I Want My Liberace Record Back! The Gene Hackman Poll

even those indistinguishable late eighties/early nineties thrillers had sterling work by him -- and are more watchable than you think.

No one remembers a poll, so I’ll go ahead.

I just finished watching Superman II, of all things, which gave me the idea. The movie was okay (basically a lot of people trekking up to the Arctic to commune with Marlon Brando’s floating head), but it was funny how Hackman was off doing his own movie and having such a great time. Just on the basis of Tenenbaums, he outlasted De Niro, Nicholson, and Pacino in terms of coming up with a performance equal to or surpassing his best. He’s 82 now, and I guess officially retired. I don’t know how many actors were able to do it so well and so actively for so long.

I had to eliminate about 20 films to get down to the 50 maximum. The first 10 were easy, the rest difficult, but I tried to weed out lesser known stuff or what seemed to be smaller roles.

Voting for Royal Tenenbaums, as it shoulda been his career capping Best Actor winner (though it wasn't even nominated).

feel compelled to express some appreciation for his bit in Cisco Pike

Anyway, my picks:

Under Fire
Unforgiven
Night Moves (1975)
The French Connection (1971)
Young Frankenstein (1974)
The Conversation (1974)

I wish he'd accepted more comedies like YF, All Night Long, Superman II and The Birdcage.

I just finished watching Superman II, of all things, which gave me the idea. The movie was okay (basically a lot of people trekking up to the Arctic to commune with Marlon Brando’s floating head), but it was funny how Hackman was off doing his own movie and having such a great time.

Hackman bargaining with an impassive Zod ("Australia!") = A+

lol I just watched Superman II yesterday too

btw the Richard Donner cut you cite, clemenza, is quite terrible; it shocked me how fans seemed to prefer it when released on DVD a few years ago. I'm amazed no one's been able to release the made for TV version aired in the mid eighties that makes the villains more villainous, Reeve's humiliation more poignant, and Hackman's moments more hilarious.

"Superman! Thank god! I mean - get 'im!"

(not, by the way, calling you out for alluding to it, just I was shocked by Donner's decision to include a floating Marlon Brando head when Brando was the worst thing about the original).

(xpost) You're right--I knew he didn't win, but I assumed he was nominated. The "Australia!" bit reminded me of Dr. Evil asking for a million dollars ransom. I was wondering how the Donner cut compared to the original (Lester), which Kael really liked.

One of a few actors where I think I can list a top 10.

In this case the reductive interpretation is the best. Donner = known for faceless dumb action. Lester = laffs but uneven directing action.

I own the original Lester cut - never seen this Donner version, sounds like I probably shouldn't...?

One of a few actors where I think I can list a top 10

Indeed. Even the ones below ten are ideal rainy Sunday afternoon films.

Wondered why u guys thought Brando's head was in S2.

I saw Marooned as a child in the theater. His breakdown scene was terrifying.

He's great in Lilith, one-scene part opposite Warren Beatty in '64.

his two-minute perf in Woody's Another Woman as a lovelorn novelist jolts the film to life.

That's one that I eliminated, not sure if it was a good choice. I haven't seen it...it seemed to be a smaller role, at least in terms of screen time.

Unforgiven for the scene in his leaky house with the writer.

smaller than Young Frankenstein??? xp

would shortlist Night Moves and Under Fire. He's better in more demanding circumstances in French Connection II than in I, maybe.

Unforgiven is one of those films I loved when it came out and then have steadily grown to hate over the years

Under Fire is one of my favorite movies.

Unforgiven was almost my vote. "But...I was building a house..." always slays me.

(shit, wish I could change my vote now)

lol fave moment from that ben stiller profile in the nyer recently was stiller talking about approaching hackman on the tenenbaums set and telling him how much the poseidon adventure meant to him as a kid and hackman just replying 'money job'.

lol

gr8

I didn't hugely like Unforgiven in '92 -- never rewatched -- but typically GH was the best thing in it.

That's the problem when you haven't seen something (i.e., Another Woman)--one difference, though, is that his bit in Young Frankenstein is somewhat famous.

