Patriot on Amazon Prime: Let me Walk You Through Our Donnely Nut Spacing

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5-9Rfrui9A

This is also for other work by showrunner Steven Conrad, specifically Perpetual Grace LTD
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Conrad

Can anyone rep for his films?

G.A.G.S. (Gophers Against Getting Stuffed) (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 14:30 (one year ago) link

i'm here for this, though i think it's funny to have a new thread for a show that got canceled three years ago

i put epix on my tv to try perpetual grace and then never got around to it

na (NA), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 14:45 (one year ago) link

i watched patriot a couple of years ago and loved it. i've been meaning to do a rewatch but i'm not very good at rewatching shows. i've been considering forcing my wife to watch it so i can get a rewatch in.

i kind of love that he cast his brother in a major role in the show. it kept freaking me out how much chris conrad looked like christopher reeve.

na (NA), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 14:47 (one year ago) link

part of what resonated so much with me is John Tavner is, for me (and I guess informed by my own life), the most realistic portrayal of depression as it is experienced...not a dramatic, theatrical thing but just slogging through, jaw set, mechanically going through the requirements of your job and life in this grey cloud in a sort of disconnected, 1000 yard stare way

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 14:56 (one year ago) link

he's also the first "television badass" i've seen that is genuinely haunted by his actions in a meaningful way. he's a terrible person doing horrible things, often to people who don't deserve it and he knows it.

G.A.G.S. (Gophers Against Getting Stuffed) (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:05 (one year ago) link

definitely, the mental cost is there that never is usually, i guess the sopranos deals with that in a different context

the father/son dynamics wrt to that are super deep and fucked up too

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:27 (one year ago) link

I enjoyed the pilot but, a bit like Fargo, I found the violence & direction a little glib and distancing - maybe that's the point, though? I guess my question is - is this the kind of show that needs you to watch a few episodes to settle into it, or is the pilot a good indicator of where it goes for the rest of the show?

I would be content with a decent Terry O'Quinn delivery vehicle, though, which it seemed to be.

Chuck_Tatum, Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:32 (one year ago) link

also possibly the first tv badass whose main motivation for carrying out his job is guilt induced by his father xxp

karl...arlk...rlka...lkar..., Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:34 (one year ago) link

It clicked for me after the first and got me really hooked by the second but I feel like it could take three episodes to get past "grim and gritty white guy drama" fatigue if your expectations have been constructed a certain way already? It is anything but predictable and distancing once you get to it, I can promise you that. It got me weepy in a couple of moments.

G.A.G.S. (Gophers Against Getting Stuffed) (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:35 (one year ago) link

I'm 4 episodes in and the idea of carrying on is fucking stressing me out, it's that good.

Motoroller Scampotron (WmC), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:37 (one year ago) link

Damn, wish this thread had existed sooner, lots of good posts about it sprinkled across a half dozen other threads.

Stefan Twerkelle (Old Lunch), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:38 (one year ago) link

i wouldn't compare it to fargo. i don't see the violence as glib, i think it's perfunctory in that it reflects john tavner going through the motions with little regard for the overall purpose or his own well-being

karl...arlk...rlka...lkar..., Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:39 (one year ago) link

the utterly unique and fairly brilliant dynamic in my mind is the mirrored setup between:
1) an emotionally (and by proxy physically) abusive user of a father who clearly loves his sons but is willing to chew them up if he has to / deeply damaged, easily manipulated, well-meaning men who eat their own souls trying to please an unpleaseable master
2) country / patriot

G.A.G.S. (Gophers Against Getting Stuffed) (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:39 (one year ago) link

It also has one of the more indelibly brilliant, if unknowable female leads on television.
Rochambeau?

G.A.G.S. (Gophers Against Getting Stuffed) (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:40 (one year ago) link

Damnit I only just started getting back into the Expanse, I might have to give this a go now

Chuck_Tatum, Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:43 (one year ago) link

The other other other thing it does amazingly is capture the existential despair of office life in a humorous way but still anxiety provoking.
I would say that anyone watching this owes it to themselves to at least watch until you get to the Leslie backstory episode; how they fill that character in is amazing.

G.A.G.S. (Gophers Against Getting Stuffed) (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:45 (one year ago) link

BTW! the guy who plays dorky Dennis is the showrunner's brother and one gets the distinct sense looking at their bios that the Tavner family dynamic is drawn from their lived experience.

