level of investment,” respondents chalked it up to “perceptions of other riders.” Though they function almost exactly like streetcars, bus rapid transit is stigmatized precisely because they serve a larger swath of the population. “Bus-based public transit in the United States,” the L.A. study concluded, “suffers from an image problem.”

That image problem — which, as will be explained below, stems from the deliberate association of buses with poverty and racialized minorities — informs the way Lyft and Uber have chosen to introduce their own versions of what is essentially conventional bus service. Lyft describes its “Shuttle” as the option to “ride for a low fixed fare along convenient routes, with no surprise stops.” Uber calls its service a “Pool.” Alison Griswold, writing at Quartz, notes that the path taken by the bus mentioned in Uber’s blog post announcing the service “is almost identical to the route traversed by the M101 bus in New York City.”

𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Monday, 12 March 2018 05:15 (one year ago) link

oops, link http://reallifemag.com/uber-alles/

𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Monday, 12 March 2018 05:16 (one year ago) link

bus routes in LA are great: efficient, wide-ranging and convenient. if there were actually buses driving them more than three times an hour, I suspect the public perception would not have become so inground.

just noticed tears shaped like florida. (sic), Monday, 12 March 2018 08:45 (one year ago) link

man why does los angeles have such backwards views

F# A# (∞), Monday, 12 March 2018 20:34 (one year ago) link

Uber driver drove me into oncoming traffic in DT Atlanta twice and the only apology he could muster was an "oh no".

considering my recent accident i was pissing myself

fuck the NRA (Neanderthal), Saturday, 17 March 2018 01:23 (one year ago) link

fairly sure the first he must have blown a red. second i think he turned left with no green arrow while cars were oncoming.

first time he also sat like a deer in the headlights in the lane.

fuck the NRA (Neanderthal), Saturday, 17 March 2018 01:24 (one year ago) link


Jeff, Saturday, 17 March 2018 02:14 (one year ago) link

remember when the argument for this thing was "and c'mon, who likes riding with those crazy TAXI drivers amirite?"

this job is unbelievably hard on drivers... there was a vigil in nyc recently for an uber driver who'd killed himself. they must be under incredible pressure, all the time, and with very little latitude to say "nah I should pass on that fare, I need a break/decent night's sleep for my own safety's sake." it's crazy.

lol dis stance dunk (Doctor Casino), Saturday, 17 March 2018 02:24 (one year ago) link

Woman dies in Arizona after being hit by Uber self-driving SUV

A woman crossing a street was killed by an Uber self-driving sport utility vehicle in Arizona, police said on Monday, leading the ride services company to suspend its autonomous vehicle program across the United States and Canada.

The accident in the Phoenix suburb of Tempe marked the first fatality from a self-driving vehicle, which are being tested around the globe, and could derail efforts to fast-track the introduction of the new technology.

The vehicle was in autonomous mode with an operator behind the wheel at the time of the accident, which occurred overnight Sunday to Monday, Tempe police said.

Bring the Paine (Sanpaku), Monday, 19 March 2018 20:17 (one year ago) link

gonna be hard for uber to argue this one was an independent contractor so they can dodge liability

in conclusion, it is good to peel the sheeps (bizarro gazzara), Monday, 19 March 2018 20:22 (one year ago) link

Who was, the car?

Fedora Dostoyevsky (man alive), Monday, 19 March 2018 20:29 (one year ago) link

This is obviously still considerably better than manned vehicles - but I'm not surprised that it's Uber's that have the first fatality.

Andrew Farrell, Tuesday, 20 March 2018 12:59 (one year ago) link

I've probably said this in thread before, but I find the comparison of self-driving car test data to real driver data highly misleading. First, you're relying on data from test driving in limited conditions of the Company's choosing vs all human driving. How much are the test cars driving at night on poorly lit roads? On slick roads? In snow? How challenging are the routes they drive? At what speeds?

Second, while I can see how this cuts both ways, you are not comparing self-driving cars to good human drivers under normal conditions, because the aggregate human data includes drunk drivers, reckless drivers etc. Now granted if everyone used self-driving cars that would eliminate drunk and reckless drivers. But I'm not convinced that we've gotten to the point where a self-driving car is as safe a driver as, say, a responsible, rested adult with perfect vision under no influence of substances. The reason that does matter is that if you're asking me to get into a self-driving car, I would like to know that the car's driving is at least as safe as mine, not just average.

Fedora Dostoyevsky (man alive), Tuesday, 20 March 2018 20:31 (one year ago) link

from the video, it looks like you wouldn't fault a human driver. but it looks like an accident that should be avoidable for a self-driving car with superior night visibility.

