Starbucks: The Empire Strikes Back

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How do you feel about Starbucks? NOt the coffee, the corporation. Allot of people seem sort of indifferent while many wan t to fire bomb them. How do YOU feel ? I workd there for a year and caused much trouble, as I didn't agree with most of their policies!

Pennysong Hanle y, Saturday, 8 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

I feel crazy.Saturday night. I am invited to a party but I decide to stay home. Freak is me. *bux est rad. Why? You know you'll get crap. Whereas if you go in other (non chain) coffeeshops, you don't know if you'll be ripped off errr not.

nathalie, Saturday, 8 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Ignore last remark. I am kuriously oranj tooday.

nathalie, Saturday, 8 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

My god I'd so go to a Starbucks that had Hanle y behind the counter causing trouble.

Nick, Saturday, 8 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

It's funny, because Starbucks hatred is purely a city thing -- you know, one on every corner, Borg-like, when there are perfectly wonderful independent cafes all over the place that should, theoretically, be hugely preferable. It's a bit harder to hate them, though, when you're in a small town where otherwise there wouldn't be any "gourmet" coffee. Same goes for Barnes and Nobles, most emphatically.

Their unfortunate secret seems to be that they've removed the "sitting around reading" or "sitting around talking to people" aspect of coffee consumption -- they're so completely grab-and-go. So I suppose I understand why people go there (the sorts of people who grab $10 coffee drinks on the way to work, anyway). But personally, even if I were just grabbing and going, I'd rather do it from a little place where I might actually feel some personal connection with the business. You know, someplace where you could drop in every morning and they'd start saying hello after a while.

Nitsuh, Saturday, 8 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

"Call the zoo! The Hanle y is loose!" [Hanle y then proceeds to piss on the face of the manager]

DG, Saturday, 8 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Thats a toughie becasue personally I often feel sad when I strangers start talking to me. And indie cafes often have ass coffee. But I can't realy condone Starbucks methods.

Pennysong Hanle y, Saturday, 8 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Ass coffee: sounds like what happened to me this morning (eeeeew).

suzy, Saturday, 8 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

No need to go further, Suzy. ;-) I am not a coffee drinker in the 'cannot function without it' sense, but I sympathize with Nitsuh's 'you gotta have *something*' argument, and unlike Barnes and Noble, say, you can't really search for other coffee options on-line if you're in a remote locale unless you want to order the beans directly.

Ned Raggett, Saturday, 8 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

think its better to buy Starbucks beans in the store than Folgers or Maxwell house which are much eviler.

Pennysong Hanle y, Saturday, 8 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

We've tried Starbucks at the office, and it didn't go over well. If it's gonna be canned, it's gotta be Stewart's (the plaid can) for me. Although someone brought in a can of "slow roasted" something, and we all decided it was pretty good. All ground coffee tastes like shit if it's not refrigerated, but Stewart's seems to taste good a little longer than the others.

No one will drink "fancy" coffee at the office except me and my (gay) boss. It's like some stupid masculinity thing: it's gotta be from the can.

Kerry, Saturday, 8 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

I couldn't care less about Starbucks; I will make my own tea, thank you. I like Barnes & Noble better than the library, though, because there are nice chairs to sit in and food to eat so I can sit and read all day.

maria, Sunday, 9 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

My Starbucks complaints are the usual: The requisite first sign that a neighborhood w/ mom and pop stores is loosing its sense of community. (One in which talking to "strangers" ceases to be possible after a couple of visits, as you have the opportunity to form some sort of relationship; I still have an opportunity to know many of the local shopowners/vendors in my 'hood and, frankly, cherish that) You all know the rest, next comes Kinko's, SpinCyclee, Cocunut's, and so forth. Also, I still sort of cringe becuase ubiquity/familiarity = quality to so many people. They won't support a member of their community's business because of comfort w/the Big Corportation. But that's branding, I guess.

I'd be curious to see if any European posters have contempt for this American cultural imperialism, considering the import of café life in Vienna, Paris, Italy, Turkey and loads of other places. Does anyone care or was that sort of café a thing of the past anyway?

