Real England

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where is it and what does it look like

Nigel Farage is a fucking hero (nakhchivan), Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:12 (eight years ago) link

Raymond Williams says somewhere that most people who live in it live in quite small towns, but there is next to no significant literature about same.

Of course he was writing before Midsomer Murders aired.

http://i1.trekearth.com/photos/64476/dscf1947scrsfr.jpg

^^^wiltshire apparently (i'm not sure i know where wiltshire actually is) < /the lex >

mark s, Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:16 (eight years ago) link

i don't know how the demographics break down now but i wd say that a significant majority at least want to live in quite small towns. also i suspect quite small towns are increasingly really dissipated cities.

Agyness Dei (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:19 (eight years ago) link

Anyone bothered with Paul Kingsnorth's book on this very subject?

Lars and the Lulu Girl (NickB), Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:21 (eight years ago) link

but y'knaa this whole problematic word "Real" - is this intended sarcastically, like is this thread about "what are the sort of people who use the phrase 'Real England' talking about?" or are we positing a defining core of Englishness that has history and still survives however tenuous?

Agyness Dei (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:21 (eight years ago) link

i think it would be facetious to pretend the issue can be approached entirely unfacetiously

Nigel Farage is a fucking hero (nakhchivan), Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:22 (eight years ago) link

i was not aware of paul kingsnorth but now i see he has written a book called real england colon something else, i would guess it isn't the only book/treatise/pamphlet with similar title

Nigel Farage is a fucking hero (nakhchivan), Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:23 (eight years ago) link

work filter has thoughtfully blocked access to my first google search result, some blog with the delightfully making-me-want-to-stab-the-author subtitle "The Battle Against the Bland". i assure you guys if there is a Real England it is not battling against The Bland and that is an excellent virtue in itself.

Agyness Dei (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:24 (eight years ago) link

oh right, that is the subtitle of Kingsnorth's book. okay then i will probably never read it since i infer from the book's post-colonage that the guy is a big douche.

Agyness Dei (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:24 (eight years ago) link

the usual English attention to the wrong details

Agyness Dei (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:25 (eight years ago) link

and some sadness for stuff passing that has not passed or was not what he claims it was before it passed

Agyness Dei (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:26 (eight years ago) link

is john terry 'real england' dyou suppose

blind pele (darraghmac), Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:27 (eight years ago) link

i infer from the book's post-colonage that the guy is a big douche.

― Agyness Dei (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:24 (1 minute ago)

h but f, nv, h but f

basically i was looking at the squad list for peterbrough town and noticed ryan tunnicliffe and lee frecklington and thought maybe those names were shibboleths that uttered in a certain way might usher you into the innermost real england

Nigel Farage is a fucking hero (nakhchivan), Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:27 (eight years ago) link

http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/01185/arts-graphics-2008_1185572a.jpg

the city hobgoblin as a good place to start! (of course he said british not english, right, re the wrong detail)

mark s, Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:35 (eight years ago) link

"... heir to an immense fortune, gifted by nature with a mind susceptible of noble cultivation, and a body endowed with admirable physical powers with the wretched drunkard who died in a gaol at the age of thirty-eight, a worn-out debauchee and drivelling sot... " <-- i am this very second ensconced in the village that surnamed this regency rake, tho he mainly lived on the other side of shrewsbury

mark s, Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:41 (eight years ago) link

nigel farage isn't real btw, he speaks for only his own constituency, which is seldom more than symbolic

is there a real england that is incapable of any sort of assimilation into colonned literature? a planar england that resists signification or commodification by interlopers from other englands

Nigel Farage is a fucking hero (nakhchivan), Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:43 (eight years ago) link

south dublin iirc

blind pele (darraghmac), Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:44 (eight years ago) link

leatherhead is a promotory over a large and brackish inland sea that is never spoken of

mark s, Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:45 (eight years ago) link

beneath the leylines, the true underground

mark s, Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:46 (eight years ago) link

"Winter, 1981: the headless, skinned bodies of two bears are found by the River Lea."

