Obamacare / Affordable Care Act : classic or dud?

Hours later, another circuit court came to the opposite decision

Sloppiness aside, there's no ambiguity about the law's "overall statutory scheme." Other parts of the law make clear that its drafters contemplated subsidies in every state. This lower court judge agrees. You could make an argument that it's ambiguous, but that wouldn't doom the ACA either. Courts are obliged to apply a two-part test known as the Chevron test in cases like these.

http://www.newrepublic.com/article/118803/halbig-v-burwell-ruling-anti-obamacare-lawsuit-could-backfire-gop

the GOP's still gonna run on this in 2016 aren't they

what else are they going to run on? "we hate anyone who isn't a WASP!" "we hate gay people!" "...ronald reagan!"

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/wp/2014/07/23/morning-plum-republicans-certain-obamcare-hasnt-helped-anyone-in-america/?hpid=z3

No shocka poll results

aaaand Dave Weigel on how the GOP hopes to hang this flaming tire around Dems' necks. I don't think it's gonna work this time.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/weigel/2014/07/22/here_s_how_republicans_are_blaming_the_damage_from_the_obamacare_lawsuit.html

who would jesus heal?

Richard Posner turns anti-ABA lawyers to mincemeat:

http://www.courthousenews.com/2014/09/16/71454.htm

"You're suggesting a breathtaking expansion of jurisdiction, aren't you?" he asked. "You're suggesting that anyone with a potential economic injury from a law can bring a suit. Where would you stop?"
"The stopping point is if someone is not being regulated by a particular statute," plaintiff's attorney Andrew Schlafly replied. "This is a regulation of the medical field, not some remote tax."
He then argued that people forced to buy insurance will never seek out cash practices in order to avoid paying for healthcare twice.
This did not satisfy Posner. "That's like saying people who get food stamps don't pay as much for groceries."
"We don't try to trace through all levels of the economy," Judge Frank Easterbook added.
Schlafly tried again: "In a concurring opinion by Justice Potter Stewart ..."
"Concurring opinions and $2.50 will get you a cup of coffee at Starbucks," Easterbook laughed. "I'm asking if you know of the Supreme Court ever allowing someone to sue for someone else's tax!"
As Schlafly floundered, Posner seemed skeptical: "The Act has had substantial economic consequences. Many people are better off, many are worse off. There are millions affected by this law. How do you have standing to sue? Is your proposition that anyone adversely affected has standing to sue?"
Schlafly began to cite another case, but Posner cut him off: "Yes or no?"
"Depending on the issue ..."
"No!" Posner shouted. "It doesn't depend on the issue. It depends whether they're hurt."

THAT andrew schlafly? lol

Got to see what's available in MS for 2015 -- Blue Cross just increased my premium by 25% for the 2nd year in a row, the fuckers.

based on my new job duties, highly urge everyone to scrutinize their bills from insurance comp. Esp if they qualify for a subsidy and esp esp if they ever make ANY sort of plan change during the year (eg add dependent...even address change). Shit gets all fucked up, it's a mess.

got my official letter last week saying that I can no longer keep my plan, and that my new "comparable" plan offered by Aetna would be almost 3x higher in monthly premiums.

if you don't mind me asking, what are the specifics of your current plan? I'm curious about real world examples of plans that don't meet ACA imposed standards.

the monthly premiums on my bare bones plan w/ BCBS TN creep up ~$15 every year. this happened before ACA, too.

I'm not really sure what wouldn't meet ACA standards but Aetna has been warning me about my plan likely not going to survive ACA for a couple of years now. And my premiums have been rising steadily for seven years on Aetna (despite no changes in coverage) by 5-10% each year. And I just did the math again and luckily the new Aetna alternative plan is only 177% more expensive (not 3x).

I'm sure that the alternative plan is "better" on some levels, but it's still very basic ($12.5k deductible, no dental, etc.) I need to decide before the end of the year if I'm going to stay with Aetna or find an alternative.

so long, romneycare!