And how long until Starbucks starts selling bubble tea?

scott p., Sunday, 9 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

The law firm where I used to work drafted and negotiated the commercial leases for Starbucks. So they (me by extension? but I don't do real estate) are at least partially responsible for the explosion of Starbucks in the NYC metropolitan area. At least we used to have Starbucks coffee every day, which was immeasurably better than the sludge that passes for regular coffee.

Tadeusz Suchodolski, Sunday, 9 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

they sell tea - what kind of coffee empire does that? amateurs!

Geoff, Sunday, 9 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Sometimes I feel somewhat Darwin-like about it. Like, if people WANT Mom and Pops place they will GO there. But people don't, they go to Starbucks. WHat can be done? The masses speak. I feel the same way about liking local artists and musicians over international ones. I could care less that a band is from my town.

Pennysong Hanle y, Sunday, 9 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Normally I'm quite anti-capitalist and indie, but I did feel strangely delighted when I was them open in the towns round here. It's like being acknowledged by the rest of the world. I've never been in one, but I now feel I can join the bitching what people in the big smoke do.

It brought a tear to my eye the day Gateway in Bexhill turned into a Somerfield (Three months ago. Beat that for backwardness).

Graham, Sunday, 9 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

We have one in our town. They have comfortable seats. I'm not into such places, so I've only been in it once. I hear they are not a nice organistion, so I probably won't go in there again.

Coffee Republic got its windows blown out in the recent bombing, and I don't think it's reopened yet.

jel, Sunday, 9 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

I'd rather buy coffee there than a) McDonalds b) anywhere where the standards of cleanliness/actual coffee beans are shite. And they do nice sandwhiches. So yeah, I think they're alright. Although I can do without all the other copy-cat coffee shops popping up everywhere.

Bill, Sunday, 9 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

I live in a ruralsuburban place where there was NEVER a mom n pop coffee place in my living memory. The big corporations started moving in a few years ago, and they weren't pushing anyone out. No, they were filling a vacuum, you know, the kind that has trees and animals and no huge drainage/flood problems due to parking lots.

maria, Sunday, 9 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Putting in my thirteen cents here...

Echoing what others have said, there are way too many Starbucks in NYC, but there are also too few of the in Long Island.

On Long Island, there weren't really any mom & pop stores for Starbucks to displace. Back when I was a kid, the few non-chain LI coffee shops weren't even coffee shops per se, more like "luncheonettes" or "c orner stationeries," and they basically disappeared at least a decade before Starbucks arrived on the East Coast. You can be pretty sure they had lousy cofee and pretty damned sure that none of these places had comfy seating.

Few of the Starbucks I go to are grab'n'go places, and if I want a Raspberry Mocha Chip Frappucino, and the nearest Starbucks doesn't have decent seating, I go to one that does. The opportunity for conviviality and relaxation is more important to me than the coffee, I suspect that I'm hardly alone. The urban vilification of the homeless have pretty much insured that there are never enough public places to SIT DOWN.

Michael Daddino, Sunday, 9 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

or pee

Pennysong Hanle y, Monday, 10 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Princeton and New Brunswick, both being college towns, had a pretty good pre-Starbucks coffee-shop scene. Needless to say, both have Starbuck's now. As does my current town of Hoboken, though I still frequent a small coffee-shop just a block from one of the Starbuck's there (I like the owner and I get free coffee on occasion).

My hometown, though, had just Dunkin Donuts before it got its strip- mall Starbucks. Dunkin Donuts were practically an institution in New Jersey towns, one I'd be upset to see disappear (though Dunkins is just a chain itself, naturally).

Tadeusz Suchodolski, Monday, 10 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Christ, Graham, are you *that* pathetically insecure?

Assuming you're in Hastings and Rye, you got a Labour MP four years before I did, and even now I can barely remember how it felt to have a Tory MP. That's the only thing *I* care about.