mark s, Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:51 (eight years ago) link

real england is all mates and and blood sausage and big bottomed birds reading thew newsie-wewsies

max, Thursday, 3 November 2011 13:57 (eight years ago) link

nah it's hedgerows and birds and complete lack of public services

blind pele (darraghmac), Thursday, 3 November 2011 14:08 (eight years ago) link

Oh it's all about the public services nowadays; a bus to take you into town so you can spend all night trawling the happy hour bars, a streetcleaner to mop up your vomit from the pavement, a policeman to give you a place to spend the night. No-one needed public services when an evening's entertainment consisted of watching the sun set over a russet autumnal hedgerow, lulled into a reverie by the carefree birdsong.

ceci n'est pas un nom d'affichage (ledge), Thursday, 3 November 2011 14:17 (eight years ago) link

http://www.photohistory-sussex.co.uk/UckFrisbyPiltdown03.jpg

mark s, Thursday, 3 November 2011 14:19 (eight years ago) link

"Searching for the Putdown Man"

ceci n'est pas un nom d'affichage (ledge), Thursday, 3 November 2011 14:21 (eight years ago) link

is there a real england that is incapable of any sort of assimilation into colonned literature? a planar england that resists signification or commodification by interlopers from other englands

Interesting question which I wish I could answer.

Ned Trifle X, Thursday, 3 November 2011 14:29 (eight years ago) link

I don't know if I would like that England even.

Ned Trifle X, Thursday, 3 November 2011 14:29 (eight years ago) link

is there a culture that can't be commodified? and i have to be v. v. careful not to paint my cultures, or the cultures i've drifted along the fringes of, as the only real England. the problem is that the word is usually only spoken out loud by a certain kind of cultural capitalist, whose vision of it is just as tangential as mine. bullshit about fair play and honest toil and love of the land that i'd counter with a nation of sneak thiefs, factionalists and urban wastrels. the contestedness is always part of the Reality of the nation, any nation really.

Agyness Dei (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 3 November 2011 15:39 (eight years ago) link

for every sleepy Sunday C of E-attending agnostic Tory there's an apocalypse-welcoming hair-splitting anabaptist

Agyness Dei (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 3 November 2011 15:41 (eight years ago) link

Everywhere north of Enfield is basically a wasteland isn't it? Brrrr... Nothing there. Just a man collecting lumps of mud and putting them into a cloth bag.

Glo-Vember (dog latin), Thursday, 3 November 2011 15:42 (eight years ago) link

yeah but the determination of that which is essential need not be a question of mere majorities

blind pele (darraghmac), Thursday, 3 November 2011 15:43 (eight years ago) link

everybody shd read The Uses of Literacy to see how you can constructively get this wrong in a way that doesn't just mourn real heritage centres. obv Williams and E.P. Thompson and Stuart Hall too

Agyness Dei (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 3 November 2011 15:43 (eight years ago) link

the determination of that which is essential need not be a question of mere majorities

quite so, how about the British Isles then as a dumping ground/refugee camp/Wild West for Europe and parts south-east, over millenia, fuelling endless negotiation and conflict over territory, and that is the quicksand underneath Real England that we think of as bedrock?

Agyness Dei (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 3 November 2011 15:46 (eight years ago) link

look mate there's no need to get fucking personal, alright

blind pele (darraghmac), Thursday, 3 November 2011 15:49 (eight years ago) link

btw if i was gonna put forward one Real England it wd be old photographs of works sports teams or outings or other ceremonial jollies

Agyness Dei (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 3 November 2011 15:49 (eight years ago) link

it would be the commie permawheezing mustachioed drunk one in tinker tailor, tho no doubt they'd have you b'leev it's smiley or haydon

blind pele (darraghmac), Thursday, 3 November 2011 15:52 (eight years ago) link

wait haydon was the commie?