My top three are the obvious: The Conversation, Tenenbaums, and Night Moves. After that--and I'm going to guess I've seen close to half--I'd go with Cisco Pike, Scarecrow, Class Action, The Firm, The French Connection, Young Frankenstein, and the two Supermans. Wasn't that big on Unforgiven, more to do with Eastwood than him. Most want to see Downhill Racer.

anyhow really know i should vote night moves or the conversation or one of the french connections here or maybe hoosiers or crimson tide for sentimental reasons or maybe heist cuz god was he built for mamet but feel like to really honor what makes hackman special i should choose one where the material and the film in general are mediocre at heart but salvaged by a great hackman performance. the firm it is!

I think he's like Boyle in The Candidate in Downhill Racer: the vinegar/ cold reality in Redford's life.

I know--the film is junk, but he (and Holly Hunter, and Gary Busey) are so good. (xpost)

don't forget brimley!
http://blog.301films.com/images/wilford.gif

The Firm was one of the few potboilers I read before watching the movie (it was a huge seller, remember), so I was kinda stunned Hackman took this nothing part and made an almost tragic hero out of it.

He also gets away with a mullet.

lol what is that Brimley painting all about?

It's about him being a walrus.

It's the right thing to do.

this guy went on a noble crusade starting in the 80s and going thru retirement to make any old pile of shit he was in watchable. a movie like The Firm almost doesnt deserve the A-game he brings to it. tough poll, might go with Unforgiven

Feel like people might be in danger of sleeping on Get Shorty here, and how funny he was in it.

Look at me.

when he's funny, he's great, but it's v hard to rank the comic stuff alongside the dramatic. (which is why the AAs gen ignore comedy)

i'm trying to think of what clem cut that was a starring role, and so far i got Zandy's Bride?

what about Hackman's addled monologue in The Birdcage about driving through America ("Purple mountains. Grain.")?

It's about him being a walrus.

― a regina spektor is haunting europe (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, July 23, 2012 2:43 PM (7 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

It's the right thing to do.

― a regina spektor is haunting europe (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, July 23, 2012 2:43 PM (7 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lol, indeed.

I was sitting here wondering if there was something I was missing about Brimley being a seal. Duh. It's been a long day.

Some others that ended up on the cutting-room floor: Lilith, Hawaii, Riot, The Gypsy Moths, Doctor's Wives, Lucky Lady, The Domino Principle, A Bridge Too Far, Reds, Postcards from the Edge, and a few what looked to be starring roles from the '80s and '90s that I didn't know at all (e.g., Split Decisions).

he's good in Reds and Postcards too; he probably deserves his own supporting actor poll too.

If ILE did single artist ballot polls for actors the way we're doing for musical artists, Hackman would be the one I'd want to see first. But we don't need more polling.

I think I have to go with Unforgiven here.

"But we don't need more polling."

Or do we?

My long-ago memory is that he was very good in Reds, but he gets 26th billing on the IMDB page--one scene, I'm guessing?

one or two, a drop in the bucket

Excuse to rescue this from the void: a local station was playing Class Action last night, and I hung around for about the last half. I don't think many people have seen it. Michael Apted directed (somewhere between 28 and 35 Up, I think), and there's a good turn from Fred Thompson, before he graduated to reverse-mortgage spokesperson. Hackman's excellent, in what might be the only drippy film I associate with him...parts of it, anyway--mostly it's just good solid courtroom stuff.

I saw Class Action on a plane when I was 11 and it diverted me long enough that I didn't throw up.

Oh, and Heist -- I think the movie overall is 2nd-tier Mamet, but Hackman's great. "I don't want you to be as quiet as an ant pissing on cotton. I want you to be as quiet as an ant not even thinking about pissing on cotton."

kinda amazed french connection only managed one vote!

we would never vote for a guy's star-making performance in a million years.

yeah hackman, devito and lindo are all killer in Heist.

Hackman in Narrow Margin is like Willie Mays in 1959, when he hit .313, with 34 homers and 104 RBI; about his 12th best season, a career year for almost anyone else. The movie's not bad, although the original, which I saw many years ago, is undoubtedly better. (Is there another movie that has both J.T. and M. Emmet Walsh?)

