Jean-Luc Godard: S and D

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Have at it!

Justyn Dillingham (Justyn Dillingham), Tuesday, 4 March 2003 12:33 (twenty-one years ago) link

(Is 'Elogie d'amour' worth watching? I have no clue about late (or even post-60s) Godard, but my local video shop has two copies of this - which I can't believe anyone has ever take out - and they sing their ph34rful siren song to me whenever I go in.)

Jerry the Nipper (Jerrynipper), Tuesday, 4 March 2003 12:42 (twenty-one years ago) link

i had this long talk about intermible movies to sit through, and it moved somehow into the maoist rantings of mr goddard. i dont know much about this.

enlighten me.

anthony easton (anthony), Tuesday, 4 March 2003 13:36 (twenty-one years ago) link

Search: My Life to Live (I would say that's his best that I've seen), Contempt, Band of Outsiders, his hilariously pretentious segment in the movie Aria, maybe A Woman is a Woman, maybe Breathless

Destroy: Nouvelle Vague, For Ever Mozart

Joe (Joe), Tuesday, 4 March 2003 13:40 (twenty-one years ago) link

My Life To Live, Alphaville, and Breathless are all amazing.

Weekend was dismal.

I haven't seen anything else by him.

Ryan McKay (Ryan McKay), Tuesday, 4 March 2003 13:48 (twenty-one years ago) link

Week End has many strange, wonderful, and disturbing moments. It's probably best known for the long scene with the traffic jam. So many ideas in this movie. Poor Emily Bronte gets set on fire. Then there's the egg monologue, the pianist, the political essay set to a man eating a sandwich, etc.

Ernest P. (ernestp), Tuesday, 4 March 2003 14:02 (twenty-one years ago) link

anthony:
Re: Mao comments

After Weekend, Godard did a series of films using Mao, Marx, and Engles in various ways. At the time he claimed he was disavowing "bourgeois" cinema, but later said that this period was a result of experimentation and he never even read any Mao (finding it fun to juxtapose Mao and Coca-Cola or something along those lines). Some of these "Maoist films" include Le Gai savoir (1968), British Sounds (1970), Vladimir and Rosa, and Tout va bien (1972), the last film marking the beginning of his gradual return to more commercial cinema. I've heard Le Gai savoir is the best from this period. I have not seen it though.

Ryan McKay (Ryan McKay), Tuesday, 4 March 2003 14:04 (twenty-one years ago) link

Search Breathless, Vivre sa vie, Alphaville, Contempt, and Week-End.

Week-End is hard to watch, but I find it ultimately rewarding. After Breathless it's probably my favorite Godard film. It's one of the most messed up road movies I've ever seen (along with Jarmusch's Dead Man--watch them as a double feature, they work really well together).

die9o (dhadis), Tuesday, 4 March 2003 14:20 (twenty-one years ago) link

Perhaps having judged too harshly, I shall retry Week End this weekend.

Ryan McKay (Ryan McKay), Tuesday, 4 March 2003 14:24 (twenty-one years ago) link

a woman is a woman, yeah.

RJG (RJG), Tuesday, 4 March 2003 15:18 (twenty-one years ago) link

Pierrot le Fou: So wonderful. A Jules Verne fantasyland.

Contempt: Sex, sun, sea and twisted automobiles. We've got Brigitte Bardot, Odysseus, Fritz Lang, Jack Palance, and the Casa Malaparte. Cinematic heroin.

-8-(*_*)-8-, Tuesday, 4 March 2003 15:27 (twenty-one years ago) link

Also search: Two or Three Things I Know About Her. And Masculin Feminin is pretty cute, 60s teenage pop culture at its most endearing.

Fanfan la Tulipe, Tuesday, 4 March 2003 15:53 (twenty-one years ago) link

I went to a screening of Truffaut's Soft Skin last week, and Raoul Coutard (the cinematographer for many of Truffaut and Godard's films) was there. Unfortunately, I was starving, so I didn't hang around for his post-film talk.

hstencil, Tuesday, 4 March 2003 15:55 (twenty-one years ago) link

Might be difficult to track down, but "France/Tour/Detour/Deux/Enfants" is very good. It's a series he did for French TV in the late '70s (I think). A lot of it is interviews with children about philosophical and sociological questions. Imagine "Kids Say the Darnedest Things" hosted by Godard.

"Pierrot Le Fou" is my favorite of the films, though. And "Bande à Part" certainly has its moments.