Agyness Dei (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 3 November 2011 15:54 (eight years ago) link

SPOILERS

nah think he was the aesthete on a protest against the yanks more than anything else, wasn't the dude ciaran hinds played proper lefty in stated methods tho

blind pele (darraghmac), Thursday, 3 November 2011 15:56 (eight years ago) link

the sparking point of Real England is where the plummy port-swilling foxhunter runs up against the chippy millenarian work-dodger and we drink each others' health and promise ourselves deep down that one day our kind will crush theirs

Agyness Dei (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 3 November 2011 15:57 (eight years ago) link

the phoenicians sailed up round to albion to trade tin for spice before the romans had even got out of bed, and if they weren't trading with aboriginal pre-celt and pre-pict inhabitants, then it was certainly aboriginal+1: an island of proto-druid shopkeepers since time immaterial

stonehenge is actually a kind of cashpoint machine

mark s, Thursday, 3 November 2011 15:58 (eight years ago) link

xp

oh, Roy Bland. yeah Bland is the angry Puritan I've been talking about, defending his country so's his people can crush the effete Squire class one day

Agyness Dei (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 3 November 2011 15:59 (eight years ago) link

but mark, who's to say the aborigines hadn't hopped off the boat from Boulogne just ahead of the celts themselves and so on and so forth??

Agyness Dei (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 3 November 2011 16:00 (eight years ago) link

irish close to turks dna-wise iirc

blind pele (darraghmac), Thursday, 3 November 2011 16:03 (eight years ago) link

i think that's exactly what mark is saying, tbf

blind pele (darraghmac), Thursday, 3 November 2011 16:04 (eight years ago) link

Of all the Tribe of Tegumai
Who cut that figure, none remain
On Merrow Down the cuckoos cry
The silence and the sun remain

xp he's called smiley, he has to be of outlander extraction

mark s, Thursday, 3 November 2011 16:13 (eight years ago) link

^ I wasn't at that FAP

R. Stornoway (Tom D.), Thursday, 3 November 2011 16:34 (eight years ago) link

clun forest all-mercian jug band champions, tractor runs on wattle and daub

mark s, Thursday, 3 November 2011 16:34 (eight years ago) link

never get away with haircuts like that up in the Danelaw

Agyness Dei (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 3 November 2011 16:36 (eight years ago) link

at the time, you had to wear a shirt, tie and shoes to get into Tramps on a Saturday - we only went on Thursdays which I think was student night (I guess technically we were students) and it was £1 a pint and you could wear jeans. Tramps was a nicer building but the atmosphere was better in Images. you could easily get into trouble at either though, aggro was never far away!

Images had a very relaxed attitude to underage drinking. You could get in by showing the bouncer your National Insurance card, issued to 15 year olds.

Colonel Poo, Wednesday, 29 January 2020 15:19 (three weeks ago) link

real england indeed

the main character Cooly and his fart attack (bizarro gazzara), Wednesday, 29 January 2020 15:20 (three weeks ago) link

This gallery of Worcester nightlife through the years is just right for this thread - https://www.worcesternews.co.uk/galleries/worcester_nightclubs/#gallery49

I would never get carded when I was 16/17 and I looked younger if anything, no way that would happen now

mfktz (Camaraderie at Arms Length), Wednesday, 29 January 2020 15:21 (three weeks ago) link

As an ignorant foreigner those pics are exactly what I imagined upon first encountering this thread's premise. That and fan-made YouTube videos designed to accompany The Lark Ascending as played by Nigel Kennedy.

pomenitul, Wednesday, 29 January 2020 15:24 (three weeks ago) link

xp I had a phase at 16 where I kept getting ID'd after having no trouble at 15. then we switched pubs and problem went away

Colonel Poo, Wednesday, 29 January 2020 15:28 (three weeks ago) link

i hope somebody finds that cunt, evicts them, then sets them on fucking fire

GK Chessington's World of Adventure (Noodle Vague), Sunday, 2 February 2020 14:28 (three weeks ago) link

'the the Queens English' suggests there is more than one true Queen. Treason!

kinder, Sunday, 2 February 2020 20:08 (three weeks ago) link

maybe prince Andrew is avoiding federal prosecutors in New York because he isn't fluent in Queens English?

calzino, Sunday, 2 February 2020 20:53 (three weeks ago) link

lol

(includes digression on farting) (Tom D.), Sunday, 2 February 2020 20:54 (three weeks ago) link

You're not welcome here if you don't sound like Joey Ramone.

