Global Warming's Terrifying New Math

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I'm just not familiar with climate denier fiction, with the notable exception of Michael Crichton's State of Fear.

I've never read it, but Fallen Angels by Pournelle, Niven, & Flynn fits in here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallen_Angels_(science_fiction_novel)

Elvis Telecom, Tuesday, 15 January 2019 01:47 (five years ago) link

Niven is a sore spot, as Known Space (1965-80) was my favorite sci-fi world during my impressionable teens. I haven't bothered with much of his later work, and none of his collaborations with Pournelle, who I blame for his current politics.

Sanpaku, Tuesday, 15 January 2019 23:31 (five years ago) link

i don't know much about desalinization, but this seems troublesome

As countries in the Middle East, Africa, and elsewhere struggle to find enough freshwater to meet demand, they’re increasingly turned to the ocean. Desalination plants, located in 177 countries, can help turn seawater into freshwater. Unfortunately, these plants also produce a lot of waste—more waste, in fact, than water for people to drink.

A paper published Monday by United Nations University’s Institute for Water, Environment, and Health in the journal Science of the Total Environment found that desalination plants globally produce enough brine—a salty, chemical-laden byproduct—in a year to cover all of Florida in nearly a foot of it. That’s a lot of brine.

In fact, the study concluded that for every liter of freshwater a plant produces, 0.4 gallons (1.5 liters) of brine are produced on average. For all the 15,906 plants around the world, that means 37.5 billion gallons (142 billion liters) of this salty-ass junk every day. Brine production in just four Middle Eastern countries—Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Qatar, and the United Arab Emirates—accounts for more than half of this.


https://earther.gizmodo.com/the-dirty-truth-about-turning-seawater-into-drinking-wa-1831768754

Karl Malone, Wednesday, 16 January 2019 02:43 (five years ago) link

Just put it in the ground with the nuclear waste nbd

I have measured out my life in coffee shop loyalty cards (silby), Wednesday, 16 January 2019 03:27 (five years ago) link

wait..shouldn't we also be trying to inject it into oil deposits to improve recovery rates?

Karl Malone, Wednesday, 16 January 2019 03:34 (five years ago) link

So we can retrieve and burn more oil? Splendid idea!

A is for (Aimless), Wednesday, 16 January 2019 03:52 (five years ago) link

Seawater desalination is generally done at the shore. The brine is just returned whence it came from.

Saudi Arabia used to have substantial groundwater deposits, that were used for a few decades to turn the country into a wheat exporter. By the late-90s they finally figured out that its far wiser to import "embedded water" as wheat than to waste their last groundwater irrigating the desert.

Sanpaku, Wednesday, 16 January 2019 04:28 (five years ago) link

But the brine is heavy/sodium-overloaded seawater no? It's got to be harmful for producers and consumers in an area that already has the largest dead zone on earth

form that slug-like grex (outdoor_miner), Wednesday, 16 January 2019 14:47 (five years ago) link

There's diminishing returns with reverse-osmosis desalinisation, so the waste water usually isn't supersaturated Dead Sea brine, its just a couple fold saltier than seawater. If anything, it probably helps dead zones by sinking to the bottom with oxygen.

Sanpaku, Wednesday, 16 January 2019 15:22 (five years ago) link

Atlantic: Are We Living Through Climate Change’s Worst-Case Scenario?

Personally, I've thought we'll run between RCP 4.5 and RCP 8.5, but the outcomes will be similar to 8.5 (and of course, worse in future centuries), due to "global brightening" (as fewer aerosols are exhausted into the troposphere) and poorly modeled positive feedbacks.

Sanpaku, Wednesday, 16 January 2019 16:06 (five years ago) link

xps my brine oil exploitation fan-fic was supposed to be a joke

Karl Malone, Wednesday, 16 January 2019 16:14 (five years ago) link

went to a good book talk last night by the author of this book Planetary Improvement: Cleantech Entrepreneurship and the Contradictions of Green Capitalism that featured a couple of my colleagues

notes in the form of a livetweet thread here for the interested:

At @Pottershousedc for @commonwaste's talk on his new book.

