There’s Nothing Woke About a Tofu Burger—Pamela Paul
― rob, Thursday, 19 January 2023 16:26 (one year ago) link
finally read this about her: https://www.newyorker.com/culture/persons-of-interest/the-rules-according-to-pamela-paul
brilliant example of just letting someone explain how much they suck in their own words
― mookieproof, Saturday, 28 January 2023 03:09 (one year ago) link
i used to listen to the book review podcast which i always thought she did a nice job hosting, i was disappointed to find out that she is completely insane
― call all destroyer, Saturday, 28 January 2023 03:47 (one year ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KI-8hst0bho
― The Big Candy-O (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 28 January 2023 03:50 (one year ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UxcI4iaWHGk
― The Big Candy-O (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 28 January 2023 03:52 (one year ago) link
Max Read wrote a characteristically funny editor’s note about her column. https://maxread.substack.com/p/editing-the-new-york-times
― Glower, Disruption & Pies (kingfish), Saturday, 28 January 2023 08:11 (one year ago) link
Who Wins the Language Wars?
—Nicholas Kristoff
― rob, Thursday, 2 February 2023 14:22 (one year ago) link
*sigh*
― And Your Borad Can Zing (James Redd and the Blecchs), Thursday, 2 February 2023 14:32 (one year ago) link
If only Cindy Williams had gotten that part in Language Wars.
― And Your Borad Can Zing (James Redd and the Blecchs), Thursday, 2 February 2023 14:33 (one year ago) link
Ever since reading this piece on copaganda in the Times, it always jumps out. The latest: yesterday's The Morning, while discussing Tyre Nichols, kept referring to paramilitary units as "well-intentioned".
― blatherskite, Thursday, 2 February 2023 16:54 (one year ago) link
christ
― rob, Thursday, 2 February 2023 16:56 (one year ago) link
What Liberals Can Learn From Ron DeSantis
fucking hell. might as well make this a Pamela Paul thread
― rob, Thursday, 9 February 2023 23:25 (one year ago) link
I hope it has something to do with manliness.
― a man often referred to in the news media as the Duke of Saxony (tipsy mothra), Friday, 10 February 2023 03:51 (one year ago) link
"prison is appropriate for some people"
― POLIZISTEN VERSINKEN IM SCHLAMM (forksclovetofu), Friday, 10 February 2023 05:31 (one year ago) link
A Yale economics professor has some ideas for how to deal with the burdens of Japan’s rapidly aging society. The “only solution,” he said, is mass suicide of the elderly, including ritual disembowelment. https://t.co/krlL3Ytd2e— The New York Times (@nytimes) February 12, 2023
― papal hotwife (milo z), Sunday, 12 February 2023 19:48 (one year ago) link
"what did he mean?"
― waiting for a czar to fall (Neanderthal), Sunday, 12 February 2023 19:50 (one year ago) link
It's just metaphorical ritual suicide
― Auf Der Martini (Ye Mad Puffin), Sunday, 12 February 2023 20:30 (one year ago) link
We’ll be using that solution in the USA in a decade don’t you worry
― G. D’Arcy Cheesewright (silby), Sunday, 12 February 2023 20:57 (one year ago) link
Apparently this professor has become a cult figure among disgruntled Japanese youth who believe their futures have been impacted by the society’s aging demographics. They put his face on t shirts and things.