G.A.G.S. (Gophers Against Getting Stuffed) (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:46 (one year ago) link

aaaaaand i see NA covered that upthread, my bad

G.A.G.S. (Gophers Against Getting Stuffed) (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:47 (one year ago) link

kurtwood smith is amazing in this show. it's crazy he's not in more stuff.

na (NA), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:48 (one year ago) link

the most stress i felt watching the show was related to john having to fulfill his office duties, not his "real" duties. it felt a lot like those dreams of being back in college but totally unfamiliar with the course material and the final exam is that afternoon

karl...arlk...rlka...lkar..., Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:48 (one year ago) link

i guess he acts regularly but he should get more leading roles in good shows/movies
xpost

na (NA), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:49 (one year ago) link

the show is pretty stressful, given that the plot is a chain of things going successively wronger and wronger

na (NA), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:50 (one year ago) link

#jellyfish, only true patriot heads know

karl...arlk...rlka...lkar..., Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:53 (one year ago) link

the most stress i felt watching the show was related to john having to fulfill his office duties, not his "real" duties. it felt a lot like those dreams of being back in college but totally unfamiliar with the course material and the final exam is that afternoon


lol yes, in fact just had one of those dreams (about actual college, even) last night

Stefan Twerkelle (Old Lunch), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:54 (one year ago) link

the "pin fastened pam flats" schtick suggests that john is missing some integral part of understanding his world and is masquerading his way through by hurting everyone around him... which he is! but i know that's a fear that pops up in my mind regularly and i guess it's pretty common. the show captures it well.

G.A.G.S. (Gophers Against Getting Stuffed) (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:54 (one year ago) link

I think I made this thread to force me to go watch season 2. General consensus seems to be that it's not as good as the heights of 1 but still consistently strong?

G.A.G.S. (Gophers Against Getting Stuffed) (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:55 (one year ago) link

that alienation one feels at a team meeting in which everyone seems to understand some hot new corporate catchphrase or acronym except you xp

karl...arlk...rlka...lkar..., Wednesday, 17 March 2021 15:57 (one year ago) link

I was today years old when i found out that Michale Dorman aka the lead in Patriot is also the lead in the apple tv show "For All Mankind" which is created by Battlestar Galactica's Ronald D Moore, so maybe I will watch that.

G.A.G.S. (Gophers Against Getting Stuffed) (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 16:02 (one year ago) link

Yes, forks, season two both is very good and expands upon themes that you seem to appreciate (the abusive father narrative becomes even more foregrounded). Watch!

Stefan Twerkelle (Old Lunch), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 16:05 (one year ago) link

Cool.

G.A.G.S. (Gophers Against Getting Stuffed) (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 16:11 (one year ago) link

imo s2 was a slight step down but just bc s1 is so perfect. s2 also felt sadder than s1.

na (NA), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 16:24 (one year ago) link

I'd definitely stick with it through more than the first episode. one thing i love about it is it sets up characters as a stock "type" (kurtwood smith as leslie, chris conrad as dennis) then you start to learn more layers to them as they open up

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 16:49 (one year ago) link

Leslie has a podcast concerning his Structural Dynamics of Flow book: https://www.lgclaret.com/podcast

"Think back to the last time you ram-chawed a partial chim set. Standard, right? We've been ram-chawing chims since the aqueducts of Ancient Rome, hey. But what if I told you that's the basis for the empire's collapse?

Hello, I'm Leslie Claret. I'd like to invite you to join countless others who have come to rely on the lessons and explorations of my book to form a deeper understanding of our shared world, with relative specificity to the field application of surface and suppressed surface delivery engineering."

SA, Wednesday, 17 March 2021 17:45 (one year ago) link

oh wow

na (NA), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 17:48 (one year ago) link

holy shit

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 17:48 (one year ago) link

Four hours of this stuff! And the last one came out this week!

G.A.G.S. (Gophers Against Getting Stuffed) (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 18:02 (one year ago) link

It's like listening to a guided meditation podcast or something. Soothing.

SA, Wednesday, 17 March 2021 18:10 (one year ago) link

My attempt to sell it in 280 characters or less:

I am some years late to this but PATRIOT is a phenomenal TV series, just a perfect bleak comedy about depression and murder and family and love and the baroque incompetence of the American intelligence services. Brilliantly written, directed and acted. Amazing stuff. pic.twitter.com/OU85VS0XPy

— Caustic Cover Critic 📚 (@Unwise_Trousers) March 17, 2021

Just finished series 1 yesterday. Amazing show.