(includes digression on farting) (Tom D.), Sunday, 2 February 2020 20:56 (three weeks ago) link

"what was normality"

lefal junglist platton (wtev), Sunday, 2 February 2020 21:30 (three weeks ago) link

that bit before the Romans came over for an extended stag do

lefal junglist platton (wtev), Sunday, 2 February 2020 21:31 (three weeks ago) link

the real england is in new zealand

doo rag, Sunday, 2 February 2020 21:31 (three weeks ago) link

> that bit before the Romans came over

the queen = boudica, obv.

koogs, Sunday, 2 February 2020 21:46 (three weeks ago) link

Thread taking a darker turn

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/feb/04/wales-market-trader-from-taiwan-told-to-leave-stall-over-coronavirus-fears

“I think they assume I have gone to China but I didn’t go, and they still didn’t believe me. I don’t know if they believe me now.”

it's after the end of the world (Matt #2), Tuesday, 4 February 2020 12:33 (three weeks ago) link

Real Wales tho so we’re good.

toilet-cleaning brain surgeon (pomenitul), Tuesday, 4 February 2020 12:37 (three weeks ago) link

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EP7BRo9XkAEVVbw?format=jpg&name=4096x4096
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EP7BP7QXUAA-fr6?format=jpg&name=4096x4096
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EP7BQuEXsAADUro?format=jpg&name=4096x4096

local time travel shop that only sells toilet+kitchen roll with a window display featuring knitted poppies, dead man's collection of royal fine china cups, scrabble letters, mickey mouse! When the blokes mum used to own the shop it was an often very poorly stocked non-dispensing chemist that hadn't changed since the 50's - it's effectively just a monument to her.

calzino, Tuesday, 4 February 2020 16:36 (three weeks ago) link

needs more golliwogs

GK Chessington's World of Adventure (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 4 February 2020 16:38 (three weeks ago) link

Really relieved that Blitz is kitchen roll, because you’d probably rub your arsehole redder than Cromblyn judging purely by the packaging.

hyds (gyac), Tuesday, 4 February 2020 16:40 (three weeks ago) link

the bog roll is called Area Bombing iirc

GK Chessington's World of Adventure (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 4 February 2020 16:42 (three weeks ago) link

He couldn't get away with golliwogs in Thornhill Lees, his shop would get burnt to the ground! But that would probably be a talking point with him.

calzino, Tuesday, 4 February 2020 16:47 (three weeks ago) link

(Gallagher) arrived at Highbury Corner magistrates court in London accompanied by his uncle, Liam Howlett of the Prodigy..

lol wtf!

calzino, Friday, 7 February 2020 13:19 (two weeks ago) link

"tesco affray" is a good phrase

(howlett is married to a different appleton sister)

mark s, Friday, 7 February 2020 13:20 (two weeks ago) link

Liam's boy looks like... Damon Albarn!

Le Bateau Ivre, Friday, 7 February 2020 13:23 (two weeks ago) link

omg he does

kinder, Friday, 7 February 2020 18:14 (two weeks ago) link

jfc will you listen to this pair of wallies

BA 777 Touch & Go from todays #StormCiara show. 👏 pic.twitter.com/sn3MOJ1BuG

— BIG JET TV (@BigJetTVLIVE) February 9, 2020

it's after the end of the world (Matt #2), Sunday, 9 February 2020 19:05 (two weeks ago) link

can i get Big Jet TV on Freeview?

Todd Phillips, party auteur (Noodle Vague), Sunday, 9 February 2020 19:51 (two weeks ago) link

no

lefal junglist platton (wtev), Sunday, 9 February 2020 21:42 (two weeks ago) link

Seen this on FB and couldn’t share it so had to screen shot it and post it here!!! 😂😂😂 pic.twitter.com/4ZYfbyXupW

— J A D E ♡ (@JadeStamate) February 11, 2020

Being cheap is expensive (snoball), Wednesday, 12 February 2020 21:27 (one week ago) link

(not only a comment on the current weather, but also a future summary of this coming year of Brexit)

Being cheap is expensive (snoball), Wednesday, 12 February 2020 21:28 (one week ago) link

Walking on an incline through saturated impossibly slippery mud is something I've almost mastered, but I took a bad fall a couple of weeks back. My Real England moment today was walking past two very dodgy looking lads, one of them with an air rifle with with a telescopic sight on it and he says to me as I'm nervously looking at his gun: "you want to watch that path it is very slippy mate" ..

calzino, Wednesday, 12 February 2020 21:37 (one week ago) link

Thoughtful young chap.