― treeship., Sunday, 12 February 2023 21:07 (one year ago) link
kudos to threadstarter for this important public service
― sleeve, Sunday, 12 February 2023 21:22 (one year ago) link
I preferred quiddities and agonies of the ruling class
― treeship., Sunday, 12 February 2023 21:31 (one year ago) link
different topics imho, that one is "oh noes how will rich people cope", this one is more abt documenting their truly disturbing rightward shift
― sleeve, Sunday, 12 February 2023 21:39 (one year ago) link
"their" being the NYT ofc
― sleeve, Sunday, 12 February 2023 21:40 (one year ago) link
soon Bret Stephens will be the liberal columnist of the bunch
― waiting for a czar to fall (Neanderthal), Sunday, 12 February 2023 21:46 (one year ago) link
Some would suggest that American Covid response policy looks an awful lot like this even without trying
― Glower, Disruption & Pies (kingfish), Sunday, 12 February 2023 22:28 (one year ago) link
― treeship., Sunday, February 12, 2023 4:31 PM (one hour ago) bookmarkflaglink
― sleeve, Sunday, February 12, 2023 4:39 PM (one hour ago)
I like the quid-ag thread a lot too and will continue to post things there, but for better or worse I actually read those articles! and sleeve otm about the political bent
― rob, Sunday, 12 February 2023 22:54 (one year ago) link
my sole regret wrt this thread is that I capitalized NYT, breaking from the past no-way thread convention :(
― rob, Sunday, 12 February 2023 22:55 (one year ago) link
torn between the point of reporting on people like that Japanese Yale loon; like, guy hangs around with the person who runs 4chan, is clearly some edgelord discourse idiot, and doesn't deserve to be given attention by anyone, particularly the NYT and Yale. Yet maybe ignoring him isn't a good idea? Dunno.
― I? not I! He! He! HIM! (akm), Sunday, 12 February 2023 23:24 (one year ago) link
There are ways to pay attention to him that don't involve writing articles about him
― waiting for a czar to fall (Neanderthal), Sunday, 12 February 2023 23:25 (one year ago) link
I thought this was an interesting article tbh. The “4chan edgelord” audience he panders to is a real thing, in Japan as well as the West. It’s worth keeping tabs on them.
― treeship., Monday, 13 February 2023 00:52 (one year ago) link
also worth keeping tabs on ivy league/chicago-accredited economists, all of whom are latent genocidaires
and people who *wish* they were accredited so, like mcardle, yglesias and brett stephens's ex-wife
― mookieproof, Monday, 13 February 2023 01:21 (one year ago) link
Yes, exactly.
― treeship., Monday, 13 February 2023 01:29 (one year ago) link
that one is "oh noes how will rich people cope", this one is more abt documenting their truly disturbing rightward shift
Okay I get why ilxors respond to the content in the Times in these ways, and I have no serious counterargument.
That said, both of these characterizations fill me with cognitive dissonance though, and for different reasons.
First, my experience of salaries in print journalism was decidedly grim. My first journalism job paid $6 an hour. My second journalism job paid $16,000 a year. My third journalism job paid... $8 an hour. My third journalism job paid $12 an hour. My fourth journalism job paid $20,000 a year, which felt like a fortune. In 1996.
Referring to NYT staffers - or even its editorial columnists - as "the ruling class" is comprehensible only due to a perverse quirk of the economics of cultural production.
Basically, for most of my life, the ONLY people who could survive in NYC-based print-media industries (newspaper journalism, magazine journalism, and of course book publishing) were subsidized by wealthy parents.
Journalism - on its own - is not now, nor has it ever been, a path to riches. No one is getting wealthy from print journalism any more (and almost no one did so in prior decades either).
Truthbomb: if you are someone with one or more degrees in English, yes, you can work as an editorial assistant at Alfred A. Knopf (or the New Yorker, or whatever). But only if you have no student debt and your parents pay your rent. This has been true for half a century; it should not be news.
Now about the "disturbing rightward shift," please remember that approximately half the nation believes anyone involved in mainstream media - including and especially print media like NYT/WaPo - is essentially communist. Conservative media is clear on this point: the NYT is basically communist.
This disconnect is vexing. Ilxorz and lefties in general believe the NYT is center-right at best, and not to be trusted. Most of the conservasphere believes the NYT is hard left, left of Che Guevara, left of Lenin, left of Bernie, and not to be trusted.
Can both of these descriptions be true? I dunno. In the meantime I still feel like the NYT has a pretty good crossword puzzle app so I feel like sticking with it.
― Auf Der Martini (Ye Mad Puffin), Monday, 13 February 2023 01:59 (one year ago) link
the way I feel about the Times is this:it’s the paper I’ve been yelling at since i was a teenager, i don’t want to find a new paper to yell at. it has decent reporting on occasion, and the best online recipe depository. i still think it sucks.
― Goose Bigelow, Fowl Gigolo (the table is the table), Monday, 13 February 2023 02:18 (one year ago) link
The ruling class experiencing quiddities and agonies are not NY Times staffers - it's the rich people being profiled in the lifestyle/real estate/etc sections.