Nemo (JND), Tuesday, 4 March 2003 15:55 (twenty-one years ago) link

JtN, Eloge is pretty tedious a lot of the way, but there are interesting ideas and some beautiful scenes late on. Worth watching the once, I'd say - I'd say that about anything by Godard, to be honest. I love all of them up to Week-End, and really like that. The early ones with Anna Karina particularly are an irresistible joy.

Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Tuesday, 4 March 2003 19:34 (twenty-one years ago) link

The key film to see re. Godard's "Maoism" (I'm not certain he was ever an orthodox Maoist, even for a fleeting moment, but he certainly flirted with it; see an especially beauitful/bitter passage in Marker's La fond de l'air est rouge for a spectacular riposte) is La Chinose, along with Week End the last "commercial" film he made for a while. It features his then-g.f Anne Wiazemsky who was instrumental in radicalizing J-L. The film is about a cadre of students on summer holiday who form a Maoist cell and plot the assassination of a Soviet attaché. Also: relationship troubles, sex, sloganeering, exhausted advice from skeptical older figures, etc. You can sense Godard's fascination/repulsion w/r/t these young people (all pre-May 68 mind). Of course it also sort of gives the game away: Godard's politics were always an extension of his aesthetics (Godard, having the most overactive aesthetic sense of anyone alive) and here the revolutionaries are young and beautiful and favor primary colors (red esp.). I've always distrusted Godard even as I've admired him. In Eloge d'amour his target is Spielberg who stands in for American cultural imperialism, crassness, etc. It's not just the anti-Americanism that bothers me, it's the reduction of politics to aesthetics (or the conflation). I hope that makes some sense as I have to get back to work, but more later I'm sure.

Amateurist (amateurist), Tuesday, 4 March 2003 19:47 (twenty-one years ago) link

Re. his Dziga Vertov films, I've only seen two. Vent d'Est is very interesting and sometimes beautiful and shocking, albeit even more infuriating than usual for JLG. Letter to Jane is just infuriating, although interesting in the context of his career I suppose. I verges on structuralist experiment and that is how I've seen the other D-V films described. Still dying to see Tout va bien, though, his class-struggle film with Jane Fonda and Yves Montand.

As I've mention on another thread I value some of Godard's later (post-79) work as highly as the '60s films. Esp. Sauve qui peut, Passion, First Name: Carmen, Hail Mary, and Hélas pour moi. A lot of people swear by Histoire(s) du cinéma--I've only seen two episodes of this.

Amateurist (amateurist), Tuesday, 4 March 2003 19:54 (twenty-one years ago) link

Ryan, do yourself a favor and just watch Dead Man twice. Not only will you save yourself the torment of realizing you were right about Weekend all along, but DM has a much better soundtrack

innercitykitty (innercitykitty), Tuesday, 4 March 2003 20:33 (twenty-one years ago) link

I got the chronology a little messed up. Letter to Jane isn't a Groupe Dziga-Vertov film, although it was made by two of that group's participants (Godard and Gorin); it was made after Tout va bien (both '72) and indeed refers to that film. It would take someone more familiar with the films of this period to determine the essential differences (aesthetic and political) b/t the D-Z films of 68-70 and the later films made by some of the same people.

Amateurist (amateurist), Tuesday, 4 March 2003 21:10 (twenty-one years ago) link

(One more aside: interestingly the Japanese seem more fond of Godard's films of this period than anyone else. La Chinoise and Vent d'Est are available on DVD there, but are difficult to see in any format in the West.)

Amateurist (amateurist), Tuesday, 4 March 2003 21:12 (twenty-one years ago) link

The first two parts of Histoire(s) du Cinema are incredibly moving if you're any kind of film fan.

Andrew L (Andrew L), Tuesday, 4 March 2003 21:40 (twenty-one years ago) link

one year passes...
Has anyone read the Colin Macabe book yet?

@d@ml (nordicskilla), Thursday, 18 March 2004 20:39 (twenty years ago) link

Also, what are people's thoughts on Two Or Three Things I Know About Her?


@d@ml (nordicskilla), Thursday, 18 March 2004 20:41 (twenty years ago) link

I think it is about an airport.

RJG (RJG), Thursday, 18 March 2004 20:42 (twenty years ago) link

Are you sure about that?

@d@ml (nordicskilla), Thursday, 18 March 2004 20:47 (twenty years ago) link

I can confirm.

