Magic: The Gathering C/D

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also I really hope this thing doesn't see much standard play, I can see turn 1 Ponder, turn 2 Time Walk getting old real quick. as someone who has never played Delver but has played against it a lot I can say the whole "game swings on whatever my opponent draws" is not really a great feeling.

again, I think Noxious Revival is gonna be the key to this in Standard, especially since self-mill is a really efficient strategy now and the big graveyard haters like Nihil Spellbomb and Surgical Extraction are both going away soon

Estimate the percent chance that a whale has ever been to the moon? (frogbs), Monday, 9 April 2012 14:25 (five years ago) Permalink

um you can't cast this on turn 2 fyi

ciderpress, Monday, 9 April 2012 14:28 (five years ago) Permalink

well unless you play a birds of paradise turn 1

ciderpress, Monday, 9 April 2012 14:28 (five years ago) Permalink

there are a number of paradise effects you can drop on turn 1...

Mordy, Monday, 9 April 2012 14:31 (five years ago) Permalink

helll iatee i cannot come to magic gathering gathering tonight cuz i am starting a new job and will be working kinda late and prob not up to going out afterwards, but however, watch out next week!

one dis leads to another (ian), Monday, 9 April 2012 14:33 (five years ago) Permalink

it's okay, I was gonna say we might have to do it later tonight cause something came up for me too. next week sounds good!

iatee, Monday, 9 April 2012 14:34 (five years ago) Permalink

um you can't cast this on turn 2 fyi

ahh yes, for some reason the "when you draw it" part still is eluding me
still, turn 3 I guess? I mean really it's good on any turn.

Estimate the percent chance that a whale has ever been to the moon? (frogbs), Monday, 9 April 2012 14:37 (five years ago) Permalink

time walk is more of a combo card than one that goes in a 'fair' deck. it puts you way ahead on mana but not on cards (since your extra draw step just replaces the time walk you used). i think people generally overrate how good it is as a one-shot effect; a big part of the reason its banned everywhere and part of the 'power 9' is because it was pretty easy to loop it

that said, past cards that resembled time walk in some way have all played very strong (remand, mistbind clique, sword of feast and famine) so i guess we'll see

ciderpress, Monday, 9 April 2012 14:50 (five years ago) Permalink

idk, it's harder to think of blue decks that couldn't benefit from 4 time walks than blue decks that could

iatee, Monday, 9 April 2012 14:52 (five years ago) Permalink

well yeah time walk has no downside even when it has no upside. not the case with this new card though

ciderpress, Monday, 9 April 2012 14:54 (five years ago) Permalink

that's true

iatee, Monday, 9 April 2012 14:56 (five years ago) Permalink

IMo the closest they've come to reprinting it was Cryptic Command, which usually played somewhat similar to Time Walk (in many more words obviously), and that card got played a ton

what pushes "take another turn" over the top is that it's just an effect you're always happy to have. If you have the mana to cast it there's no card disadvantage or mana disadvantage.

a big part of the reason its banned everywhere and part of the 'power 9' is because it was pretty easy to loop it

well, it's a power card even as a one-shot effect, but yes to the second point, and this new card is pretty much asking to be looped

Estimate the percent chance that a whale has ever been to the moon? (frogbs), Monday, 9 April 2012 15:01 (five years ago) Permalink

also I'm not really sure how this plays if it's your opponent's turn? can you Think Twice then cast this? I would think not because it's a sorcery but abilities like this (such as madness) generally work at instant speed if I remember correctly

Estimate the percent chance that a whale has ever been to the moon? (frogbs), Monday, 9 April 2012 15:05 (five years ago) Permalink

yeah they will probably have to clarify, cause 'after this one' becomes unclear if it's not your turn

iatee, Monday, 9 April 2012 15:06 (five years ago) Permalink

yes, miracle lets you ignore the timing restriction on sorceries, same as madness

ciderpress, Monday, 9 April 2012 15:07 (five years ago) Permalink

and what will happen is you'll take your extra turn, then your normal turn

ciderpress, Monday, 9 April 2012 15:07 (five years ago) Permalink

So it seems very good with stuff like Merfolk Looter, since it allows you to discard the card if you get it early, and it gives you another chance at a miracle during your opponent's turn. Also I wonder how this works with "draw two cards" effects - is there a first card and a second one?