"One thing I found consistently in the literature is a clear admission that capitalism is the problem, followed quickly by a 'solution' that's just a variation of capitalism. Disruptive tech, hippie capitalism, so on." pic.twitter.com/EiT9z6oywa

— justin jacoby smith (@hoosteen) January 15, 2019

BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Wednesday, 16 January 2019 16:23 (five years ago) link

a relatively lighthearted look at some exxon geoengineering ideas from the 90s

https://www.topic.com/giant-mirrors-ocean-whitening-here-s-how-exxon-wanted-to-save-the-planet

Karl Malone, Sunday, 20 January 2019 17:36 (five years ago) link

Kretschmer has found that over the last decades, the stratospheric polar vortex has become weaker and less stable, so Arctic air masses can escape more easily towards the North American and Eurasian continents. Here a schematic from UCAR. pic.twitter.com/Ss9LGN7KGe

— Stefan Rahmstorf (@rahmstorf) January 21, 2019

a Mets fan who gave up on everything in the mid '80s (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 22 January 2019 12:26 (five years ago) link

Apple predicts climate change will increase demand for iPhones, noting that they double as flashlights and sirens and can be charged by hand crank. https://t.co/eR3yhtiGRQ pic.twitter.com/RUTjTfN20j

— Christopher Flavelle (@cflav) January 22, 2019

a Mets fan who gave up on everything in the mid '80s (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 23 January 2019 18:07 (five years ago) link

massive eyeroll

god, if i somehow worked at apple and had to be involved in the preparation of whatever dumbass presentation/report they're referring to, i think i'd just quit that day and walk into the ocean

Karl Malone, Wednesday, 23 January 2019 18:10 (five years ago) link

the pentagon issued a report this week with the 'force multiplier' idea, 'climate change is gonna make everything that's bad worse'

BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Wednesday, 23 January 2019 18:12 (five years ago) link

we're going to need to decide how we feel about migration. and by that i mean we going to need to change our fucking views on what acceptable "levels" of border-crossing are and start acting like one human race for once.

illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, 23 January 2019 18:16 (five years ago) link

xp
doesn't surprise me, DOD has been putting out reports along similar lines for the past 15 years or so (at least) that seem to be completely ignored by people who typically worship at their feet

Karl Malone, Wednesday, 23 January 2019 18:16 (five years ago) link

we're going to need to decide how we feel about migration. and by that i mean we going to need to change our fucking views on what acceptable "levels" of border-crossing are and start acting like one human race for once.

otm, and i have a very bad feeling about how this national conversation is going to unfold

Karl Malone, Wednesday, 23 January 2019 18:17 (five years ago) link

The situation is a lot worse for Europe than in the Western Hemisphere, given how large tropical/subtropical populations already dependent on food charity, but I fully expect lifeboat ethics to be publically discussed by mainstream politicians in a couple decades. From a systems perspective, only systems with "circuit breakers" like impermeable borders are resilient to the kind of stresses losing half of global agriculture will bring.

Europeans are already funding nationalists in Libya to deter migrants. It's such a cheap and easy solution to encourage brown people to abuse brown people, that it will be adopted everywhere. In fact, I think Trump could have gotten his wall, if it was for subsidizing a wall between Mexico and Guatemala/El Salvador.

If there's hope for those in the developing tropics, its for initiatives in girl's education and family planning to make the turn in demographic trends, and charitable funding of self-sufficiency in energy and agriculture.

dancing the Radioactive Flesh (Sanpaku), Wednesday, 23 January 2019 18:30 (five years ago) link

or, you know, we could just grow the fuck up?

illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, 23 January 2019 18:52 (five years ago) link

can you say more about this option

BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Wednesday, 23 January 2019 19:11 (five years ago) link

Australia has just seen the world's hottest temperature recorded next to open ocean: 120.4°F (49.1°C), less than a block from the sea. https://t.co/fuEUt3Yqju

— Bob Henson (@bhensonweather) January 25, 2019

Plinka Trinka Banga Tink (Eliza D.), Friday, 25 January 2019 20:42 (five years ago) link

yes but it's far more important that we continue driving oil-machines and keeping certain human beings on the other side of an imaginary line BE REALISTIC

illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Friday, 25 January 2019 20:59 (five years ago) link

We’re really fucked if people treats statements like this seriously and not as ..you know...denial.