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/dc/mitch-mcconnell-obamacare-repeal-reconciliation

like, unless yr paying 100 bux a month for insurance (and looking @ a 1.77x increase) then your current Aetna plan seems absurdly over-priced by what you're getting? I went platinum in NYS and pay 480-something (absurd) but no deductable + dental. It's supposed to go up to 570 next year so I'ma tier-down to the next level (prob around my same current price; mas o menos) which is something like a 2500 deductable but still dental etc.

‘People Are Going To Be In For A Shock': Penalty For Uninsured Not Signing Up For Obamacare To More Than Triple

i guess i better try to sign up again, sigh

americans are too stupid to understand? go get 'em, megyn!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Hcu1S2GKf0

well, the NYS site's better than last year, but still really slow and complicated as hell

...and at 1 am in the morning, the website goes down for maintenance until 8am. this has happened to me at least a half dozen times over the last month. Also everytime this happens, you have to start the whole damn application over again, though it at least saves most of the information you put in. Sigh.

What's everybody doing? I've been on Freelancers Union w/ Freelancer Medical since the beginning of both but am NOT down with zero coverage for specialists until deductible is met. Is there another thread for this? We all need to decide RIGHT NOW.

in NYS; use the exchange/nystateofhealth. just downgraded my play from 480-something no deductable to 430 something w 2K deductable now that my previous plan significantly broke the 500.00 barrier. there's something morally wrong to me about having to freelance one day a month just for insurance. will chime back in if I'm reminded w/ who I changed to. Did the whole thing in about 45 min the other day at 8 PM

freelancers' union always seemed like garbage to me btw

i went with the cheapest possible plan I could get from Health Republic NY through the exchange site, mostly because Empire Blue Cross/Blue Shield totally burned me last year

it'll be kind of annoying to pay the ~$150 per month but that's better than nothing in the case of catastrophe. pretty good chunk of my income though - it's kind of unfortunate to be not eligible for medicare but not easily afford decent insurance. lots of others in much worse situations than me, though; at least i don't have currently have any crazy medical bills.

jimmy-which plan did you choose? that is the question.

I have trouble with the exchange/subsidies because my income varies wildly from year to year. If I got subsidized based on my income from last year, I would definitely have to pay that money back based on my income in the upcoming year.

When I joined freelancers union, it was the only option for freelancers to get their own insurance that didn't cost 800+. There was like one other thing, Fractured Atlas, which wasn't ideal either.

I'm used to paying 350+/mo for healthcare and have no expectation of not paying that much or more, I have enough doctors that I need normal healthcare and not a catastrophic plan.

how tf is 480 dollars a month "affordable"

or 350 for that matter

Even with good health insurance, we were sort of forced to make all sorts of decisions this year in terms of coverage. Same with my mother in law, who is a lifetime government employee with great insurance whose options often nonetheless made so little sense. For example, one of her options covered gender reassignment surgery, but not foot surgery to remove bunions. Just perplexing nickel and diming.

NEW: Metro Plus: GoldPlus-G2, NS, INN, Dep25, Pediatric and Adult Dental, Adult and Pediatric Vision. deductable is something like 2K, which is manageable

Previous was metroplus platinum w/ the works; no deductable

See, the thing is that afaict you can't get a comprehensive adult plan (w/ both dental; vision) w/o getting one that also offers pediatric, which seems like a pretty obvious attempt to assfuck a consumer. I was looking @ oscar bc they seem competitive and nimble (i may have fallen victim to advertising) but they offer neither dental nor vision. NYSHealth offers a la carte dental/vis plans but that sums to more than an all in one pkg.

also hi tracer 480 isn't affordable but here we are

we can't all be living your life w your beautiful family in a foreign land :D

you're all invited btw

here's how much the entire NHS costs per capita per year
http://www.nuffieldtrust.org.uk/data-and-charts/health-care-spending-person-uk

that's about 260 dollars a month, everything included (no vision) (bad dental, naturally) and no deductible.

just in case anyone thinks it's "free"

well we will all be dead soon here so it doesn't really matter and u cant take it w u

Things are relative. A few years ago if you were self-employed and needed healthcare, most options cost more than 800 dollars a month. Thus options that cost 400 or less are affordable. And when you need insurance and you factor that expense into your cost of living in america, you quickly become accustomed to the fact that you're going to be spending 3 or 400 a month on insurance. Now there's lots of options in that range. There used to be two. All the options suck, but I have no choice.