Gotta see what the other miracles are like, b/c you could definitely make an interesting Standard deck this way

Estimate the percent chance that a whale has ever been to the moon? (frogbs), Monday, 9 April 2012 15:14 (five years ago) Permalink

from what i understand it works like this: if you play a draw 2 and you haven't drawn yet that turn and the first of the 2 is a miracle, you have to reveal the miracle to get the miracle trigger, but then you have to draw the 2nd card to finish resolving the draw spell before the miracle trigger goes on the stack and lets you cast the miracle

ciderpress, Monday, 9 April 2012 15:20 (five years ago) Permalink

if you draw the 2nd card before revealing the miracle, it doesn't work since you've lost the proof that the first one was the miracle

this is why they gave them that fancy card frame, so you don't accidentally just put it in your hand and miss your chance to cast it

ciderpress, Monday, 9 April 2012 15:22 (five years ago) Permalink

I imagine there will be a lot of arguments when people draw too quickly

iatee, Monday, 9 April 2012 15:23 (five years ago) Permalink

rules-wise i think madness is the most comparable mechanic to how this works

ciderpress, Monday, 9 April 2012 15:26 (five years ago) Permalink

that's kind of strange - so you pretty much have to draw one at a time now. I've never done it that way - if I play something that says "draw 3", I'll just draw them all at once

the card frame thing makes sense now - at first I just thought it was a "holy balls look at this thing!" like the planeswalkers

Estimate the percent chance that a whale has ever been to the moon? (frogbs), Monday, 9 April 2012 15:26 (five years ago) Permalink

you only have to draw the first card of each turn separately, if you're drawing 7 cards on your opponent's turn you can just scoop the remaining 6

ciderpress, Monday, 9 April 2012 15:48 (five years ago) Permalink

that's still kinda obnoxious

iatee, Monday, 9 April 2012 15:49 (five years ago) Permalink

esp if you have like 1 miracle card in your deck

iatee, Monday, 9 April 2012 15:49 (five years ago) Permalink

in Legacy it seems like it'll be a pain, but it remains to be seen the extent it'll be played since there's likely to be a banning or two soon. I guess you kind of have to tip them off if you're playing any miracle cards. in Standard, they've generally shied away from instants that draw more than one card lately so I doubt it'll be a problem.

Estimate the percent chance that a whale has ever been to the moon? (frogbs), Monday, 9 April 2012 16:13 (five years ago) Permalink

either way, I am genuinely excited about this. I feel like Wizards get bit on the ass every time they try to do something abuseable (Storm, Madness, Affinity, the entire Urza's block), but they have to do it anyway.

Estimate the percent chance that a whale has ever been to the moon? (frogbs), Monday, 9 April 2012 16:16 (five years ago) Permalink

the psuedo-time walk seems w/e to me, i mean i only play block and limited and i understand there are formats where it can get abused but its not that good a card imo. i think the best preview cards so far are the white angel rare and the white blink common

Lamp, Tuesday, 10 April 2012 00:53 (five years ago) Permalink

the mana cost of time walk effects has to be thought of differently since they don't really tap you out. I can't see running 4 in any kind of slowish blue deck really being a mistake!

Estimate the percent chance that a whale has ever been to the moon? (frogbs), Tuesday, 10 April 2012 04:06 (five years ago) Permalink

looks like they're doing the same thing they did with Suspend, using Miracle as an excuse to reprint broken stuff:

http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/cards/22325.jpg

a Miracle Balance would be one of the greatest things ever, but sadly I don't think it'll ever happen (as I truly believe Balance is the game's most powerful card and should never, ever be reprinted in any form)

you can expect punches, kicks and even worse (frogbs), Tuesday, 17 April 2012 15:57 (five years ago) Permalink

haha some ppl were talking about 'balance' but the white miracle mythic is something garbage about angel tokens

theres a really cool black mythic 'descent into madness' that im tempted to preorder cuz i have the feeling you can do some rad stuff w/ it but overall i havent really been feeling this set

Lamp, Tuesday, 17 April 2012 16:01 (five years ago) Permalink

white mythic doesn't seem bad but IMO White Sun's Zenith outclasses it, and few people play that anyway. the blue and red ones seem better to me b/c of that land that allows you to draw and discard in case you get stuck with one in your hand, along with similar effects like Faithless Looting. honestly I have no idea how any of this is going to play out.

I like Decent into Madness too, but the fact that it exiles cards kind of takes away some of the effectiveness (as Reassembling Skeleton was my first though). plus it costs 5 and doesn't really effect the game until your second upkeep.

you can expect punches, kicks and even worse (frogbs), Tuesday, 17 April 2012 16:06 (five years ago) Permalink

both the utility lands spoiled so far seem useful although neither are in colors id really consider playing

Lamp, Tuesday, 17 April 2012 21:22 (five years ago) Permalink

i dunno about constructed and don't really feel like thinking about it yet but this limited format looks pretty fun

i hope that land that makes creatures uncounterable isn't as good as it looks though, its already got my roommate to lose all interest in constructed since he only plays control

ciderpress, Wednesday, 18 April 2012 16:41 (five years ago) Permalink

I am not sure how playable that is. There are so many great duals already. I guess in some decks it'll just straight up be better but you'd have to have all one creature type (which I don't think any decks do right now)

My pick for "sleeper" is Zealous Conscripts - think it'll hover around the $1-$1.50 range, but that card seems so damn good.