Neoliberalism rots people's brains into thinking climate policy means sacrificing something. If we do it right climate policy will mean most everyone gets luxurious public goods & a better quality of life as billionaires become millionaires and we shutter the fossil fuel industry

— Kate Aronoff (@KateAronoff) January 27, 2019

Nerdstrom Poindexter, Sunday, 27 January 2019 21:49 (five years ago) link

yeah thats some wishful thinking

21st savagery fox (m bison), Sunday, 27 January 2019 21:57 (five years ago) link

it sounds like wishful thinking to me too, but i know kate pretty well, and because of her years of reporting on the issue i trust that she knows the boundaries of the possible on this subject better than any of the 3 of us.

BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Monday, 28 January 2019 19:38 (five years ago) link

i'm sure its dark mirth for sanpaku, i don't get it either, i just have trust in the source here. see for ex a response here from Kallis, a degrowth guy whose work i follow:

Sounds like a good summary of what we mean by degrowth, yes. (I guess the part of degrowing private and material goods is left tactically out of the summary).

— Giorgos Kallis (@g_kallis) January 27, 2019

BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Monday, 28 January 2019 19:40 (five years ago) link

the problem? climate change! the solution? genocide!

Colonisation of the Americas at the end of the 15th Century killed so many people, it disturbed Earth's climate.

That's the conclusion of scientists from University College London, UK.

The team says the disruption that followed European settlement led to a huge swathe of abandoned agricultural land being reclaimed by fast-growing trees and other vegetation.

This pulled down enough carbon dioxide (CO₂) from the atmosphere to eventually chill the planet.

It's a cooling period often referred to in the history books as the "Little Ice Age" - a time when winters in Europe would see the Thames in London regularly freeze over.

"The Great Dying of the Indigenous Peoples of the Americas led to the abandonment of enough cleared land that the resulting terrestrial carbon uptake had a detectable impact on both atmospheric CO₂ and global surface air temperatures," Alexander Koch and colleagues write in their paper published in Quaternary Science Reviews.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-47063973

maxwell’s silver hang suite (bizarro gazzara), Thursday, 31 January 2019 16:15 (five years ago) link

didn't this get reported last year also?

BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Thursday, 31 January 2019 17:20 (five years ago) link

the evidence for the ecological benefits of genocide mounts!

maxwell’s silver hang suite (bizarro gazzara), Thursday, 31 January 2019 17:22 (five years ago) link

That sort of result was claimed for the Mongol invasions and Black Death here:

Pongratz et al, 2011. Coupled climate–carbon simulations indicate minor global effects of wars and epidemics on atmospheric CO2 between ad 800 and 1850. The Holocene, 21(5), pp.843-851.

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if some enterprising billionaire is funding development of some antibiotic resistant pneumonic plague, etc. as the least painful way of dealing with coming overpopulation/climate/resource crises.

innocence adjacent (Sanpaku), Thursday, 31 January 2019 17:23 (five years ago) link

The plot of The Kingsman iirc

Nerdstrom Poindexter, Thursday, 31 January 2019 17:49 (five years ago) link

this is what i had in mind from last year

https://www.theguardian.com/science/2018/jun/10/colonialism-changed-earth-geology-claim-scientists

“The arrival of 16th century Europeans, in particular the British and Spanish, had a profound impact on central and southern America,” Maslin told the Observer. “They carried germs for smallpox, measles, flu, typhoid and many other diseases that led to the deaths of more than 50 million Americans – who had no previous exposure to these pathogens – within a few decades. Society in America collapsed and subsistence farming there was wiped out.”

Forests returned to land that had been abandoned by humans. “We can detect this in Antarctic ice cores,” added Maslin. “These provide a history of the atmosphere for thousands of years and show carbon dioxide levels reached a distinct minimum around 1610 because forests, which are much better than farm crops at absorbing carbon dioxide, were now covering vastly increased areas of the American landscape – thanks to the eradication of the people who had once farmed there.” This effect continued for decades until America’s population of humans was restored.