High profile Tom D (Tom D.), Wednesday, 12 February 2020 21:42 (one week ago) link

“do you have the New York Times?”

“ah no. we just have English papers here, Sir.”

“and the Irish Independent.”

“ah yes. only UK papers.”

not enough ellipses in the world to convey my reaction to that

Li'l Brexit (Tracer Hand), Saturday, 15 February 2020 07:26 (one week ago) link

Eric Bristow MBE Graffiti #Sheffield 2020 https://t.co/NXsZIjHzb8 pic.twitter.com/lIUtgBdcvr

— BLTP (@Gargarin) February 18, 2020

calzino, Tuesday, 18 February 2020 18:53 (one week ago) link

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eYyxdmHogLU

Hmmmmm (jamiesummerz), Thursday, 20 February 2020 17:26 (five days ago) link

Tune

babby bitter (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 20 February 2020 17:52 (five days ago) link

What you see is what you get here. Nothing fake. Great to see a man proud of his town and where he comes from. Vote Nandy,

ogmor, Thursday, 20 February 2020 22:16 (five days ago) link

Lyrics written by John Dawson, Mike Baker, Matt Wilson, Dave Hardy, Bernie Belsham, Jamie Terrell, Simon Juniper.

Load up your rubber wallets (Tom D.), Thursday, 20 February 2020 22:20 (five days ago) link

Romford gone to the dogs.

calzino, Thursday, 20 February 2020 22:32 (five days ago) link

"River Rom" eh? (googles)... "Romford is first recorded in 1177 as Romfort, which is formed from Old English 'rūm' and 'ford' and means "the wide or spacious ford".[12] The naming of the River Rom is a local 'back-formation' from the name of the town; and the river is elsewhere known as the Beam."

Paperbag raita (ledge), Friday, 21 February 2020 10:12 (four days ago) link

My stepmother is from Romford/Upminster, however despite this I still quite like the song.

Wuhan!! Got You All in Check (Camaraderie at Arms Length), Friday, 21 February 2020 10:37 (four days ago) link

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/feb/20/speedo-mick-charity-walker-nears-end-uk-trek-just-trunks

because he is raising money for charity would it be churlish of me to think this lad is an attention-hungry tit?

babby bitter (Noodle Vague), Friday, 21 February 2020 18:02 (four days ago) link

EXCL - Tommy Robinson has joined Toby Young's Free Speech Union, and his membership will not be revokedhttps://t.co/Yk4ZLhxLfk

— Scram News (@ScramNews) February 25, 2020

Generous Grant for Stepladder Creamery (bizarro gazzara), Tuesday, 25 February 2020 16:30 (one hour ago) link

Free speech is Real America iirc.

romanesque architect (pomenitul), Tuesday, 25 February 2020 16:31 (one hour ago) link

does this mean Toby Young has or hasn't been offered another quango? I can't tell these days.

calzino, Tuesday, 25 February 2020 16:38 (one hour ago) link

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/feb/20/speedo-mick-charity-walker-nears-end-uk-trek-just-trunks

because he is raising money for charity would it be churlish of me to think this lad is an attention-hungry tit?

― babby bitter (Noodle Vague), Friday, 21 February 2020 18:02 (four days ago) bookmarkflaglink

The cynic in me thinks the majority of people raising money for charity are attention-hungry but this fella takes the cake yes

or something, Tuesday, 25 February 2020 17:04 (one hour ago) link

he seems fucking horrible, but I'm very Catholic when it comes to irl partial nudity that isn't in a swimming pool context and perhaps I'm being unfair!

calzino, Tuesday, 25 February 2020 17:11 (one hour ago) link


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