Robin Carmody, Monday, 10 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

I wish there were a dunkin' donuts on every corner in NYC, though that would bring in people from Boston which would not be so good. I never went to Starbucks til it opened up the street from me. Now I can't pass it after work without spending $2.06

Hans Greer, Monday, 10 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

I find my joy where I can, yes Robin.

Graham, Monday, 10 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Isn't Starbucks linked to Phillip Morris aka Marlboro? I read or heard it somewhere, but when I mentioned it in the presence of a guy who used to work at Starbucks,he went crazy. Thinking I must be mistaken, I asked, "Oh, you were in marketing or something?" Clearly I had offended him and I meant to say, "Hey, you know more than me." I was surprised to find out he was just a guy who served coffee at a local Starbucks. ?!

Nude Spock, Monday, 10 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

I guess you all saw this< /a> Onion skit on Starbucks paranoia.

Nick, Tuesday, 11 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Well link still works, despite cackhandery.

Nick, Tuesday, 11 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

I don't have a problem with Starbucks the institution; in fact they are the reason I have an apartment today thanks to their imperialistic lease disallowing any construction to go on around their premises (no construction = no work done to my building = unsellable = tenants can stay = long story). However, their coffee is ass. I wish it tasted better, because then I'd support them financially and not just in spirit.

Ally, Tuesday, 11 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

agree with what michael said about their being a semi-boon to long island's 'coffee culture' (ah ha ha ha). also, michael, when you worked there, did they give you health insurance? obviously that isn't a justification for treating employees like crap in other arenas -- if it was, i might, just might, hate my job a bit less -- but it is i think kinda nice.

maura, Tuesday, 11 September 2001 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

two years pass...
i don't go to starbucks (i don't drink coffee for one). i don't like massive corporate chains of anything regardless of their politics.

however, occasionally I have to entertain business partners in town and they always want to go to the starbucks which is convenient because it's so close. so i usually order a grande chai soy latte to be accomodating.

so today i am meeting with someone this morning and around 10am they say "let's go grab coffee" and we go down to starbucks. the cashier asks "what can i get you, guy?" so i order. "that'll be 2.35, guy." i drop the change in the tip jar. "thanks a lot, guy". i look him in the eyes and say very flatly "you are welcome.... guy".

i mean "guy"? what happened to corporate customer service? it was pretty weird. i expected the normal faceless "how may i help you"s but not this "guy", thing. what's next? hey bro, hey man, hey dude?

gygax! (gygax!), Friday, 31 October 2003 21:10 (sixteen years ago) link

hey fuckface?

gygax! (gygax!), Friday, 31 October 2003 21:10 (sixteen years ago) link

(great idea for a thread)

donut bitch (donut), Friday, 31 October 2003 21:15 (sixteen years ago) link

Please explain what it is that is evil about Starbucks. I'm willing to believe it, but I don't know what it is. And please distinguish between Starbucks evil and Folgers, Maxwell House, etc.

several posters above obv. otm re: if you don't support independents, you can't complain when they fold.

McDonald's coffee used to be really good. Not anymore?

Skottie, Saturday, 1 November 2003 00:25 (sixteen years ago) link

To be fair, gygax!, i think that's more of an issue with the "dude", possibly the manager of that particular location and his customer "training/repertroire" program *cough*, but not the company.

Well, I've never been called "guy" at a Starbuck's yet here in Starbucks city.

donut bitch (donut), Saturday, 1 November 2003 00:30 (sixteen years ago) link

seven months pass...
three years ago, I was in Newport nursing my mum who had a big op, my saving grace was Starbucks centre town, where I went every day on my way to the hospital. It was managed by a lady who ran it incredibly, and had mostly women. yesterday I organised to meet my family there who are over from South Africa, and I am newly back in England after being used to going to Starbucks in America. I have NEVER seen such filth. the floor was full of paper and things the tables dirty, which I might say EVERY time I have gone there it is dirty and have had to asked that they clean the table I am on. It is run by young guys and it is disgusting. After telling my kids how good it is there, they said they will NEVER go back, it is awful. The coffee also is cold. You charge the price for good coffee, but dont keep the standard. In fact every one I have been in in England is not of a high standard. If you are not careful you will loose as when in there yesterday, one other person was in, and when I was here three years ago, it was always packed.

lesley yvonne everson, Wednesday, 9 June 2004 05:04 (sixteen years ago) link

Starbucks Googlers aren't as funny as Rocafella Googlers.