N. (nickdastoor), Thursday, 18 March 2004 20:49 (twenty years ago) link

At the risk of sounding stupid (not that this ever bother me, as you all know), may I ask how?

@d@ml (nordicskilla), Thursday, 18 March 2004 21:09 (twenty years ago) link

Also - is godard "funny"?

@d@ml (nordicskilla), Thursday, 18 March 2004 21:10 (twenty years ago) link

I just had in my head that it was about an airport.

Some bits of 'Une Femme Est Une Femme' are very funny.

N. (nickdastoor), Thursday, 18 March 2004 21:11 (twenty years ago) link

I kind of love 2 or 3 things.

It's not about an airport. It's about a supermarket, a prostitute, a cup of coffee, et al, etc.

N.'s last line is correct aussi.

the bellefox, Thursday, 18 March 2004 21:25 (twenty years ago) link

I agree.

RJG (RJG), Thursday, 18 March 2004 21:27 (twenty years ago) link

Thanks, I was beginning to think that "2 Or 3 Things" was the most oblique film about an airport I had ever seen.

@d@ml (nordicskilla), Thursday, 18 March 2004 21:28 (twenty years ago) link

Bande A Part is very funny indeed as well as being my favourite of his films (and one of my favourite of all time) in spite of not having Belomodo in it (who makes me swoon even more than Mark Ruffalo does, @d@am)

jed_ (jed), Thursday, 18 March 2004 21:33 (twenty years ago) link

Bald dude with his star log?

Spinktor au de toilette (El Spinktor), Thursday, 18 March 2004 21:35 (twenty years ago) link

pierrot le fou is hilarious if you're a misanthrope like me

dean! (deangulberry), Thursday, 18 March 2004 21:36 (twenty years ago) link

All his films are funny.

Broheems (diamond), Thursday, 18 March 2004 21:51 (twenty years ago) link

nouvelle vague isn't.

dean! (deangulberry), Thursday, 18 March 2004 22:22 (twenty years ago) link

haha - yeah, you're right. Actually when I was going over in my head all the films of his that I've seen, Nouvelle Vague was the only one that struck me as humorless. But it was rhetorically neater to say they all are.

Broheems (diamond), Thursday, 18 March 2004 22:24 (twenty years ago) link

can i point out the irony of being a maoist film maker, maybe i dont get it, but if you were making art (or something like it) wouldnt you avoid an ideolofy which is this iconoclastic ?

anthony, Thursday, 18 March 2004 22:27 (twenty years ago) link

i suppose godard finds humor in nv because he is the ultimate bitch. (xpost)

dean! (deangulberry), Thursday, 18 March 2004 22:30 (twenty years ago) link

his maoist flirtations were brief, and about 35 years ago

!!!! (amateurist), Thursday, 18 March 2004 22:46 (twenty years ago) link

'elogé de l'amour' isn't too funny either.

cozen (Cozen), Thursday, 18 March 2004 23:33 (twenty years ago) link

it has its moments. i would say that it dabbles in irony and abject absurdity more than it does in humor. but yes, you're mostly right.

dean! (deangulberry), Thursday, 18 March 2004 23:37 (twenty years ago) link

Breathless is good.

latebloomer (latebloomer), Thursday, 18 March 2004 23:52 (twenty years ago) link

Jed, I would like to see if your Ruffalo lust holds up after his irritating performance in Eternal Sunshine Of The Spotless Mind.

@d@ml (nordicskilla), Friday, 19 March 2004 00:01 (twenty years ago) link

godard's early films (up till '66 or so) have nothing to do with maoism. after that i can't say, but the early stuff is very funny and interesting. band a parte is my favorite too.

J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Friday, 19 March 2004 04:43 (twenty years ago) link

One to lure me out of retirement!

I've seen most of his films up to the early 80s, and really every single one is worth seeing, even if some of the D-Z ones are almost unwatchable. The best of them is 'Vent d'Est', which was intended by its financiers as a kind of 'Bullet for the General'-style Marxist western, and indeed it has Gian Maria Volonte in it. It ends up as an essay on the politics of film-making, and is so a kind of sequel to 'Le Mepris', which is probably the best point of entry for Godard.

The jazzy score for 'Breathless' is lame, and I kind of don't think of it as a Godard at all. It was co-written with Truffaut.

His politics are always going to be a sticking point: the whole Maoist craze that afflicted France in the 60s was obviously a wrong turn, and JLG was a bit of a gadfly: you wouldn't catch Marker, Varda, or Rouch (more classically 'leftist' film-makers) making the same mistake.

