The Irish

destroy: the current amurrican hard on for all things irish.

"Father Ted" was a load of arse-juice but the "D'unbelievables"...

Destroy: What Ned said about St. Paddy's in the USA, my ridiculous "Kiss Me I'm Irish" relatives: stop the Erin Go Bragh insanity please!, the Cranberries, Hothouse Flowers, the Troubles (wouldn't that be nice?).

I lurve leprechauns. And shamrock shakes.

Now, Irish Americans, that's *quite* a different story.

I love Ireland solely because of Guinness, Murphy's and Bailey's. I'm a lush.

Destroy: The food.

I believe it was Shane MacGowan once poignantly said: "Ertwas swillin' 'n' sllen/ inna mrsts o' Culcllan/ er pour me a-point o' whiskey t'day..."

My favorite Ireland memory: driving up the Conor Pass on the Dingle Peninsula, parking the car and hiking up a mountain. The view of the countryside, the ponds, the sheep and the sea was breathtaking, of course. But what was really remarkable was just how quiet it all was -- I could hear the grass crunching under my feet and I thought I was stepping on dried out grass, till I realized that it sounded so loud only because it was so quiet. I'd literally never "heard" silence like that before. I realized then how really loud even "quiet" moments are where I live, how there's always some sort of ambient noise in the background disrupting the perfect quiet. And then you just stand there, with the knockout view in the closest thing to perfect peace and quiet I'd ever experienced. Then you walk down and throw some money at the person playing some cliche Irish music on a harp at the foot of the hill.

destroy people who say: "I'm Irish, my mother's brother's budgie was bought from a pat shop in Galway"

paddy's night in Kilburn too, destroy that, even more so in Neasden.

search: Tony Cascarino

Anybody want to recommend some traditional Irish music? There's so much stuff out there and a lot of it looks terrible.

Ooops, sorry I thought this was an ILM thread 'cos I was on ILM and then I did a search and so I thought...I know...I am dumb.

And it's quite a late night for me.

'search' and 'destroy'? UMkay

Ned, not quite full blown trad....but you can't go wrong with Christy Moore.

Specifically, I'd recommend Planxty's 2004 (or is it 2005? I can't remember) live album, which is brilliant and has Christy Moore singing on it. Any one of the first four Chieftains albums are also top class. Martin Hayes is also very popular and good, and there's a great, great singer called Iarla O Lionaird who sings unaccompanied Irish songs. His voice is beautiful, but it can get a little wearing after a while if you don't understand what he's singing about.

The Dubliners ain't half bad either.

luke kelly.

also, what's with lack of WB Yeats love upthread?

Ned's question inspired me to dig out that Planxty 2004 album. It is GRATE.

Ned, not quite full blown trad....but you can't go wrong with Christy Moore.

My lord, the prosecution cites "Don't Forget Your Shovel".

search: Planxty's "The Well Below The Valley", if only for the title track.

My lord, the prosecution cites "Don't Forget Your Shovel".

Also "The Voyage", and his version of "Ride On".

xpost

If it's the same one the Devil's Interval do then it's got incest and 6 cases of abortion/infanticide, body count is the hallmark of a good folk song.

Planxty, yes - I only know the first three albums though. Also that Andy Irvine+Paul Brady album - in fact, is Andy Irvine famous? He's certainly not as famous as he should be! (He's also from London, of course!)I don't know as much about Irish music as I should.

yes well, not every track! I'm out of my depth here, and I've forgotten my shovel.

Planxty, yes - I only know the first three albums though. Also that Andy Irvine+Paul Brady album - in fact, is Andy Irvine famous?

he is famous enough, but maybe not as famous as he deserves to be. He plays live a lot in Whelans, and every time I go to see him I kick myself for not going to see him every time he plays, as he is awesome.

In a piece of inspired supportage, the first time I saw him was when he was supporting Will Oldham; a whole new generation of fans was born.

He is awesome. Everything I've ever heard him do, from Sweeney's Men onwards, has been great, and he always seems like the most talented and yet least well known in whatever setup he's involved in.

