Do you find yourself paranoid if you have an opposite view to the war?

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I was angry and talking blatantly about the war with Dustin at a local supermarket. We were making black jokes about Bin Laden and Cellphones but essentially had a good argument about the war.

However, Dustin said "You better watch it, in these times you never know who is listening and watching".

Do you feel paranoid about disagreeing with the media/telethons/war/George Bush/Democracy?

Jay Simon, Monday, 24 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-one years ago) link

Can we get a clarification on what you believe is "opposite view"?

Ally, Monday, 24 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-one years ago) link

Quickly summarized:

I found the events of September 11 very tragic and horrific. However, on a scale, war is more tragic and horrific. The sheer amount of people that will die and it that revolution will not be televised...isnt that more terrible? That innocence Afghanstans will be killed in America's war against terrorism, from a man, George Bush who essential stole the election? That same man talking about democracy, when he *stole* the election. That the speech that he made, essential sets America up as a policing force for other nations (if you are not with us, you are for the terrorists). Is that not horrifying? 6,000 lives versus Millions in the Middle East.

And what about the military? My best friend, Mark, is a Captain in the military, a great guy, what if he dies defending Bush's statement?

I find the whole thing is being whitewashed by the media at the moment. The consequences are not being fully explored, just the proghandi.

Jay Simon, Monday, 24 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-one years ago) link

i was actually mulling this the other day. but mostly: "how long until it's safe for the media...of any stripe, left or right...to begin to criticize the government again?" i didn't come up with an answer, nor do i expect to today.

jess, Monday, 24 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-one years ago) link

First, kill your cutesy spelling of propaganda because it makes you seem like a dork.

Second, to bring up something I already did on another thread -- unquestionably there are tons of horrible implications that can be drawn out of potential American reactions and overreactions. But here's the thing -- if you're not in favor of a military response, then what is your proposed solution towards how to track down the guy currently assumed to be behind this, dear Mr. bin Laden, who is not going to give himself up voluntarily, who is not affected by economic sanctions or diplomatic pressure, and who in general doesn't give a flying toss? Or are you just saying he should continue to just sit there doing whatever?

Until you and those like you can articulate a response which allows for all that, your position falls apart. And don't even try to claim I'm some sort of right-wing jingoistic brainwashed nutball, because you are *so* barking up the wrong tree with that one.

Ned Raggett, Monday, 24 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-one years ago) link

While I'm not a supporter of Bush, I feel burdened to point out that if Al Gore hadn't run from Clinton's support like a diseased leper AND if he'd spent more time campaigning in both Tennessee and Arkansas, the Florida fiasco wouldn't have mattered. Also, because of that fiasco, whoever was declared the winner was going to be seen as having stolen the election by half of the country.

But to answer your question: yes, I feel paranoid, but no more paranoid than I feel when dealing with people on a day to day basis. (God, that makes me sound loony. What I mean is that I rarely expect people to agree with my views unless they happen to be named Ned Raggett, and even that's not 100%. It's all a matter of how you broach the subject and how you handle antagonistic discussion.)

Dan Perry, Monday, 24 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-one years ago) link

Come now, Dan, if you could just admit you *are* me, all would be well. Oh, brush your teeth more often, I can't always monitor the broadcast from your molars when there's plaque.

Ned Raggett, Monday, 24 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-one years ago) link

And what about the military? My best friend, Mark, is a Captain in the military, a great guy, what if he dies defending Bush's statement?

This is one of the only problems I have with your post. Great guy or not, HE SIGNED UP FOR THE JOB. What if he dies? Well, sad for you and his friends and family but he did AGREE TO DO IT. It's not like it's a big surprise if you sign up for the military and then get sent to duty, I mean that is what they are there for.

Trying to reply to just your current points and NOT your other posts on this board, which quite frankly have disgusted me, as Ned asked: what do you suggest is done instead? Bush is a wankface idiot, yes. Bombing Afghanistan is mainly pointless, the people have nothing anyhow so it's not like it's worth anything to them. But how exactly does the US respond to this? Sitting on its collective ass, going, "Good show, terrorists, way to get us!" I don't see how you'd propose to fix the issue at hand, particularly if the Taliban doesn't want to give up those responsible.

Ally, Monday, 24 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-one years ago) link

Intelligence Report # 2359887 Subjects: Jay and Dustin Location: Local Supermarket Subjects appeared to be engaged in black-joke type humour re: BIN LADEN, WAR, NORM CHOMSKY & CELL PHONES. Recomendation: Liquidate both subjects, they know too much already. Use caution, Dustin may be onto us.

Mr. Jones, Monday, 24 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-one years ago) link

See disclaimer at the Chomsky thread.

Jay Simon, Monday, 24 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-one years ago) link

Noam.

Norm is on CHEERS.

Sarah, Monday, 24 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-one years ago) link

I don't feel paranoid about disagreeing wiht the popular view at the momnent, I don't believe anyone's watching me to be honest.

DG, Monday, 24 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-one years ago) link

one of my flatmates believes our phone may be bugged. i do not share this view.

gareth, Tuesday, 25 September 2001 00:00 (twenty-one years ago) link


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