This being so, I prefer his D-Z films, impossible as they are, to 'Tout va Bien', which was an attempt, via stars (Fonda and Montard) to 'reconnect' with the mass audience (it's about student politics, left-wing union politics, media politics); you'd be better off watching more straightforward contemporary films on the same subject by Ken Loach and other BBC directors of that era.

If I had to pick one, I guess it would be 'Masculin-Feminin', made in the winter of 65-66, and the start of his political odyssey, following 'Pierrot le Fou', his farewell to Hollywood.

Henry K M (Enrique), Friday, 19 March 2004 09:04 (twenty years ago) link

'passion' is funny, sometimes just in its audacity

!!!! (amateurist), Friday, 19 March 2004 10:02 (twenty years ago) link

two months pass...
http://www.criterionco.com/content/images/full_boxshot/238_box_348x490.jpg

I wish Criterion made posters out of their box art. I can't wait to watch this and the short that accompanies it.

miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Thursday, 17 June 2004 02:07 (nineteen years ago) link

that's a cool cover (except for the repeat of the title on the bottom), but the film is one of godard's worst imo. funny enough, criterion is supposed to be releasing "lettre à jane" on dvd, which is another of his worst. i guess they can make it up to us by releasing "je vous salue, marie" one of these days.

amateur!st (amateurist), Thursday, 17 June 2004 05:39 (nineteen years ago) link

https://www.nplusonemag.com/online-only/online-only/our-godard/

xyzzzz__, Sunday, 25 September 2022 10:05 (one year ago) link

The Brody bio was for the most part excellen.

Malevolent Arugula (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Sunday, 25 September 2022 12:07 (one year ago) link

t

Malevolent Arugula (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Sunday, 25 September 2022 12:07 (one year ago) link

Well played.

Ride On Proserpina (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 25 September 2022 13:00 (one year ago) link

Boys chat.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_Ac0Xc4lQw

Daniel_Rf, Monday, 26 September 2022 08:55 (one year ago) link

Love that. OG title: “The Baby And The Dinosaur”!

SQUIRREL MEAT!! (Capitaine Jay Vee), Monday, 26 September 2022 10:18 (one year ago) link

Saw band a part for the first time. So good. Favorite moment is the voice over lead up and strange walk down the street at night.

calstars, Monday, 26 September 2022 19:53 (one year ago) link

I had a strong feeling that the Brody book had a certain personal animus behind it, particularly in his writing about the later years; this could be entirely my projection, but Brody's sting at being rejected by Godard after a day of interviews on his 60s movies really comes across. So I wondered if that explained his emphasis on certain unpleasant topics like the treatment of the young girl in Sauve Qui Peut or the romantic pursuit of the actress in For Ever Mozart. It's still a good book, though.

All of this may have been emphasized for me because the Colin MacCabe biography, which came out earlier, is very reticent about "personal details". It's probably the only biography I can imagine that mentions the subject's suicide attempts in a footnote.

Halfway there but for you, Monday, 26 September 2022 20:05 (one year ago) link

Hm! If anything, he's too forgiving of Godard's uh fascinations. He

Malevolent Arugula (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 26 September 2022 20:43 (one year ago) link

And his reporting on the SQP incident was pretty fair imo

Malevolent Arugula (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 26 September 2022 20:43 (one year ago) link

Brody very active in defending Godard's reputation on twitter.

Daniel_Rf, Tuesday, 27 September 2022 09:12 (one year ago) link

Watched about 15 mins. Once Godard gets going (and Daney shuts up) you can feel how important the materiality of the medium is for him. You know this, but I've seldom watched him try and articulate it. Like when he talks about the act of projection.

xyzzzz__, Tuesday, 27 September 2022 10:32 (one year ago) link

May read it but that quote is terrible.

Fredric Jameson writes on Jean-Luc Godard.

‘If cinema really is dying, then he died with it; or better still, it died with him.’https://t.co/9pZDvpZHIf

— New Left Review (@NewLeftReview) September 28, 2022

xyzzzz__, Wednesday, 28 September 2022 14:33 (one year ago) link

Picture makes it look like Godard secretly killed cinema and is gloating.

Daniel_Rf, Wednesday, 28 September 2022 14:51 (one year ago) link

Looks like that meme of the girl looking at the camera while the house burns lol

xyzzzz__, Wednesday, 28 September 2022 14:56 (one year ago) link

https://i.imgur.com/4CobVKP.jpg

DPRK in Cincinnati (WmC), Wednesday, 28 September 2022 15:15 (one year ago) link

Is that from his Ulysses project?