Tsar Bombadil (James Morrison), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 22:23 (one year ago) link

one thing i love about it is it sets up characters as a stock "type" (kurtwood smith as leslie, chris conrad as dennis) then you start to learn more layers to them as they open up


On the face of it it's such a 'duh' narrative trope (like of course people are more complex than what our initial, surface-level engagement might suggest) but it's so generally underutilized that it really knocks me out every time I see it done well.

Clem McFlannery's Clam Phlegm Cannery (Old Lunch), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 23:01 (one year ago) link

I don't know if I've come across a straight answer on this one, but: is all of the piping jargon complete bullshit?

Clem McFlannery's Clam Phlegm Cannery (Old Lunch), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 23:03 (one year ago) link

Yes.

G.A.G.S. (Gophers Against Getting Stuffed) (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 23:05 (one year ago) link

(there's even a few specific fake phrases being lifted from the retro/turbo encabulator for Leslie's jargon)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkH20fNavoI

G.A.G.S. (Gophers Against Getting Stuffed) (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 17 March 2021 23:12 (one year ago) link

It's like the creators wanted this to be a cult show. Or maybe they realized it would work best as a cult show? We found the trailer pretty off putting and didn't get around to watching the show for months as a result. Bad trailer and a forgettable, hard to search show name and an unknown cast isn't a great recipe for popularity. But the cult is growing as well it should.

that's not my post, Thursday, 18 March 2021 05:26 (one year ago) link

The dead seriousness with which they spout off the fake piping jargon sales pitches is just brilliant. And the regretful tone of the interwoven interviews from the government investigation after everything goes jellyfish, that's top notch.

that's not my post, Thursday, 18 March 2021 05:32 (one year ago) link

And did we talk about Lakeman's songs?

that's not my post, Thursday, 18 March 2021 05:33 (one year ago) link

The song as he attempts to steal the gun from the poor Senegalese guy, that whole one-shot sequence; just brilliant.

Tsar Bombadil (James Morrison), Thursday, 18 March 2021 11:05 (one year ago) link

Just starting S2 and this is great but there is way too much peeing, also - and this is really grouchy - but the artful, check-my-record-collection track choices are jarring, I feel like they're unconnected from the story most times.

Maresn3st, Friday, 19 March 2021 22:20 (one year ago) link

Some very goofy moments in season 2. But it stays pretty cool.

maf you one two (maffew12), Friday, 19 March 2021 22:42 (one year ago) link

Thereis a hilarious peeing scene in ins2ep4

Tsar Bombadil (James Morrison), Saturday, 20 March 2021 00:24 (one year ago) link

Just finished S1 and I feel like I should just curl up for a while before going on.

Motoroller Scampotron (WmC), Saturday, 20 March 2021 00:47 (one year ago) link

heh

G.A.G.S. (Gophers Against Getting Stuffed) (forksclovetofu), Saturday, 20 March 2021 02:07 (one year ago) link

two weeks pass...

So what do we think about the fact that pretty much everything about Europe in this is bullshit?

I first noticed this when my wife, who is French, went "wtf is a rochambeau" and after googling I discovered only americans call it that. Was also surprised to hear Luxemburg has a sizable Brazilian immigrant population and a friend dug up an article from a LX paper that revealed that a) no, it doesn't and b) pretty much everything the show says about the city is bullshit, also it was filmed in Prague and takes no care whatsoever to conceal this. From thereon I started to get skeptical towards everything and while I haven't researched everything, come on, how likely is it that this procedure for supermarket owners to get guns isn't bullshit?

I'm not saying all of this as a criticism, per se - it works nicely for a show that is about deception, and dovetails with the idea of US agents in over their heads because they don't actually understand any other cultures. Gotta say that when they got to the Romani boy that was kind of crossing a line for me, tho - fine to make up immigration demographics or laws but I'd rather they didn't play into some pretty prevailing and harmful stereotypes. And in the first encounter you could always just assume they're mistaken, but second time confirmed it was very much a thing?