Now about the "disturbing rightward shift," please remember that approximately half the nation believes anyone involved in mainstream media - including and especially print media like NYT/WaPo - is essentially communist. Conservative media is clear on this point: the NYT is basically communist.This disconnect is vexing. Ilxorz and lefties in general believe the NYT is center-right at best, and not to be trusted. Most of the conservasphere believes the NYT is hard left, left of Che Guevara, left of Lenin, left of Bernie, and not to be trusted.Can both of these descriptions be true? I dunno.
Can both of these descriptions be true? I dunno.
Why would the right's attitude be taken into account at all? They also think Joe Biden is a Stalinist baby blood-drinking pedophile or at least a Stalinist doing the bidding of baby blood-drinking pedophiles.
All major news media is center-right (at best) - they're capitalist enterprises who in the end have to protect their bottom line. This means 'printing the controversy,' an overwhelming focus on crime at every level, following the lead of American imperialism in anything outside our borders, dehumanizing anyone or anything that makes the upper-middle class anxious (the homeless, BLM activists, etc.), protecting fellow capitalist enterprises (ie advertisers).
The shift in the Times has been embracing deep reactionary takes on social issues - which is not new ground but a shift from the last couple of decades.
― papal hotwife (milo z), Monday, 13 February 2023 02:46 (one year ago) link
oh, i think there's a vast difference between NYT staffers and editorial columnists. it's a perverse quirk that the latter are accorded such attention, but, nevertheless, they are. (i was going to say 'fading quirk' but iirc the WaPo just fired a bunch of journalists while hiring a bunch of NRO/AEI columnists)
might be fading away now, but it's long been common knowledge that WSJ reporters can be relied upon even while the WSJ editorial page is fucking bonkers
i would first suggest that literally no one deserves a regular NYT opinion column -- no one has anything interesting to say twice a week for decades on end. but apart from that, who's left? a guy who just recently grasped climate change after a visit to greenland. a woman who thinks liberals should learn things from ron desantis. a guy who quit, to run for political office in a jurisdiction he didn't live, then came back. maureen fucking dowd. these people are all terrible, and obviously so. but they are voices that matter in the 'discourse' and the 'sunday morning shows'. and if they didn't suck so badly, perhaps those things would be slightly better
― mookieproof, Monday, 13 February 2023 03:03 (one year ago) link
that all sounds right to me
― POLIZISTEN VERSINKEN IM SCHLAMM (forksclovetofu), Monday, 13 February 2023 03:11 (one year ago) link
wait which one of those is jamelle bouie
― Guayaquil (eephus!), Monday, 13 February 2023 05:15 (one year ago) link
(to be clear i fully agree with you that there should not be such a thing as a regular NYT opinion columnist, and that nobody's 20th best opinion of the year is worth a damn)
― Guayaquil (eephus!), Monday, 13 February 2023 05:16 (one year ago) link
jamelle bouie is grebt, and i suspect that as black man extremely well-versed in the last 300+ years of american history, he has almost endless things to write about twice a week
i have no idea what pamela paul will offer us on a weekly basis? ideally it won't be about the tragedy of taking her stupid friends to a sandwich place that offers soppressata, but i guess we'll see
― mookieproof, Monday, 13 February 2023 05:29 (one year ago) link
This disconnect is vexing. Ilxorz and lefties in general believe the NYT is center-right at best, and not to be trusted. Most of the conservasphere believes the NYT is hard left, left of Che Guevara, left of Lenin, left of Bernie, and not to be trusted.Can both of these descriptions be true? I dunno. In the meantime I still feel like the NYT has a pretty good crossword puzzle app so I feel like sticking with it.
trust fund kids have their own class politics. they resent the bourgeoisie (their parents) and feel guilty that they are part of it. so there is an incentive to evade directly dealing with uncomfortable questions of class. this accounts for the dissonance i think.
― treeship., Monday, 13 February 2023 13:26 (one year ago) link
Not sure I understand how that is supposed to square the circle but OK I guess.
My final question is the extent to which the New York Times is actually influencing anything or anyone. That is, how many minds are getting changed because people type things and the NYT prints them or "prints" them?