Had a ball rewatching Narrow Margin. Even in minor stuff he's so fucking watchable.

I wish he'd accepted more comedies like YF, All Night Long, Superman II and The Birdcage.

― a regina spektor is haunting europe (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, July 23, 2012 2:05 PM (four years ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Have you seen No Way Out? LOL city.

Man, no mention anywhere of "March Or Die", the Foreign Legion flick he starred in along with Terence Hill(!), Catherine Deneuve, Jaws from those Moore "Bond" films and Max Von Sydow. Just watched it - terribly uneven but beautifully made and Hackman is nice and twisted in it. Love him doing nasty/conflicted.

Adding to what I posted about Class Action above...I think, like Gus Van Sant's Promised Land, it's the best kind of middlebrow social-conscience film (mixed with a good courtroom drama), a genre that, sorry, I don't think Spielberg has any special feeling for. The thing that struck me this time--thinking about Julia Roberts and Pretty Woman, Sandra Bullock and Speed, Michelle Pfeiffer and The Fabulous Baker Boys--was how did Mary Elizabeth Mastrantonio not become a big, bankable star after Class Action? She's fantastic, especially in the weepy scenes, the kind of thing I generally can't stand. She seems to be drawing on something very deep in dealing with the death of her character's mother, and with the relationship between her and her father (Hackman doing generally excellent Hackman stuff). The lawyer jargon gets too cute when Mastrantonio and Hackman start using it in a heated argument--"You're out of order, counselor!"--but otherwise, there's not too much about the film I don't like. Well, Harold Melvin for Mick Hucknell, obviously, although the song is strong enough to withstand that rather ill-advised choice.

https://m.media-amazon.com/images/M/MV5BNDBmNDZkNjItZWYyYy00NmRhLWIyNmUtNzc4ZjQxNWYyMWM0XkEyXkFqcGdeQXVyMjUyNDk2ODc@._V1_.jpg

She really made a positive impression on me in a lot of films, but it looks like she mostly went back to theater. She was in only half a dozen major films since Class Action and most of them didn’t make much impact. She got unlucky in picking White Sands and Consenting Adults and then after that she seems to have quit pursuing major roles. Or they stopped pursuing her? She could have been a bigger star. Maybe she got tired of it.

i don't think Class Action was a huge hit

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Class_Action_(film)#Reception

Yeah, I remember it didn't seem to get much attention. Apted was in the middle of the 7-Up series, she'd already done The Color of Money, Hackman was still pretty big (albeit a decade removed from his heyday), but for some reason it disappeared quickly. I'd urge anyone who hasn't seen it to give it a look. (High praise from jer.fairall above: "it diverted me long enough that I didn't throw up.")

(Oh, and Scarface. I guess I had successfully suppressed my memory of that.)

90 today!

Gene Hackman retired from acting 17 years ago, but had this recent pic taken to show he is alive and well at 91, and living in New Mexico. He goes bike riding every day and remains active and engaged with hobbies, and friends. pic.twitter.com/HzYGv7duLv

— James L Neibaur (@JimLNeibaur) August 2, 2021

(RIP Morbs)

94 today. The big six of the '70s--him, Pacino, De Niro, Hoffman, Redford, and Beatty; room for disagreement there (Eastwood a much bigger box-office star, obviously)--are all still alive.

Should we re-run this poll? (Serious question, it feels like this didn’t get many votes overall)

And Eastwood's still alive too, if you want to make it a big seven.

Nicholson

...and if you want to go there, Dern

Hackman has kept a pretty low profile since he retired, though he does go out in public where he lives. I've seen photos of him, he's out there driving and doing his thing. i'm so used to him as a burly kinda guy that to see him a lot more lean is weird, but glad he's apparently got his health and mobility.