Within decades of the discovery of America, Europeans were eating its potatoes and tomatoes, while China and India were consuming its peppers. These imports also had a profound impact. “In China, for example, the arrival of maize allowed drier lands to be farmed, driving new waves of deforestation and a large population increase,” say the authors. The colonising of America resulted in a trade triangle: manufactured goods from Europe were sold to Africa for slaves, who were transported to the Americas to grow cotton and tobacco for Europe. For the first time, the world was bound into a single global economic system. Globalisation had begun and its impact on the planet has since been vast. One result has been the homogenisation of life on Earth. Rats and other pests carried on ships have overrun the habitats of isolated species, while more and more land has been turned over to agriculture.

“A good example is provided by the earthworm,” said Maslin. “In the US, most of the earthworms you will find there are actually European. They are better at competing for nutrients. So they have taken over the soil in North America since Europeans brought them across the Atlantic in the 16th century. That is not something you can unpick. They are there for good.” This last point is summed up by the two authors: “The Anthropocene began with widespread colonialism and slavery; it is a story of how people treat the environment and how people treat each other.”

BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Thursday, 31 January 2019 18:39 (five years ago) link

see also:

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-018-05727-4

Nicholas Loughlin at the Open University in Milton Keynes, UK, and his colleagues examined soil cores from a lake in Ecuador’s Quijos Valley. Pollen, charcoal and fungal spores in the cores indicate that indigenous peoples intensively farmed and burned the land for some 500 years before the first Europeans arrived in the sixteenth century.

The samples also suggest that this agricultural activity ended abruptly in around 1588, when an influx of Spanish colonists led to the death or dispersal of most of the local population. By roughly 1820, the structure of the Quijos Valley ‘cloud forest’ was similar to that of the forests that blanketed the region 40,000 years ago, well before humans first settled the area.

BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Thursday, 31 January 2019 18:41 (five years ago) link

thanks for these links, hoos, i'll read through them when i get home.

it's all very...awkward, from an enviro/political/persuasive point of view. for the last three decades we've had competing strategies on how to address pollution and climate change. broadly:

1) a cornucopian belief that existing and future technology will save the day via the invisible hand
2) a tech/policy-driven posture that aligns with neoliberalism and technocratic governance approaches
3) a more aggressive, radical activist (and some scientists) movement to fundamentally change the way we approach energy and the environment,
4) whatever we should call the dumbfuck evil republicans and industry groups which actively seek policies which undermine the lives of billions of people.

4 plays well with 1. And 1 and 2 have a lot of overlap. 3 has always been off in its own world, with little political support. Recent political leaders and big green groups have found themselves firmly entrenched within 2. And part of the neoliberal technocratic approach is the constant assurance that people aren’t the problem, stressing that we don’t have to sacrifice human wellbeing to fix the environment (that we broke), that human and environmental progress can go hand and hand. That was certainly the line in the Obama administration, which was a big improvement over the Bush-era.

but…the problem is that 3) is probably the most appropriate way to go at this point. There was a time, about twenty to thirty fucking years ago, when there might have been time to bend the curve of GHG emissions downward, trending toward zero, with enough of a buffer to mitigate most of the worst consequences of climate change. That time appears to have passed, but the political world is still operating as if nothing has changed.

i don’t know, not sure what point I’m getting to, if there is any. It’s just…the Obama-era “all of the above” energy strategy and “cutting energy use is actually GOOD for GDP, which is a wonderful way to measure human progress!!” is really hard to square with reports like the ones Hoos highlighted. I hope this means that more and more AOC’s will show up who will tell the truth, but there are just a TON of people out there who still have no idea and got sick of hearing about this shit back during the Population Bomb-era.

Karl Malone, Thursday, 31 January 2019 19:13 (five years ago) link

starting this today also as a counterbalance to the degrowth reading

https://imgv2-1-f.scribdassets.com/img/word_document/281433794/original/432x574/f3576d30fb/1548487424?v=1

BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Thursday, 31 January 2019 20:33 (five years ago) link

evidence that sudden depopulation of the americas lead to global climate change is summarized in Charles c. Mann’s 1491, a (pretty good) pop anthropology book published in 2005

sciatica, Thursday, 31 January 2019 20:51 (five years ago) link

i want to read more about it. the thing is, obviously the scientific community was already aware of the little ice age, and i thought they already had various explanations for what caused it? (for example: volcanos and changes is arctic sea ice cover). but of course there could be a variety of complementary forces contributing to the same outcome