I am skeptical. I don't think there are very many people being swayed to or from their preexisting attitudes because of something appearing in legacy print media. Maybe I'm wrong about this. As noted, I have been in the bubble since birth (child of journalists, journalism major, former journalist, etc.). But I have cultivated a humility about the influence of the field because I have been awake for the last quarter-century and see that it's only a tiny minority of weirdos who read anything any more, let alone something so dinosaurian as a printed newspaper.
Me? I have been read the Washington Post and New York Times all my life, but (a) I know I am an outlier and (b) Doing so hasn't put very many ideas in my head that weren't already there.
People who read, like, and believe newspapers do so because newspapers reflect a worldview they already hold, and which they probably inherited from their parents.
People who ignore, hate, and disparage newspapers do so because that course of actions reflects a worldview they already hold, and which they probably inherited from their parents.
― Auf Der Martini (Ye Mad Puffin), Monday, 13 February 2023 13:52 (one year ago) link
What are you going on about?
― rob, Monday, 13 February 2023 13:54 (one year ago) link
so has the NYT always been center right? or did it execute a turnabout a few years ago? surely it was seen as much worse than center-right by the counter culture left in the late 1960s…
― veronica moser, Monday, 13 February 2023 15:30 (one year ago) link
one difference from 10 years ago is that is not teetering on the edge of financial collapse: it is now a totemic product that the members of bourgie center left (such as me) use to signal their allegiance, their class, etc etc…and is calling it "center right" as a pejorative an ILX thing or is it widespread throughout the left internet?
― veronica moser, Monday, 13 February 2023 15:35 (one year ago) link
I'm pretty sure the Times came in for a kicking in Chomsky and Herman's Manufacturing Consent, which I read 30 years ago. And it definitely features prominently in Eric Alterman's What Liberal Media?, which came out in 2003. Calling it a "liberal" paper basically amounts to the broader public adopting a Nixon-era attack line.
― but also fuck you (unperson), Monday, 13 February 2023 16:29 (one year ago) link
Oh, it's just a viral marketing campaign
https://twitter.com/KimStimFilms/status/1625183907833430033
― عباس کیارستمی (Eric H.), Monday, 13 February 2023 17:34 (one year ago) link
Shocking but this Yale prof says the quite part out loud suggesting mass suicide for old folks in Japan! This is the premise of Chie Hayakawa's moving, & unforgettable PLAN 75- a Cannes winner is set in a chilling, sci-fi tinged near future. Opens Spring!https://t.co/022TIc8heF— KimStim (@KimStimFilms) February 13, 2023
― عباس کیارستمی (Eric H.), Monday, 13 February 2023 17:35 (one year ago) link
The glasses are bothering me tbh
― Auf Der Martini (Ye Mad Puffin), Monday, 13 February 2023 17:46 (one year ago) link
Yeah sorry, you can’t Gramsci your way out of this one, treeship— by any objective measure, the Times has been a center-right paper for my entire life, at least, and I am nearing 40. unperson otm.
― Goose Bigelow, Fowl Gigolo (the table is the table), Monday, 13 February 2023 19:21 (one year ago) link
letters section: 3 academics saying the lab leak article was bullshit, balanced with 1 guy in Arizona who agrees with it. https://www.nytimes.com/2024/06/13/opinion/covid-origins-lab-market.html
― master of the pan (abanana), Thursday, 13 June 2024 21:46 (four months ago) link
Pamela Paul's latest, about why protests aren't for her, reads like Jean Teasdale.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/06/20/opinion/protests.html
― jaymc, Thursday, 20 June 2024 23:58 (four months ago) link
I refuse to believe Pamela Paul is real.
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Friday, 21 June 2024 11:46 (four months ago) link
It’s weird that people want to protest when they could just publish their random thoughts in the New York Times.
― A So-Called Pulitzer price winner (President Keyes), Friday, 21 June 2024 12:14 (four months ago) link
https://i.imgur.com/QoZViuo.jpeg
― mookieproof, Monday, 8 July 2024 22:31 (three months ago) link
everyone points this out and the just keep doing it
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Monday, 8 July 2024 23:44 (three months ago) link
Pamela Paul
Why Is the U.S. Still Pretending We Know Gender-Affirming Care Works?
no clicks for transphobes
― rob, Friday, 12 July 2024 17:53 (three months ago) link
A question a child might ask...