Duh! Nicholson, yeah...Should never post on the run while out for coffee...Also, I realize Richard Pryor and Richard Roundtree had periods of big box-office success. I was thinking more awards/critical acclaim/box-office--they and Eastwood don't match the others. And yes, I was just thinking of male actors...No formula, just a dashed-off list. Do I need any more qualifiers?

it's interesting because obv there were also actors like Scheider, Dreyfuss, O'Neal, Sutherland, Wilder, Reynolds -- actors who to varying degrees were all operating at their peak level and who had critical success as well. though w/O'Neal, it could be argued he wasn't so much a fine actor as he was particularly well used for his blankness in several films.

but none of those actors really hit the iconic heights across the board of course

I don’t rate Ned Beatty as high as you do

he's out there driving and doing his thing

Someone caught him on film just this morning--looking very spry for his age.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciHMuk0VLmY

Thinking about this on the drive home, how I'd categorize them:

Nicholson, De Niro, Pacino -- first tier, the three guys who most define the decade.

Hoffman and Hackman -- a shade below; actor's actors, maybe minus some of the glamour of the three above

Redford and Beatty -- sex symbols striving for more; more serious roles, directing, etc.

The genre/action stars -- Eastwood at the top, and then Reynolds, McQueen, Roundtree, Jim Brown, Charles Bronson, etc.

After that, character actors, second-tier stars (e.g., Richard Dreyfuss), etc.

I would absolutely include Hoffman in the top tier. Including box office.

Nicholson, De Niro, Pacino -- first tier, the three guys who most define the decade.

Hoffman and Hackman -- a shade below; actor's actors, maybe minus some of the glamour of the three above

Redford and Beatty -- sex symbols striving for more; more serious roles, directing, etc.

The genre/action stars -- Eastwood at the top, and then Reynolds, McQueen, Roundtree, Jim Brown, Charles Bronson, etc.

After that, character actors, second-tier stars (e.g., Richard Dreyfuss), etc.

Where do you put Paul Newman? He slips between categories 1 and 3 for me.

He had a pretty good decade, but I still think of him as a '50s/60s guy, with a big comeback in the '80s. So I don't know where I'd put him.

Needs a separate thread, but I'd like to try actresses. The decade was grossly unfair to them. Jane Fonda would seem to stand alone at the top, but even she had to do stuff like Fun with Dick and Jane and Califonia Suite. Maybe Julie Christie, too, I don't know.

Califonia, right next door to Caledonia--say it with flair.

I still think of him as a '50s/60s guy, with a big comeback in the '80s

The Sting (1973)
The Towering Inferno (1974)
Slap Shot (1977)

That's a pretty good decade, all right.

* points at elliot gould like gen turgidson *

I thought of him, for sure. Gould and George Segal (and others, I'm sure) are almost a category unto themselves: so '70s they barely exist outside the decade. (Not meaning they didn't continue to work, just that the association is so strong.)

James Caan might be in that category too.

Again, this is not a science. You can shuffle and reconfigure them dozens of ways.

Yeah, any movie James Caan was in after Thief (1981) was received as a comeback.

The Sting is one of the highest grossing American films of all time.

Fun with Dick and Jane, after five years of activism and Godard films, was her comeback even though it's terrible.

Faye Dunaway has to be in the running if we're talking about female actors in The 1970s. But that was a decade when the new era of Hollywood really pushed male actors to the extreme forefront, maybe it was the auteurism from male directors that did this but you wound up with a lotta one-sided male gaze going on. When you look at it from that point of view, it feels like a step back from what was going on in the 1930s and 1940s and 1950s.

Knowing full well of course that Hollywood was definitely not an ideal place for women in those decades either.

Yeah, she was pretty key. Maybe Fonda, Christie, Dunaway, and Ellen Burstyn are at the top (although Burstyn's second half of the decade didn't match her first).

Dunaway, Keaton, MacLaine, Burstyn

Hell, even throw Streisand in the mix.

I love Desperate Characters, but I don't know about MacLaine in the '70s. (Didn't know--or had forgotten--she turned down The Exorcist.)

Sally Fields later in the decade...I'll start a new thread; Gene's losing his.

I'd add Liv Ullmann (two Oscar nods) and a fairly major cultural force for most of the decade.

MacLaine sat out the middle of the decade doing famous person stuff (travelled the world, did a Vegas revue) before coming back with The Turning Point.

Actress talk: You Like Me! (Actresses of the 1970s)

A cable station here aired The Conversation and Downhill Racer tonight.