Starbucks Customer Service (miloauckerman), Wednesday, 9 June 2004 05:10 (sixteen years ago) link

six months pass...
I like how Starbucks workers posed for Playboy. Female liberation at its best!

Ceezah, Tuesday, 4 January 2005 10:06 (fifteen years ago) link

one year passes...
In the future, they'll have to build Starbucks inside other Starbucks.

Dr. Alicia D. Titsovich (sexyDancer), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 18:09 (thirteen years ago) link

The problem with their rapid expansion in cities now is that they all seem incredibly blank and temporary and uninviting, like government offices or hospital cafes or weird college-student refugee centers; they're barely even suitable for emergency bathroom use. Empty tiled room with crappy lights and those chintzy compound-plastic tables littered everywhere: they all the charm of an AA meeting.

nabisco (nabisco), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 18:42 (thirteen years ago) link

you can pick up more chicks at an aa meeting than in a starbucks bathroom, nabisco.

hstencil (hstencil), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 18:44 (thirteen years ago) link

Better coffee, too.


nabisco (nabisco), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 18:50 (thirteen years ago) link

dude what is with you today

Allyzay Eisenschefter (allyzay), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 18:50 (thirteen years ago) link

It's been said before, I'm sure, but the coffee is so awful and it's really not hard to make good coffee, that I can't go. I can see if they had AMAZING coffee but their coffee is butt.

Mr. Que (Mr.Que), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 18:51 (thirteen years ago) link

who are you asking that, allyzay?

hstencil (hstencil), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 18:53 (thirteen years ago) link

I think the thing is that nobody gets coffee. Or at least their ubiquity is based more on people drinking sweety 5%-espresso drinks. It's more or less a hot-milk industry.

nabisco (nabisco), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 18:53 (thirteen years ago) link

not you, hstencil, to fozzy bear up there.

Allyzay Eisenschefter (allyzay), Wednesday, 25 October 2006 18:54 (thirteen years ago) link

i know it's ILE, but i am consistently amused by the music channel of starbucks. i've been treated to some of the best of dub-reggae for the past hour or so. a little disconcerting, but also awesome.

and just fyi, i'm waiting on someone for lunch and needed to use the internet-- haven't been in one of these since may. i don't even know where they exist in SF? tourist places, probs.

is their internet free now?

the kid is crying because did sharks died? (Hurting 2), Saturday, 29 August 2009 03:19 (ten years ago) link

they are on every single corner of every block of the financial district in SF

I'm pretty sure I saw one starbucks that claimed to have free wifi. before it was only for t-mobile customers. I don't know a single person who has t-mobile.

akm, Saturday, 29 August 2009 14:49 (ten years ago) link

You know me! I have T-Mobile!

Alex in SF, Saturday, 29 August 2009 14:51 (ten years ago) link

ritual roasters on valencia has free wifi and hipsters

all yoga attacks are fire based (rogermexico.), Saturday, 29 August 2009 14:54 (ten years ago) link

Seems to be coming to Belgium. Urgh

Nathalie (stevienixed), Saturday, 29 August 2009 21:05 (ten years ago) link

i don't even know where they exist in SF?

???? crazy talk

iatee, Saturday, 29 August 2009 23:03 (ten years ago) link

they are on every single corner of every block of the financial district in SF

not an exaggeration

iatee, Saturday, 29 August 2009 23:05 (ten years ago) link

does anyone remember the stealth Starbucks at 18th? and Bryant ... it was called something like "circadia" and then it showed its true identity?

what happened? i am confused. (sarahel), Saturday, 29 August 2009 23:06 (ten years ago) link

four years pass...