Karl Malone, Thursday, 31 January 2019 20:56 (five years ago) link

1491 is a cracking read

illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Thursday, 31 January 2019 21:00 (five years ago) link

agreed

sleeve, Thursday, 31 January 2019 21:03 (five years ago) link

Some graceful writing which found itself in the WaPo Style section:Everything is not going to be okay: How to live with constant reminders that the Earth is in trouble

To grasp the problem, we have to slow down. To respond to it, we have to act fast.

innocence adjacent (Sanpaku), Saturday, 2 February 2019 18:12 (five years ago) link

good long excerpt here from david wallace-wells' the uninhabitable earth even-handedly looking at the tools we already have to fight climate change and why we might well still fuck it up anyway

No single solution alone is sufficient, but the solutions, plural, are here already. As climate activists often say, we have, today, all the tools we need to avoid catastrophic change. It’s true: a carbon tax and government action to aggressively phase out dirty energy, even outright ban much of it; a new approach to agricultural practices and a shift away from beef and dairy in global diet; and public investment in green energy and carbon capture. We just need to choose to implement them — all of them — and quite fast. But of course political will is not some trivial ingredient always at hand. We probably have the tools we need to solve global poverty, epidemic disease, and the abuse of women, as well.

http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/02/book-excerpt-the-uninhabitable-earth-david-wallace-wells.html

Calgary customer Elvis Cavalic (bizarro gazzara), Monday, 4 February 2019 15:44 (five years ago) link

well uhhhh... shit

Scientists have discovered an enormous void under an Antarctic glacier, sparking concern that the ice sheet is melting faster than anyone had realized — and spotlighting the dire threat posed by rising seas to coastal cities around the world, including New York City and Miami.

The cavity under Thwaites Glacier in West Antarctica is about six miles long and 1,000 feet deep — representing the loss of 14 billion tons of ice.

It was discovered after an analysis of data collected by Italian and German satellites, as well as NASA’s Operation IceBridge, a program in which aircraft equipped with ice-penetrating radar fly over polar regions to study the terrain.

The discovery is described in a paper published Jan. 30 in the journal Science Advances. The researchers expected to see significant loss of ice, but the scale of the void came as a shock.

“The size of the cavity is surprising, and as it melts, it’s causing the glacier to retreat,” said Pietro Milillo, a radar scientist at NASA’s Jet Propulsion Laboratory in Pasadena, California, and the paper’s lead author. He said the ice shelf encompassing the Florida-sized glacier is retreating at a rate in excess of 650 feet per year, and that most of the melting that led to the void occurred during the past three years.

https://www.nbcnews.com/mach/science/hole-opens-under-antarctic-glacier-big-enough-fit-two-thirds-ncna965696

Calgary customer Elvis Cavalic (bizarro gazzara), Tuesday, 5 February 2019 15:48 (five years ago) link

cool cool cool

BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Tuesday, 5 February 2019 18:09 (five years ago) link

it's cool when glaciers start moving so fas (~ 2 feet a day, a little less than an inch per hour) that you can actually sit there and watch them move. it's up there with the opening of the northwest passage as a convenient, quality of life kind of improvement

Karl Malone, Tuesday, 5 February 2019 18:19 (five years ago) link

why we might well still fuck it up anyway

if this were a war that could be fought with soldiers, guns and bombs, we'd be all over this. instead it is a "hearts and minds" battle, and the forces of evil have the preponderance of advantage on their side, because change is hard and plunging straight ahead over the cliff is easier, especially when the cliff's edge is in the indistinct and difficult to imagine future rather than at one's feet.

A is for (Aimless), Tuesday, 5 February 2019 19:04 (five years ago) link

the new civilization VI expansion adds climate change

https://i.imgur.com/J4daZvn.jpg

Karl Malone, Tuesday, 12 February 2019 02:35 (five years ago) link

What does the future hold for your children? pic.twitter.com/VQXJswcngn

— Baroness von Sketch (@BaronessShow) October 11, 2018

no expense was incurred (Sanpaku), Friday, 15 February 2019 22:23 (five years ago) link


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