Daniel_Rf, Friday, 9 April 2021 09:56 (one year ago) link

I want to believe Luxembourg's management of evidence is a game of hot potato and everyone walks around going "c'est cool."

maf you one two (maffew12), Friday, 9 April 2021 11:00 (one year ago) link

Haha, fwiw "cool" is a frequently used word amongst French speakers.

Also willing to believe there's a folk tent in Boom, of course there'd fucking be.

Daniel_Rf, Friday, 9 April 2021 11:07 (one year ago) link

While the show addresses real human issues and relationships, it essentially does so through a prism of pure fantasy. I mean, if you approach pretty much any aspect of the show from a 'hey, that's not what ____ is like in real life!' POV, it's never gonna pass muster.

You Can't Have the Woogie Without a Little Boogie (Old Lunch), Friday, 9 April 2021 11:11 (one year ago) link

This show was already pretty dang funny, and if i was a Luxembourgian process engineer I'd probably think it was the most hysterical thing that ever happened.

maf you one two (maffew12), Friday, 9 April 2021 11:12 (one year ago) link

It wouldn't surprise me to learn that they did zero research on the CIA before making this show. And that's okay, and here's why.

You Can't Have the Woogie Without a Little Boogie (Old Lunch), Friday, 9 April 2021 11:46 (one year ago) link

While the show addresses real human issues and relationships, it essentially does so through a prism of pure fantasy.

I dunno, the CIA financing candidates in Iran, a cop getting acquitted for killing a poc kid, the US reality seems to check out.

Daniel_Rf, Friday, 9 April 2021 11:47 (one year ago) link

Would be very happy to hear that all the Milwaukee scenes prominently feature landmarks from, like, Delaware or somewhere tho.

Daniel_Rf, Friday, 9 April 2021 11:54 (one year ago) link

Turns out it was filmed in Chicago. lol

You Can't Have the Woogie Without a Little Boogie (Old Lunch), Friday, 9 April 2021 11:59 (one year ago) link

also it was filmed in Prague and takes no care whatsoever to conceal this

Yeah this got to me too, initially it was "hey Luxembourg has a bridge that looks like Prague, who knew" but then "why are all the signs in the background in Czech". There's something lazy and sloppy about the show - the almost-but-not-quite Wes Anderson shots, too many characters and pointless coincidences in S2, for all her screen time and impressive hair Agathe isn't really anything - but the intense sadness of it all has kind of stuck with me and I mutter "pretty good" to myself when I'm having a rough day.

Bignefs Proportionable (seandalai), Saturday, 10 April 2021 17:45 (one year ago) link

one month passes...

new episode of Leslie's podcast went up over the weekend
https://www.lgclaret.com/podcast/episode/1feaf73a/episode-five-leslie-the-snowman-a-prison-escape-story

Draymond is "Mr Dumpy" (forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 11 May 2021 18:19 (one year ago) link

Can't believe they're still making that podcast lol

I watched both seasons recently and enjoyed them but season 2 felt off a bit. A little bit short on ideas and the dialogue was sometimes lazy. Still some great moments there though. My favorite scenes are every time Leslie talks to John in S1. There's such a palpable disgust from Leslie, I start laughing before he even says anything

Vinnie, Wednesday, 12 May 2021 00:38 (one year ago) link

i liked the whole structural dynamics of flow thing going on, the show’s macguffin being about the intrinsic difficult of getting something from a to b (the cash) and the fact that the piping designed to deliver it (the people, the plans, the social relations, the sadness, the loss, the places) creates entire complex (non a-b) situations of strange events and behaviour in “normal” contexts.

Fizzles, Wednesday, 12 May 2021 06:42 (one year ago) link

seven months pass...

would you believe they're STILL making that podcast?
https://www.lgclaret.com/podcast/episode/37e0a001/episode-six-the-caracas-blackouts

When Young Sheldon began to rap (forksclovetofu), Monday, 13 December 2021 16:02 (one year ago) link

hahahaha awesome

Daniel_Rf, Monday, 13 December 2021 16:30 (one year ago) link

Started watching the show this week, inspired by the revive (I'd never heard of it) - thank you ILE!

willem, Tuesday, 14 December 2021 15:32 (one year ago) link

nine months pass...

Four episodes in and loving this. Michael Dorman may have the most amazing face since yesterday’s birthday boy Buster Keaton.