I think he is all about the music rather than about the self-promotion.

I love his song about how Ronnie Drew is actually a culchie.

CINCINNATI -- A man was caught Tuesday morning inside a car with his pants down.

Police said Kim Leblanc broke into a parked car overnight on Central Parkway, and the owner found him asleep inside and called police.

Officers said Leblanc was not wearing any pants when they arrived.

Investigators said Leblanc told them he had done drugs and believed that a leprechaun had let him into the car.

Leblanc remains in police custody on a variety of charges.

top scientist claims irish less intelligent than other ethnicities,

blames leprechaun influence.

Thieving Irish. Here's something funny: I'm American, and my grandfather raised us to be conscious of our Irish heritage. We just find out our Irish side actually came from England ... and had lived there for centuries before coming to the US, rather than actually coming here from Ireland during the potato/weird root tasting beer/cable knit sweater famine.

So what's the deal with that - English, Irish, what? I'm sure most of the people who claim Irish heritage here are less of Irish heritage than suspected.

http://www.dk-ink.com/AngelsRemembered/files/leprechaun.gif

Oh who knows. My family could care less about it, we're American...but my boyfriend's family is v v proudly Irish...except at this point all their relatives back home live in the Leith district of Edinburgh. At least they're all Hibs supporters!

um, hibs aren't the 'irish' team in scotland.

they are one of the Irish teams, as far as I know. especially if you live in Edinburgh. Scots may know better.

Hibs were the "Irish" team in Scotland before Celtic were.

If by "Irish" you mean "charitable club set up by members of the Catholic church to provide aid to poverty stricken Catholics who were mostly Irish immigrants" or something. Hibernian means Irish, doesn't it?

is sharivari the other rubberbandit

No but he did inspire the song Dads Best Friend

Lol “Dutch”
https://www.speakpipe.com/voice-recorder/msg/iwktxh702ep0uwue

https://cdn.webshopapp.com/shops/57105/files/65235074/wit-brood-half.jpg

Coming right up! :-D

Knowing nothing about your origin or native tongue, you sound like either a Chinese or Arabic woman speaking Dutch :)

Got you the first time though, something I can't say about many minority language peers and peeps I frequently meet who try it on. Heel goed!

I learned how to say 'Is tú mo ghrá' when I was sitting in Deems' garden on a sweet pre-hurling finale evening in Baile Áth Cliath for an English lover of Irish descent, but no way I'm recording that.

lol jfc
https://www.speakpipe.com/voice-recorder/msg/ry9bnelv2ucl4z0v
I’m never speaking again

From where I'm standing both LBI's Irish and gyac's Dutch sound impeccable. ;)

Currently sitting in front of the TV watching Ronan Curtis and Callum O’Dowda launch shots in the very approximate direction of a Bulgarian goalkeeper so I struggle to believe my commitment to Irish culture is being questioned atm.

you can’t pronounce madra and siopa correctly, stop embarrassing yourself please

The language of *BEEP* is universal :) I've no idea what you said there Gyac, if it wasn't a string of words instead of a sentence (caught a few mentioned here!).

What is (what sounds like) 'na-kórgia'?

xp lol SV

na cáirde = the friends

lol sv im watchin england

i'm watching a documentary about the Hittites, ftw

xp i mean lolololololz obv

thank you brave people with your sound clips!