Ride On Proserpina (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 28 September 2022 15:27 (one year ago) link

everything fredric jameson writes is terrible

mark s, Wednesday, 28 September 2022 17:17 (one year ago) link

He's a fan of poptimism

Toshirō Nofune (The Seventh ILXorai), Wednesday, 28 September 2022 18:35 (one year ago) link

Was wondering.

Ride On Proserpina (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 28 September 2022 18:43 (one year ago) link

two weeks pass...

Nice, thanks!

We Have Never Been Secondary Modern (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 15 October 2022 18:24 (one year ago) link

three weeks pass...

Just watched ÉLOGE DE L'AMOUR (2001), only 19 years after Jerry the Nipper referred to it at the start of the thread.

I couldn't make much sense of it. Broadly confirms the sense that while early Godard is dazzling, late Godard is rambling.

the pinefox, Tuesday, 8 November 2022 23:31 (one year ago) link

Of the Godard I've seen from the last couple decades (which is not comprehensive), that one is definitely the weakest.

ex-McKinsey wonk who looks like a human version of a rat (Eric H.), Wednesday, 9 November 2022 00:03 (one year ago) link

He made five films from 2000. Image Book > Goodbye to Language (will we ever see it in 3D again) >>>> In Praise of Love and Our Music.

Haven't seen Film Socialisme.

Those top two films would comfortably be in a top ten for Godard.

xyzzzz__, Wednesday, 9 November 2022 00:10 (one year ago) link

Lots of shorts and skits and stuff outside those five features tho

ex-McKinsey wonk who looks like a human version of a rat (Eric H.), Wednesday, 9 November 2022 00:23 (one year ago) link

(I do need to circle back and see Film Socialisme imo)

ex-McKinsey wonk who looks like a human version of a rat (Eric H.), Wednesday, 9 November 2022 00:24 (one year ago) link

It's dire.

the pinefox, Wednesday, 9 November 2022 09:08 (one year ago) link

I have really never engaged with Godard's short film output at all..

xyzzzz__, Wednesday, 9 November 2022 09:14 (one year ago) link

Richard Brody of The New Yorker declared In Praise of Love the greatest film of the 2000s, stating that it is "one of the most unusual, tremulous, and understated of love stories, as well as the story of love itself; ... Godard’s third first film, thus something of a rebirth of cinema."

Unusually preposterous.

the pinefox, Wednesday, 9 November 2022 10:11 (one year ago) link

Yeah, everyone knows that's Harold And Kumar Go To White Castle

Daniel_Rf, Wednesday, 9 November 2022 10:25 (one year ago) link

He made five films from 2000

I've seen them, at least two of them twice, but they're vaguer in memory than the superficially similar 80s and 90s movies and I need to see them again.
The first Godard I've rewatched since his death was Made in USA, not especially beloved by most, but I was surprised just how much plot (though heavily obscured) and how many speaking parts the film contains. Was it his last nod at a "genre" film (unless Detective counts)?

Halfway there but for you, Wednesday, 9 November 2022 16:25 (one year ago) link

Unusually preposterous.

― the pinefox

That's our Richard!

Malevolent Arugula (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 9 November 2022 16:34 (one year ago) link

one month passes...

Imagine being in a film, not understanding any of it then watching it months later and it never making sense.

xyzzzz__, Tuesday, 13 December 2022 13:59 (one year ago) link

i mean a lot of people in POPULAR MOVIE FRANCHISE DELETED must feel like that

jus do jus (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 13 December 2022 14:43 (one year ago) link

quite a little burgess meredith anecdote in that piece

waste of compute (One Eye Open), Tuesday, 13 December 2022 19:14 (one year ago) link

one year passes...

rewatching THE IMAGE BOOK (2018) as a treat to myself and wondering if the many extracts it's quilted from are anywhere definitively listed, ideally in the actual order they appear (including repeats)

(by which i mean listed on the internet: the credits do include a list which i assume is at least a start and i guess i could just grab a pencil and paper and press pause a lot -- but on this day of all days i'm allowed to be lazy and find out if any ilxors know of a solid shortcut)

mark s, Friday, 7 June 2024 19:06 (one week ago) link

https://letterboxd.com/thisisdrew/list/the-image-book/ this works?