For what its worth, when you get it as a benefit through a company, you're putting money in and they're putting money in. You just don't feel it the same.

anyway I hope I was useful 4 u dan. nb I also went to the dr one time in my first year under obama's doctrine so that dr visit cost me 5.7K dollars

That's insurance, no big deal.

I feel like people are spoiled if they're coming from jobs...or have never had insurance before. I will repeat, before ACA, getting decent healthcare in New York cost 800 bucks and did not include dental or eyes or any of that shit.

Paying 480/mo for a 2000 deductible and getting dental and optical is a GOOD DEAL. It sucks, but that's AMERICA. Not to be captain obvious, but that 5.7k was for insurance, not just 1 dr visit, and if you go to the doctor once a year, pay the fine and pay the doctor out of your pocket. If you want insurance, it's gonna cost.

guys do be careful when enrolling for obamacare, i read recently that more than 700 fake websites have been created to defraud folks. apparently you can tell which sites are a bunch of baloney because they are easy to log on to!

make sure that you start out at healthcare.gov instead of healthfraud.xxx

lol on hold for an hour and as soon as i hear a dial tone the call ends. waited twice as long a couple nights ago only to connect to someone who seemed to have no idea what he was doing

how is this worse than before

For what its worth, when you get it as a benefit through a company, you're putting money in and they're putting money in. You just don't feel it the same.

I have never had health insurance through a job. At one point, when I was in my early 30s, I was paying like $700/mo. Now I'm at a "manageable" $470/mo. I was afraid I was gonna start getting reamed this year, having turned 40, but no.

I have trouble with the exchange/subsidies because my income varies wildly from year to year. If I got subsidized based on my income from last year, I would definitely have to pay that money back based on my income in the upcoming year.

Are you mostly/entirely self-employed?

I hassled my daughter into finally checking the ACA website and it looks like she's eligible for huge tax credits that will completely cover the cost of her coverage.

I am sometimes/mostly/entirely self-employed but occasionally hourly w4 employee and sometimes 1099 contractor and sometimes not making any money and sometimes making a normal amount of money.

I do have some family members that are in this middle class suck hole, where the cheapest thing they can get are plans with shit deductables and $800/month premiums for the three of them, which is allegedly three times what they were paying a few years ago. i feel for them but still.

I am sometimes/mostly/entirely self-employed but occasionally hourly w4 employee and sometimes 1099 contractor and sometimes not making any money and sometimes making a normal amount of money.

It makes it really convoluted -- because they base the subsidy/credit on some modified AGI, so it would be your net profit from self-employment/1099s, so in addition to timing expenses to reduce self-employment tax, you would also be doing it for the ACA subsidy/credit.

classic url here:

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/dc/scotus-king-obamacare-workarounds-doomed

"We're quite pessimistic. The operational, legal and political challenges here are immense," Nicholas Bagley, a University of Michigan law professor who co-authored the article, told TPM in a phone interview on Thursday. "The more I've looked at this, the more alarmed I've grown."

The problem is three-pronged: Legal, because the Affordable Care Act sets some very specific requirements for state-based exchanges; practical, because states might not have time or authority to act after the Court ruling comes down in June, as expected; and political, because Republican intransigence against Obamacare is currently one of the defining elements of American politics.

An adverse Court ruling in the King vs. Burwell case would invalidate the law's tax credits, received by nearly 90 percent of Obamacare enrollees in 2014, in at least 34 states that are using the federal website. Health coverage would likely then become unaffordable for many enrollees, and those who choose to keep paying the higher price are more likely to be sick and more costly, potentially sending the law into a dreaded death spiral.