I don't have any specific requests, still conceptually/anatomically troubled by https://irishpalatals.sites.ucsc.edu/getting-started/introduction/ though

i think it would be lovely to understand any of that but otoh theres a lot to be said for listening to a bit of it too, imitation is often smarter than learning or, as we'd say ourselves nura mbíonn aon ann agat ach pucín gabhair cur i lar an bpairce leis

which is a rough effort at something a roscommon man of my close acquaintance says at random times, roughly phonetically equates to nurameen ayn on oggot ak pukeen gower curry lower an parka lesh

i have no fuckin idea what it means, something about a mediocre goat i think

ok thats 101

I had a teacher who said “ann” to rhyme with crown, but she was from Cork. But yeah unless you mislearn Irish for your whole childhood idk where you would start as an adult.

just listening i think.

the most i ever picked up was genuinely from the likes of gift grub, something i found funny that more dropped snippets in that were tantalisingly close to comprehensible and obviously worth chasing for meaning.

after that its again snippets like the saying above or what an aul fella might drop into conversation down home where you like the roll of it or whatever.

id have to learn the grammar basics again, the vocab would come but id never fear the pronunciation at all tbh, its almost entirely interpretive as far as i can tell from the many moves growing up

see I’m the opposite, but that’s not really surprising I guess cos you probably grew up with more exposure to the language in daily life than me? I’d be fine with verbs and grammar but if you asked me to read something out unprepared or formulate a sentence or argument in my head, I’d get totally tongue tied. It’s really strange because I sort of did mini immersion while I was studying for the oral and I would dream in Irish, my thoughts would be in it too, and it sounded like music in my thoughts and from my mouth and yet, and yet, and yet. I never had this trouble with french ffs.

listening is good in theory but everyone speaks too fast! I guess there's probably something simple and slowable on the internet

(flashbacks to weddings/funerals where I'm clutching the order of service and looking for vaguely similar words in a line of a call&response prayer half a page above the one everyone else is actually reading out, hoping any nearby old ladies aren't outraged that I'm not even opening my mouth)

dmac I have no idea what that means and still less after asking Google Translate but I am all for sayings involving goats

this is me ever since they changed mass & idk what the fuck is happening anymore

never really immersed tbh, theres a few spots on the island but never any of mine.

aps that aspirationally translates to "if all you have is a scrawny goat, put it in the middle of the market"

he never told me what it meant but it danced when he said it which i feel is the main thing

am going to be on islay in a couple weeks, might get to hear some goidelic vocables

can someone who knows a bit more about it fill me in on one aspect of the emma de souza case? No article I've read mentions the reasons why the home office is pursuing this in court. A few have mentioned "brexit" but I'm not really following the logic. It seems to have something about asserting domestic law over allowing say the ECJ to have jurisdiction over half the population and therefore over NI? Is this correct?

emma de souza case bit confusing to me but the reason the home office is pursuing it in court is because ... they don't like immigration and people appealing immigration decisions in court?

i think its a basic split motivation between the ECJ jurisdiction argument and a simple rejection of the "self identification" of nationality

presumably the underlying driver boils down to "call yourself what you like but NI is british"

Emma de Souza is an Irish citizen from NI who has never held British citizenship. On this basis, her status as an EU citizen means she can have her (non-EU) husband live with her in NI. However the home office considers her a British citizen, even though this contravenes the provisions in the GFA for all people from NI to be Irish, British, or both. At least that’s how I understand it.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/derry-woman-is-british-until-she-renounces-citizenship-tribunal-told-1.4013861

the brits consider someone born in the NI automatically british unless they renounce their citizenship it seems

Even if they do not consider themselves British or even to have held said citizenship.

wonder if after brexit an irish citizen from NI would even be able to sponsor a spouse to live in NI.

i can basically never move back to the uk on the basis of being in a ltr - soon to be a marriage - with a non-eu citizen and being broke as fuck so I'm definitely sympathetic to this case, hope it works out for them

if this upcoming second marriage of mine fails like the last one I'm high-tailing it home before i can fall in love with another canadian

Seems wise

okay thanks for (sorta) clarification. You're kindof saying what I understood the case to be, its just weird to me that the Home Office have such latitude to take an action so aggressively undermining of the GFA. At least when number 10 does it there's an impetus that kindof makes sense. This seems way off the leash, but then comments by the migration minister (!) sortof show that this is a p uncontroversial within central government. Anyway, well done this lady.

She has won three cases against the home office so far iirc.

I assume the home office does act within the remit of no 10’s knowledge though? Notable that the challenges have been going on for four years and that Theresa May would have been the Home Secretary signing off on the initial one.