So is this a real business?
Yes it is. Although we are a fully functioning coffee shop, for legal reasons Dumb Starbucks needs to be categorized as a work of parody art. So, in the eyes of the law, our "coffee shop" is actually an "art gallery" and the "coffee" you're buying is considered the art. But that's for our lawyers to worry about. All you need to do is enjoy our delicious coffee!

Are you saying Starbucks is dumb?
Not at all. In fact, we love Starbucks and look up to them as role models. Unfortunately, the only way to use their intellectual property under fair use is if we are making fun of them. So the word "dumb" comes out of necessity, not enmity.

Wow, this person is monumentally stupid.

Burt Stuntin (Hurting 2), Monday, 10 February 2014 21:40 (six years ago) link

Oh, I guess it was just some barista. Still, don't tell your baristas to say shit like that! "We're using fair use as an excuse" is not a very good way to set up your fair use defense.

Burt Stuntin (Hurting 2), Monday, 10 February 2014 22:06 (six years ago) link

I walked by this yesterday. Kinda funny, but only a little bit. Predictably the line was down the block, about a hundred people.

christmas candy bar (al leong), Monday, 10 February 2014 22:27 (six years ago) link

Yeah, can't say I think it's that funny. It's gonna get so shut down, and the people who did it are going to be out a lot of money.

Burt Stuntin (Hurting 2), Monday, 10 February 2014 22:28 (six years ago) link

The FAQ is hilarious, has to be a "Nathan For You" bit, as some have suspected.

Nerdstrom Poindexter, Monday, 10 February 2014 22:33 (six years ago) link

aaaand confirmed as such.

Simon H., Tuesday, 11 February 2014 00:53 (six years ago) link

In three days a Twitter feed for Dumb Starbucks has amassed over 8K followers. Even Universal got in on the mania on their Dumb & Dumber To Facebook page.


polyphonic, Tuesday, 11 February 2014 01:09 (six years ago) link

oh, turns out this is something a friend of mine did -- haha

sarahell, Tuesday, 11 February 2014 01:14 (six years ago) link

you're friends with nathan fielder?

|$̲̅(̲̅ιοο̲̅)̲̅$̲̅| (gr8080), Tuesday, 11 February 2014 03:33 (six years ago) link

no, but a friend of mine is apparently claiming credit?

sarahell, Tuesday, 11 February 2014 03:34 (six years ago) link

makes sense.

|$̲̅(̲̅ιοο̲̅)̲̅$̲̅| (gr8080), Tuesday, 11 February 2014 03:51 (six years ago) link

I just threw away in honor of this mishap

Brian Eno's Mother (Latham Green), Tuesday, 11 February 2014 15:54 (six years ago) link

Some great viral marketing from not-so-dumb Starbucks imo

Emperor Cos Dashit (Adam Bruneau), Tuesday, 11 February 2014 16:01 (six years ago) link

Nah, I doubt this means much to Starbucks

Burt Stuntin (Hurting 2), Tuesday, 11 February 2014 16:04 (six years ago) link

I can't watch Nathan for You bc it makes me too uncomfortable but this is hilarious.

the Norwegians are leaving! (Sufjan Grafton), Tuesday, 11 February 2014 16:10 (six years ago) link

you're friends with nathan fielder?

hes a huge asshole fwiw

Lamp, Tuesday, 11 February 2014 16:20 (six years ago) link

There seems something endemic to LA that things like this instantly attract huge lines. I can't imagine that kind of reaction in NYC for instance.

o. nate, Tuesday, 11 February 2014 17:07 (six years ago) link

Thankfully, in the press conference Fielder said he plans to open a Dumb Starbucks in Brooklyn in the coming weeks, so east coast lovers of parody coffee shops will get their chance to wait in line for four hours for a free cup of dumb coffee too.

waterbabies (waterface), Tuesday, 11 February 2014 17:12 (six years ago) link

^but that'll provoke a different reaction, now that everyone knows what's going on.

will still be interesting to see what type of reaction he gets.

, Tuesday, 11 February 2014 18:23 (six years ago) link

No it won't.