Rated “Blecchs” (James Redd and the Blecchs), Thursday, 6 October 2022 00:27 (three months ago) link

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D4OK83DW4AYVEie.jpg

Think about 'Afternoon Spray' a lot. I really should rewatch this.

Beautiful Bean Footage Fetishist (Old Lunch), Thursday, 6 October 2022 04:09 (three months ago) link

Still need to tell my story about the other guy there.

We Have Never Been Secondary Modern (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 14 October 2022 23:34 (three months ago) link

Getting towards the end of S1. The ladies just shared a rental car from the airport. It’s kind of amazing to me how despite the quirkiness it’s really well plotted and paced so that I am pretty much constantly on the edge of my seat. Now Leslie is making his speech about the sun and the planets.

We Have Never Been Secondary Modern (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 14 October 2022 23:39 (three months ago) link

Man, Leslie is as misanthropic as a Jim Thompson sheriff.

We Have Never Been Secondary Modern (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 14 October 2022 23:44 (three months ago) link

It also has one of the more indelibly brilliant, if unknowable female leads on television.
Rochambeau?

OTM. It’s incredible how evenly matched they are, he and she, as seen in their epic rochambeau throwdown and then the subsequent interview.

We Have Never Been Secondary Modern (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 15 October 2022 00:14 (three months ago) link

I know how you feel. You’re just human. “Hello, club member.”

We Have Never Been Secondary Modern (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 15 October 2022 00:56 (three months ago) link

TS glass blower vs. puppeteer

We Have Never Been Secondary Modern (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 15 October 2022 01:03 (three months ago) link

On to Season Two.

We Have Never Been Secondary Modern (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 15 October 2022 18:59 (three months ago) link

And now on the far side of The Vantasner Danger Meridian.

We Have Never Been Secondary Modern (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 15 October 2022 19:53 (three months ago) link

Re the beef with greg12: the original lyrics of "Pancho and Lefty" say "only let him hang around" in the first chorus and later on it's "go so wrong" instead of "go so long" is that it? It's not just Willie and Merle though, also Emmylou Harris which is maybe who they heard it from iirc.

We Have Never Been Secondary Modern (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 18 October 2022 13:30 (three months ago) link

two weeks pass...

Not sure what I can watch next that can measure up to this.

(We're Not) The Experimental Jet Set (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 6 November 2022 00:06 (two months ago) link

three weeks pass...
one month passes...

pretty good show

buzza, Wednesday, 11 January 2023 09:12 (three weeks ago) link

Double good imo

Beautiful Bean Footage Fetishist (Old Lunch), Wednesday, 11 January 2023 10:43 (three weeks ago) link

I'm three episodes into this show and enjoying it a lot. It has a weird admixture of vibes - my friend described it to me as "Wes Anderson does James Bond" which put me off it for a while. It has higher stakes for me than any Wes Anderson movie, though I can see where he gets that vibe. The opening in S1 E3 detailing Leslie's backstory is such a punch. I feel like things are converging toward an epic fuckup.

Unfairport Convention (PBKR), Tuesday, 17 January 2023 15:57 (two weeks ago) link

Epic fuck ups incoming. Such a great show. One by one we’ll get everyone to see it.

that's not my post, Tuesday, 17 January 2023 16:25 (two weeks ago) link

your friend isn't wrong necessarily but i would sidestep wes anderson in favor of maybe like The Daniels

POLIZISTEN VERSINKEN IM SCHLAMM (forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 17 January 2023 16:25 (two weeks ago) link

(and yes, "epic fuckup" is actually underselling what's coming)

POLIZISTEN VERSINKEN IM SCHLAMM (forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 17 January 2023 16:25 (two weeks ago) link

There's a lot about this show that I love and am impressed by but, as time goes by, I think I'm most impressed by how much it coasts on pure chutzpah. Like they give zero fucks about how anything (CIA operations, industrial piping, international criminal investigations, etc.) actually works in real life. They whipped up total nonsense that sounded good and committed to it 100%. It's all just window dressing for the real themes of the show anyway so why not.

Beautiful Bean Footage Fetishist (Old Lunch), Tuesday, 17 January 2023 16:56 (two weeks ago) link

The conference talk might be my favorite scene from any show ever

Cinta Kaz is comin' to town (Sufjan Grafton), Wednesday, 25 January 2023 02:33 (one week ago) link


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