fpsa, Friday, 7 June 2024 20:01 (one week ago) link

ooh yes, that is a very good start, thank you

mark s, Friday, 7 June 2024 20:13 (one week ago) link

Ok, got to see the Rosselini Jesus movie

xyzzzz__, Friday, 7 June 2024 21:07 (one week ago) link

Finished Godard On Godard:

The first section, featuring his earliest, pseudonymous writings, is I think solely of historical interest - lots of grand pronouncements, vague tossed off sentences, recurring attempts to elevate movies by comparing them to sundry important names in literature - anything to avoid actually describing the film, criticism as an imposition of taste rather than insight into the art. This is fine - they don't teach criticism in schools, it's normal to be feeling your way around the dark at first, I certainly did - but boy was I worried that all of it would be like this.

Thankfully he does evolve: as one gets further into the book, there is much more care given to actually describing what is happening onscreen, in terms of shots, editing, acting, use of colour, etc. He does still frequently throw in some random enigmatic phrase; at this stage, I would wager that with about half of these, if you challenged him on them he would be able to (though probably not willing to) explain the reasoning that lead him to them, and half are just stuff he's saying because it sounds good. Kind of unfair to single out Godard anyway, the enigmatic aphorism is such a huge part of French intellectual thought in general. And every now and then he hits upon a sentence that sums things up perfectly, even if I can't entirely explain in what way.

I'm big on the idea that you shouldn't judge critics by what movies they like, but of course there's a sense of kinship sneaking in for me as he heaps praise on Tashlin, Ray, Welles. He's good on stuff he doesn't like, too, at least when he deigns it with a full review - much more common is the random sideswipe, so we are given to think that, say, Pagnol is worthless without much explanation why. He's surprisingly enthusiastic about Vadim early on; respectful but distanced from Antonioni; considers Visconti a metteur en scene as opposed to an auteur and I have no idea why. Worst is the Mizoguchi essay, where he casually mentions that film festival audiences split themselves into Kurosawa fans and Mizoguchi fans and then quotes some dude who is like "it's a stupid debate, Mizoguchi is way better!". I prefer Kurosawa, but what annoys here more is the implication that Japan gets to have one (1) auteur and we have to decide which one.

The final section of the book is from when he's directing, and consists of interviews as well as some letters and speeches. I was surprised by how open Godard is about his process, no attempts to appear mysterious, no lecturing the interviewer on not having understood. It's like, after all those years reporting back what's onscreen, he now can't wait to tell about how it comes about - quite endearing!

It cuts off before the estrangement from Truffaut and so the prickly Godard who turns on his friends is in no evidence - Truffaut, Chabrol, Varda, Demy, Resnais all come in for unqualified praise.

Daniel_Rf, Monday, 10 June 2024 10:40 (four days ago) link

> what annoys here more is the implication that Japan gets to have one (1) auteur and we have to decide which one

i thought the lack of japanese films in the list posted above was a bit odd (although maybe the list is incomplete)

koogs, Monday, 10 June 2024 11:14 (four days ago) link

FWIW, the Japanese section of Truffaut's The Films In My Life is pretty thin too (I think it was even omitted in some editions).

See, I read that and my knee-jerk reaction is that I wish there were still Mizoguchi fans squaring off against the Kurosawa army in any tangible sense

Rich E. (Eric H.), Monday, 10 June 2024 13:21 (four days ago) link

Mizoguchi is oft canonized and criterionized still.

I don't begrudge Godard or Truffaut not knowing a lot of Japanese cinema - I'm sure it was pretty difficult to see stuff beyond Ozu, Mizoguchi and Kurosawa - it's accepting the framing of "well here's two directors from Japan, we must face them off against each other" that I find questionable.

Daniel_Rf, Monday, 10 June 2024 13:41 (four days ago) link

xpost Hear hear! Team Mizoguchi all the way.

completely suited to the horny decadence (Capitaine Jay Vee), Monday, 10 June 2024 13:42 (four days ago) link

xpost
To be slightly fair to Godard and Truffaut, it was pretty difficult to see most Japanese films outside of Japan until well into the 1960s (the first international Ozu retrospective, for example, didn't take place until 1963). Kurosawa was always something of an exception.

Ward Fowler, Monday, 10 June 2024 13:45 (four days ago) link

If the S&S polls teach us anything is that once more films become available in the first place the stuff that was there before is seen in a different way.

xyzzzz__, Monday, 10 June 2024 13:53 (four days ago) link


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