― A So-Called Pulitzer price winner (President Keyes), Friday, 12 July 2024 18:02 (three months ago) link
Why do transphobes think "I'm extremely concerned about the epistemological questions regarding this one single issue and this one single issue only. Btw no amount of social research or medical evidence will assuage me" is persuasive
(sincere apologies to Pam P if she also has deep concerns about the epistemology of vaccine science)
― rob, Friday, 12 July 2024 18:20 (three months ago) link
Pamela Paul can eat shit and did
― butt dumb tight my boners got boners (the table is the table), Friday, 12 July 2024 18:33 (three months ago) link
and die
You may have been right the first time too
― omar little, Friday, 12 July 2024 18:37 (three months ago) link
lol amazing typo thanking u tabes
― rob, Friday, 12 July 2024 18:40 (three months ago) link
Yea we can (and do)
― A So-Called Pulitzer price winner (President Keyes), Friday, 12 July 2024 18:41 (three months ago) link
Usha Vance and the Iconography of the Trump Women
The potential second lady models a new kind of Republican image-making, our fashion critic writes.
3 min read
― rob, Thursday, 18 July 2024 14:43 (three months ago) link
barf
― budo jeru, Thursday, 18 July 2024 14:47 (three months ago) link
The Evolution of Usha Vance
An accomplished Yale-educated lawyer, she has left her job at a top firm as she adjusts to the life of a high-profile political spouse.
10 min read
jfc *another* front-page puff piece
― rob, Friday, 26 July 2024 13:51 (three months ago) link
JD Got Us Fallin' in Love
― Jersey Devil Vance (President Keyes), Friday, 26 July 2024 13:54 (three months ago) link
how many op-eds about how democrats are anti-Semitic for not picking josh shapiro do we need
― master of the pan (abanana), Saturday, 17 August 2024 19:23 (two months ago) link
https://i.imgur.com/heaFFuQ.png
― budo jeru, Monday, 19 August 2024 15:25 (two months ago) link
she's running against famous policy wonk donald trump. but what are here policies???? hmm i'm stumped, i can't think of a single one
^ emma v taking this headline down on the majority report right now
― budo jeru, Monday, 19 August 2024 17:48 (two months ago) link
― sarahell, Monday, 26 August 2024 15:46 (two months ago) link
Rich LOLwry has a column today.
― the talented mr pimply (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 26 August 2024 15:49 (two months ago) link
Trump Can Win on Character
readying self to be intellectually challenged
― There’s a Monster in my Vance (President Keyes), Monday, 26 August 2024 15:59 (two months ago) link
i think they are taking pitchbot literally
― that's not my post, Monday, 26 August 2024 16:53 (two months ago) link
tbf the article makes clear that it means "Trump Can Win on (attacking Harris's) Character"
― budo jeru, Tuesday, 27 August 2024 16:49 (two months ago) link
it is still profoundly stupid and not worth reading
― budo jeru, Tuesday, 27 August 2024 16:50 (two months ago) link
Today Pamela Paul wrote her column in the voice of RFK's brain worm.
― There’s a Monster in my Vance (President Keyes), Tuesday, 27 August 2024 16:52 (two months ago) link
accurate
― master of the pan (abanana), Tuesday, 27 August 2024 16:54 (two months ago) link
they've achieved a new level of deranged here:
Harris and Trump Have Housing Plans. Economists Have Doubts.The two presidential nominees are talking about their approaches for solving America’s affordability crisis. But would their plans work?Harris: Expand Supply Using Tax Credits.Harris: A $25,000 Boost for First-Time Buyers.Trump: Deport Immigrants.
The two presidential nominees are talking about their approaches for solving America’s affordability crisis. But would their plans work?
Harris: Expand Supply Using Tax Credits.
Harris: A $25,000 Boost for First-Time Buyers.
Trump: Deport Immigrants.