Sufjan in Worst Shithole of a Major American City (Sufjan Grafton), Thursday, 22 March 2018 02:45 (one year ago) link

perhaps a person slowly walking a bike draped in grocery bags across the road is a strange corner case, and they try to be a bit too smart about what an object to avoid should look like.

Sufjan in Worst Shithole of a Major American City (Sufjan Grafton), Thursday, 22 March 2018 02:48 (one year ago) link

the thing to remember is that for the autonomous driving AIs that are trained on driver data, they are trained on human driver data

someday an AI defending itself will claim 9/10 human drivers would have run over the pedestrian

mh, Thursday, 22 March 2018 03:19 (one year ago) link

c3p0 certainly would

Sufjan in Worst Shithole of a Major American City (Sufjan Grafton), Thursday, 22 March 2018 05:05 (one year ago) link

this how we die

fuck the NRA (Neanderthal), Thursday, 22 March 2018 05:06 (one year ago) link

three months pass...

New York State, at least, is pushing back against the "they're not employees" argument.

This is a total Jeff Porcaro. (Doctor Casino), Sunday, 22 July 2018 15:49 (one year ago) link

It's called vomit fraud!

morning wood truancy (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Sunday, 22 July 2018 17:23 (one year ago) link

three months pass...

Competition driving fares down pretty dramatically in nyc, much easier to get to those good spots. 2018 is pretty rad

calstars, Saturday, 3 November 2018 15:27 (nine months ago) link

if you're not, you know, a driver

|Restore| |Restart| |Quit| (Doctor Casino), Saturday, 3 November 2018 15:40 (nine months ago) link

two months pass...


Did a double-take when I saw this number: Every week, there are 11,000 Uber and Lyft rides *on campus* at UCLA. That’s not including trips that start or end there! https://t.co/CP649n2XX0

— Laura J. Nelson 🦅 (@laura_nelson) January 31, 2019

𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Thursday, 31 January 2019 16:29 (six months ago) link

xpost to calstars

yeah as driver it's kinda funny how ppl treat you like human garbage

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Thursday, 31 January 2019 16:47 (six months ago) link

Sigh. I got in a yellow cab the other day and it was in poor condition inside, old, everything was plastic, and the passenger divider with sliding window made the back seat so small I could barely sit down and had to put my legs sideways.

I was also remembering the "old" days of calling livery cars and being on hold for infinite minutes, cars that were supposed to be on the way coming 15-30 mins late, speaking to rude dispatchers who might not understand me and I might not understand them, never knowing what the car looked like so finding it at the airport was 100% anxiety, drivers trying to rip you off if you didn't agree to the price ahead of time, and so many other shitty things.

Whereas I can call a car with Juno (I only use June on the basis that afaict they pay the drivers more?) that arrives in 1 min and it's a nice passenger vehicle and I know the driver's name/license plate. There's no downside, if you're a passenger. But are drivers surviving? Idk. :(

There's more Italy than necessary. (in orbit), Thursday, 31 January 2019 16:55 (six months ago) link

Barcelona to outlaw Uber in the most obnoxious way possible


Andrew Farrell, Monday, 4 February 2019 21:07 (six months ago) link

I had an experience a few months ago that left me really sour on both rideshare services and cabs, tbh. I was at a concert at a big arena in a different suburb from the one I live in, roughly 10-11 miles from my house. Not really conveniently served by public transportation, the train line is within a walkable (if a long walk) distance, but there are almost no sidewalks and tons of major intersections to try and get through.

Short version - Lyft server issues, couldn't get a driver to accept my request over 2+ hours of trying. Uber (which I always try to avoid using, had to reinstall the app) was going to cost over $110 for whatever reason... so, no. Called a few cab companies, first one laughed at me when I said where I was and hung up on me; second one told me it'd be a 3-4 hour wait for a ride; third told me they don't serve that arena since the arena signed a deal with Lyft for a dedicated waiting area. End up having to call my wife and wake her up at 2:00 a.m. to come pick me up. Just frustrating on all sides.

soaring skrrrtpeggios (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Monday, 4 February 2019 21:28 (six months ago) link

fuck all of these companies, they should be outlawed imo. they put more cars on the road, treat their employees like shit, and provide a service already readily available from other providers

Οὖτις, Monday, 4 February 2019 21:31 (six months ago) link

fwiw, don't disagree with that. Usually use cabs when I'm doing an airport trip or short trips within the city, but outside of Chicago city limits the cab services are so terrible that they aren't much better. Refusing to accept credit cards, refusing to cross certain arbitrary lines, etc etc.

soaring skrrrtpeggios (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Monday, 4 February 2019 21:35 (six months ago) link

oh that wasn't directed at you, that was just my general feeling

Οὖτις, Monday, 4 February 2019 21:40 (six months ago) link

jon it sounds like all the Lyft drivers might have been at the dedicated Lyft waiting area?

sciatica, Monday, 4 February 2019 21:46 (six months ago) link

That's where I was, but it was just a pickup zone, you still had to request the ride through the app. There were a couple of Lyft "helpers" in the waiting area, one of them confirmed when I asked him for help that the servers were having issues and that he didn't know when it was going to be resolved. He tried requesting a ride for me as well with no luck. That's when I turned to the other options.