It’s a fucking awful case

The legal wrangle is now entering it’s fourth year. For the first two years, we lost our Freedom of Movement. The UK Home Office retained Jake’s passport with no legislative authority or policy to do-so. With these restrictions, Jake was unable to leave the country and had to turn down opportunities for work. The highest price, however, was losing the last two years of his grandmother’s life. Every request to see Jake’s grandmother in her progressively deteriorating condition was denied. When she passed away at home in Los Angeles, Jake’s request to attend the funeral was denied. It was only after increased media pressure that the Home Office eventually relented- couriering Jake’s passport back to us and allowing him a belated farewell to his late grandmother; a bitter-sweet farewell mired by remorse for not having been afforded an opportunity to say goodbye.

And this too:

Most troubling though is that our experience is not unique, but rather a window into a much deeper and wider issue occurring across our society. The reality being felt by myself and many in our community is that there is a price on Irish identity. A personal price that leaves many questioning what our identity is truly worth. A process referred to as Renunciation of British Citizenship is offered by the UK Home Office as a solution, but what does it really entail?

Firstly, the form is a legal document that begins with a declaration; “I am a British citizen”

It also requires substantial evidence to prove you have British citizenship. Birth in Northern Ireland constitutes automatic British citizenship for those seeking to realize their EU rights. For those renouncing, it is considered insufficient evidence of British citizenship. Considering that many individuals choosing this route do not consider themselves British in the first place, it can be an emotionally arduous process.

In addition, the process also costs £372!! No small fee for renouncing a citizenship which under the GFA should be entirely optional. There should be no levy on an Irish person to be recognised as Irish to live on our island! Anyone taking this route will also lose Freedom of Movement for up to 6 months while the Home Office processes your application.

Then there’s the uncertainty; nobody knows what the ramifications of renouncing are. In a recent case, the Home Office went so far as to question the residency rights of a citizen who had renounced their British citizenship. There is a very real possibility that going forward, anyone else choosing to renounce may be exposed to further impedance of their right to remain in their home. There’s also concern about the rights of the wider family as a whole, and the effect renouncing may have on them.

On the train back from Cork and looking forward to this person getting on to find their reserved seat. pic.twitter.com/hsX4LxPcp5

— Conor Wilson (@ConorWilson) September 16, 2019

:D

I think I know him.

Lmao

if his first name's Daniel i definitely know the cunt

thank you to my friends for booking my train seat pic.twitter.com/ZG3UAxmuYN

— 𝕭𝖚𝖈𝕶𝖋𝖆𝖘𝖙 𝕾𝖔𝖈𝖎𝖆𝖑𝖎𝖘𝖙 (@dgahk) September 16, 2019

hilarious guys

ye might quit tittering at the back there and realise that this is very common in my country, to allocate a secondary family name across the surname to differentiate from other cadet branches of a clan who may be particularly thickly laid out in any given area

in kerry youd get a differentiating string of grandparent names, so that a thos. o'sullivan would be known locally as tommy-paddy-mary, no surname required at all

midwest there's nothing unusual about hearing an entire unit as the rowty-kilbanes or the pheggy-kilbanes

its the latter usage here, and all youre seeing is the truncated identification utilising an honoured tradition, most likely its just john o'donnell, of the useless cunt o'donnells, postman would know him as johnny useless cunt and the barman/undertaker wouldnt know him at all unless you asked for john-mhaire-tim-bán.

the taxman has never heard of him

Otm. This is why we’ve never needed postcodes!

sher if we'd a had postcodes the brits woulda found us

Countries very much in character

The Hail Mary has been voted Ireland's favourite prayer at the National Ploughing Championships https://t.co/QrlsCurn2Z

— RTÉ News (@rtenews) September 19, 2019

confiteor topped the sight and sound poll but you can't put the culture into culchie

(xp) Came here to post that!

I can understand the logic - it’s the fastest & even more so in Irish