― rob, Friday, 30 August 2024 14:49 (two months ago) link
https://i.imgur.com/GoeAmSx.pngnot clicking on those tbh
― master of the pan (abanana), Wednesday, 4 September 2024 17:26 (two months ago) link
the Brooks is tepid slash fiction
― the talented mr pimply (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 4 September 2024 17:28 (two months ago) link
Isn’t everything Brooks writes tepid slash fiction tho? </trench>
― sarahell, Wednesday, 4 September 2024 17:30 (two months ago) link
Biden Hopes for ‘Path to Peace,’ but Hamas Is Defiant
― rob, Friday, 18 October 2024 13:57 (two weeks ago) link
i’m sure the next assassination of a Hamas leader will be the foundation stone for peace, or if not, the one after that
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Friday, 18 October 2024 18:11 (two weeks ago) link
Here Is the Missing Context in Ta-Nehisi Coates’s ‘The Message’
barely worth posting tbh
― rob, Thursday, 24 October 2024 15:33 (two weeks ago) link
The insidious theory of settler colonialism
― Raising Azure Asia (President Keyes), Thursday, 24 October 2024 19:08 (two weeks ago) link
Thomas L. Friedman
Arab and Jewish Voters Both Need Kamala Harris
Arab and Muslim Americans with friends and family in Gaza or Lebanon or the West Bank worry every day about loved ones being killed or wounded with U.S.-made weapons that were transferred to Israel. Jewish Americans have had to worry every day about their kids being exposed to left-wing anti-Zionism on U.S. college campuses.
If I didn't know any better I'd ponder whether this column was artful satire
― rob, Thursday, 24 October 2024 20:19 (two weeks ago) link
which is worse--the genocide or the person saying the genocide is bad?
― Raising Azure Asia (President Keyes), Thursday, 24 October 2024 20:27 (two weeks ago) link
wow
― budo jeru, Thursday, 24 October 2024 20:45 (two weeks ago) link
You might live in terror of a relative being murdered in the latest school bombing, but the rest of us have to hear about it which I think you’ll agree is equally burdensome. Anyway vote Harris
― the homeliness of the soi-disant stunner (wins), Thursday, 24 October 2024 21:12 (two weeks ago) link
In Shift From 2020, Identity Politics Loses Its Grip on the Country
6 min read
interesting to learn the nyt doesn't know what "identity" or "politics" mean
― rob, Saturday, 2 November 2024 13:54 (five days ago) link
The four experts cited in this piece are Yascha Mounk (fired from The Atlantic in the past year over rape allegations), Rahm Emanuel, Lis Smith, and the head of Democratic Majority for Israel pic.twitter.com/1XyE1yWrf5— David Klion (@DavidKlion) November 2, 2024
― Raising Azure Asia (President Keyes), Saturday, 2 November 2024 15:59 (five days ago) link
Maggie Astor thread on the Tech Guild strike: https://bsky.app/profile/maggieastor.bsky.social/post/3la4qfb7vfr2q
Main takeaway wrt picket line:
NYT Games and Cooking are BEHIND THE PICKET LINE. Please don’t play or engage with Games or Cooking content while the strike lasts!News coverage — including election coverage — is NOT behind the picket line. It’s okay to read and share that, though the site and app may very well have problems.
News coverage — including election coverage — is NOT behind the picket line. It’s okay to read and share that, though the site and app may very well have problems.
― rob, Monday, 4 November 2024 14:04 (three days ago) link
These Uncommitted Voters Finally Made Their Choice for PresidentOver the last four months, these voters have struggled with their decision. Now, with time short, they explain who’s getting, or not getting, their vote.
― mookieproof, Tuesday, 5 November 2024 04:52 (two days ago) link
on the eve of the campaign we detail the inner workings of the dumbest people alive
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, 5 November 2024 11:26 (two days ago) link
don't worry, i took a glance at that article and you will all be relieved to know that at least one of them is STILL undecided, gonna wait to see what their gut tells them in the voting booth
making a decision any earlier than that seems irresponsible tbrr
― Lavator Shemmelpennick, Tuesday, 5 November 2024 15:09 (two days ago) link
on the night before the world series it’s important to hear from six people who have never seen a baseball game
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, 5 November 2024 18:39 (two days ago) link
well, if they're going to play left field maybe
― Grape Fired At Czar From Crack Battery (President Keyes), Tuesday, 5 November 2024 18:54 (two days ago) link