I mean it was probably just a perfect storm of issues but it was frustrating to have so many options theoretically available but still have no luck.

soaring skrrrtpeggios (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Monday, 4 February 2019 21:53 (six months ago) link

-they put more cars on the road-

i once asked a driver if he thought it was better to wait for rides in a static place or drive around, and he said lyft encourages them to drive around. gas alone...

alomar lines, Tuesday, 5 February 2019 06:21 (six months ago) link

two weeks pass...

A more serious proposal might start with the possibility that Uber is opposed to public transit by design—every ride taken on a subway or bus is competition for its growing supply of cars.


sold out in presale (sleeve), Friday, 22 February 2019 23:56 (five months ago) link

five months pass...

$5.24 billion loss in the second quarter for uber

mookieproof, Thursday, 8 August 2019 21:56 (one week ago) link

expecting a hard-hitting speech from the coach at halftime

mookieproof, Thursday, 8 August 2019 21:57 (one week ago) link

With a service that’s indistinguishable from its competitors and no physical product, I think it’s going to be hard for Uber to turn around these losses

calstars, Thursday, 8 August 2019 23:52 (one week ago) link

imagine if Uber's investors put that much into public transport infrastructure in their cities

quelle sprocket damage (sic), Friday, 9 August 2019 00:39 (one week ago) link

It's a long J'accuse, but the tl;dr is that Uber will never, ever recover and the sooner it crashes/burns, the better:

These beliefs about Uber’s corporate value were created entirely out of thin air. This is not a case of a company with a reasonably sound operating business that has managed to inflate stock market expectations a bit. This is a case of a massive valuation that has no relationship to any economic fundamentals. Uber has no competitive efficiency advantages, operates in an industry with few barriers to entry, and has lost more than $14 billion in the previous four years. But its narratives convinced most people in the media, invest­ment, and tech worlds that it is the most valuable transportation company on the planet and the second most valuable start-up IPO in U.S. history (after Facebook).

Uber is the breakthrough case where the public perception of a large new company was entirely created using the types of manufactured narratives typically employed in partisan political campaigns. Narrative construction is perhaps Uber’s greatest competitive strength. The company used these techniques to completely divert attention away from the massive subsidies that were the actual drivers of its popularity and growth. It successfully framed the entire public discussion around an emotive, “us-versus-them” battle between heroic innovators and corrupt regulators who were falsely blamed for all of the industry’s historic service problems. Uber’s desired framing—that it was fighting a moral battle on behalf of technological progress and economic freedom—was uncritically ac­cepted by the mainstream business and tech industry press, who then never bothered to analyze the firm’s actual economics or its anticompetitive behavior.

In reality, Uber’s platform does not include any technological breakthroughs, and Uber has done nothing to “disrupt” the eco­nomics of providing urban car services. What Uber has disrupted is the idea that competitive consumer and capital markets will maximize overall economic welfare by rewarding companies with superior efficiency. Its multibillion dollar subsidies completely distorted marketplace price and service signals, leading to a massive misallocation of resources. Uber’s most important innovation has been to produce staggering levels of private wealth without creating any sustainable benefits for consumers, workers, the cities they serve, or anyone else.

Prior to its IPO, Uber publicly released limited P&L results. These showed GAAP net losses of $2.6 billion in 2015, $3.8 billion in 2016, $4.5 billion in 2017, and $3.9 billion in 2018.1

In its April IPO S-1 prospectus, Uber recast all its historical P&L results, allegedly to isolate the terrible results in three major markets (China, Russia, and Southeast Asia) that Uber has abandoned from the results of its ongoing operations (which are the primary concern of potential investors).2 But Uber’s S-1 included $5 billion—roughly $3 billion in divestiture gains and $2 billion representing Uber’s valuation of its untradeable equity/debt positions in the companies that took over its failed operations—as part of net income from its ongoing operations. This deliberate misstatement was designed to give potential investors the impression that the profitability of Uber’s current marketplace services had improved by $5 billion, and that Uber actually made a billion dollar net profit in 2018. If one correctly segregates ongoing and discontinued results, however, Uber’s actual 2018 profit improvement was zero. Its ongoing operations lost $3.5 billion in 2017, and lost $3.5 billion again in 2018. The company’s losses over the last four years from still ongoing operations were roughly $14 billion.

Elvis Telecom, Monday, 12 August 2019 22:06 (six days ago) link

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