Right now my favorite design is this:
http://media.wizards.com/images/magic/tcg/products/avr/0h8auar7xf_en.jpg

you can expect punches, kicks and even worse (frogbs), Wednesday, 18 April 2012 16:51 (five years ago) Permalink

yeah i feel like im still bad at magic cuz i dont think that rare land is s0 amazing?

Lamp, Wednesday, 18 April 2012 16:59 (five years ago) Permalink

i guess for two black and a red you can cast the pit-dweller and lightning bolt him?

Mordy, Wednesday, 18 April 2012 17:15 (five years ago) Permalink

3 mana for a 5/4 creature, not shabby

Mordy, Wednesday, 18 April 2012 17:15 (five years ago) Permalink

no no - when he dies your opponent gets him

you can expect punches, kicks and even worse (frogbs), Wednesday, 18 April 2012 17:20 (five years ago) Permalink

OH. I missed the from the graveyard part. Eh, then.

Mordy, Wednesday, 18 April 2012 17:23 (five years ago) Permalink

you'd have to have all one creature type (which I don't think any decks do right now)

human tribal and zombie tribal are both very good decks in standard already. i think people are also worried about uncounterable primeval titans, since the main thing keeping that card in check was mana leak

ciderpress, Wednesday, 18 April 2012 17:24 (five years ago) Permalink

OH. I missed the from the graveyard part. Eh, then.

you have to figure out a way to use him. if you can put +1/+1 counters on him he loses his downside. or you can bounce him, or...I dunno. it's not a great card, I just love the design of it.

cider - Human tribals play Geists, and Zombie tribals have Phantasmal Image and Phyrexian Obliterator. In both cases I think you'd want the duals that are out already (which are excellent already). Also, many ways to beat titans besides Mana Leak (Phantasmal Image works quite well too)

you can expect punches, kicks and even worse (frogbs), Wednesday, 18 April 2012 17:36 (five years ago) Permalink

yeah i was thinking of ways to add that land to boros humans but the mana gets tricky esp if yr trying to use the new W/R utility land as well? im sure itll be useful but i wonder if itll be as powerful as some ppl are predicting, i guess.

i think i may be able to play the prerelease tho so im excited again lol

Lamp, Wednesday, 18 April 2012 17:41 (five years ago) Permalink

yeah some spanish site spoiled a shitload of the common/uncommon limited fodder yesterday so i'm getting all excited for drafting this now and trying to find the cool synergies etc. so far all my favorite limited cards are in blue it seems

ciderpress, Wednesday, 18 April 2012 18:00 (five years ago) Permalink

yeah stuff like tandem lookout seems p powerful in sealed/draft. in general u/r seems interesting

Lamp, Wednesday, 18 April 2012 18:07 (five years ago) Permalink

I can't figure out if soulbound is going to be tons of fun or if it's just going to make for incredibly complex board states. Say your opponent's got four creatures out, three with soulbound, and you're trying to figure out how to block...yikes

you can expect punches, kicks and even worse (frogbs), Wednesday, 18 April 2012 18:25 (five years ago) Permalink

full spoiler is up on the main site. set looks pretty good for limited, at first glance the power level of the commons/uncommons seems really low for a modern set but i'm sure some of them will play stronger than they look. removal looks worse than innistrad's, which was already pretty bad, so that makes me think the format's going to be all about combat tricks with the soulbound guys, and trying to blow out your opponent in combat without getting blown out yourself.

ciderpress, Monday, 23 April 2012 13:19 (five years ago) Permalink

i'll wait to pass judgement until the prerelease, but right now my feeling is that drafting decks that abuse soulbound as well as the blue/white Flickering ability are going to work well. and for that, I feel like Black will be very underdrafted.

you can expect punches, kicks and even worse (frogbs), Monday, 23 April 2012 13:43 (five years ago) Permalink

IATEE

do we MAGIC tonight?
should get there around 5:30-6.. i have to find decks but i am p sure i know where they are now.

one dis leads to another (ian), Monday, 23 April 2012 14:45 (five years ago) Permalink

ahhh I gotta googleproof that

but yeah that time works great for me

iatee, Monday, 23 April 2012 14:47 (five years ago) Permalink


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