Emperor Cos Dashit (Adam Bruneau), Tuesday, 11 February 2014 19:15 (six years ago) link

dumb cronuts

|$̲̅(̲̅ιοο̲̅)̲̅$̲̅| (gr8080), Tuesday, 11 February 2014 19:22 (six years ago) link

Cronuts craze was different though since the payoff to waiting in the cronut line was a cronut whereas the payoff to waiting in the Dumb Starbucks line is, what exactly? Something much more conceptual.

o. nate, Tuesday, 11 February 2014 19:32 (six years ago) link

i thought you got a cronut once you got to the front of the cronut line

|$̲̅(̲̅ιοο̲̅)̲̅$̲̅| (gr8080), Tuesday, 11 February 2014 20:00 (six years ago) link

oh wait nm i misread yr post

|$̲̅(̲̅ιοο̲̅)̲̅$̲̅| (gr8080), Tuesday, 11 February 2014 20:01 (six years ago) link

marc horowitz is a genius. the next shia labeouf.

james franco, Sunday, 16 February 2014 23:55 (six years ago) link

you're friends with nathan fielder?

hes a huge asshole fwiw

― Lamp, Tuesday, February 11, 2014 4:20 PM (6 days ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Care to expand on this?

Walter Galt, Monday, 17 February 2014 14:45 (six years ago) link

sorry; expound

Walter Galt, Monday, 17 February 2014 14:46 (six years ago) link

From britisher perspective shit coffee in greasy spoons = cheaper than shit coffee in starbucks

cardamon, Monday, 17 February 2014 21:04 (six years ago) link

missed this

|$̲̅(̲̅ιοο̲̅)̲̅$̲̅| (gr8080), Thursday, 20 February 2014 22:59 (six years ago) link

sarahel is Marc Horowitz your friend

|$̲̅(̲̅ιοο̲̅)̲̅$̲̅| (gr8080), Thursday, 20 February 2014 23:00 (six years ago) link

the heart of the joke seems to be a very deadpan take on what a "parody" is

Burt Stuntin (Hurting 2), Thursday, 20 February 2014 23:20 (six years ago) link

nathan knows it's not legal and will be shut down. in the show, he gives business owners terrible business ideas. the joke is that this is another terrible business idea.

4. Nels Cline and My Uncle Eat Soup at Panera Bread (3:37) (Sufjan Grafton), Thursday, 20 February 2014 23:25 (six years ago) link

four years pass...

Schultz has a shop in Rome now, which is the biggest asshole thing there ever was, if you think about it.

— Richard M. Nixon (@dick_nixon) January 28, 2019

a Mets fan who gave up on everything in the mid '80s (Dr Morbius), Monday, 28 January 2019 22:08 (one year ago) link

Coffee's better is Seattle, harsh truth

brimstead, Monday, 28 January 2019 22:25 (one year ago) link

Possibly, but it's nice to be able to get an espresso for 1 euro on just about any street corner.

o. nate, Tuesday, 29 January 2019 01:27 (one year ago) link

i like the mermaid logo

Trϵϵship, Tuesday, 29 January 2019 01:39 (one year ago) link

nine months pass...

F Starbucks with this faux environmentally sensitive bullshit ad campaign where you get a cheap free re usable plastic cup. First of all they’ve already produced these cups. So hey brain dead latte consumer: you’re not helping the environment. You’re just mitigating the damage that’s already done. Assuming you use the cup for the rest of your life. In 99% of cases though people will stop using them within a year and will store it next to the other reusable cups in their cabinet or will toss it out. F Starbucks.

June Pointer’s Valentine’s Day Secret Admirer Note Author (calstars), Thursday, 7 November 2019 22:45 (eight months ago) link

I finally took the plunge this year and started bring a metal thermos to work every day to pick up my morning coffee (not Starbucks btw). Partly out of concern for the environment and partly out of thinking about hot coffee sitting in that plastic lining. Also it stays hotter so I can drink it slower if I want to. I still pour it into a ceramic mug once I get to the office though, since I don't like drinking directly out of a thermos.

o. nate, Friday, 8 November 2019 01:42 (eight months ago) link

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