"The August 2020 US Politics Thread is highly thought of, but nobody likes me. It can only be my personality. That's all."

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It is sort of curious.

Irritable Baal (WmC), Saturday, 1 August 2020 15:00 (one week ago) link

A senior Department of Homeland Security official whose office compiled “intelligence reports” about journalists and protesters in Portland, Ore., has been removed from his job, according to three people familiar with the matter.

Brian Murphy, the acting undersecretary for intelligence and analysis, was reassigned to a new position elsewhere in the department, the people said, speaking on condition of anonymity to discuss a personnel matter.

Murphy’s removal follows revelations in The Washington Post that the Intelligence & Analysis Office (I & A) at DHS compiled Open Source Intelligence Reports about the work of two journalists who had published leaked department documents. In a separate intelligence report, the office also analyzed the communications of protesters in Portland.

The acting secretary of homeland security, Chad Wolf, ordered I & A to stop collecting information on journalists after The Post article was published on Thursday.

"You're going to have to take the fall for this, Brian, but I want you to know you've done great work and your country thanks you."

Irritable Baal (WmC), Saturday, 1 August 2020 15:12 (one week ago) link

"they don't call me Chad Lamb, y'know"

XVI Pedicabo eam (Neanderthal), Saturday, 1 August 2020 15:28 (one week ago) link

he’s been reassigned to the kidnapping department, which was his true calling anyway

mozzy star (voodoo chili), Saturday, 1 August 2020 15:37 (one week ago) link

Good morning!

TikTok to the (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Saturday, 1 August 2020 15:49 (one week ago) link

The US now joins the ranks of Iran, Fiji, and Australia in charging a fee. In the US, asylum-seekers will be charged $50 on asylum applications starting in October.

singular wolf erotica producer (Hadrian VIII), Saturday, 1 August 2020 18:10 (one week ago) link

$50 Asylum for August Thread Title.

"...And the Gods Socially Distanced" (C. Grisso/McCain), Saturday, 1 August 2020 18:57 (one week ago) link

the tiktok thing seems like it's going to end up like that time he tried to ban vaping while obviously not knowing what it was, and that it was incredibly popular.

𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Saturday, 1 August 2020 20:00 (one week ago) link

ha yeah could be! annoyingly it is also one of those times where he inadvertently raises a complicated issue that is worth paying attention to (data sovereignty & the nat sec implications of tech infrastructure geography) but does so like a cartoon fascist

rob, Saturday, 1 August 2020 20:03 (one week ago) link

He's gonna accidentally ban Ke$ha.

"...And the Gods Socially Distanced" (C. Grisso/McCain), Saturday, 1 August 2020 20:03 (one week ago) link

shame he doesn't have Guru to warn him against banning lemonade

XVI Pedicabo eam (Neanderthal), Saturday, 1 August 2020 20:05 (one week ago) link

Monetary policy is complicated! Converting back to the gold standard would have a ripple effect not only on Ke$ha, but also on 50 Cent, who might have to change his name to 47.9 Cent.

pizzagnostic (Ye Mad Puffin), Saturday, 1 August 2020 20:08 (one week ago) link

annoyingly it is also one of those times where he inadvertently raises a complicated issue that is worth paying attention to (data sovereignty & the nat sec implications of tech infrastructure geography) but does so like a cartoon fascist

Said this to someone earlier - TikTok is almost uniquely predatory in terms of the amount and breadth of data it harvests from its users, so it is definitely a Bad Thing that should be destroyed, but that doesn't mean that this dumb fuck a) knows that b) is shitting out this particular combination of words for that reason. Plus, he's gonna be distracted by something else and forget all about this anyway (or be told that he can't actually do it). So whatever.

but also fuck you (unperson), Saturday, 1 August 2020 20:24 (one week ago) link

Exactly. Wait until he hears about Amazon Web Services lol

rob, Saturday, 1 August 2020 20:29 (one week ago) link

i don't see why it should be banned when selling to microsoft is an option, other than friend of the administration mark zuckerburg does not wish it so.

𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Saturday, 1 August 2020 20:46 (one week ago) link

"Trump has had a sometimes-contentious relationship with journalists"

lol

True inasmuch as, however much he treats them like shit, he'd literally shrivel up and die if the media ever stopped hungrily gleaming his cube.

Why does this relates to Yoda? (Old Lunch), Sunday, 2 August 2020 16:38 (one week ago) link

the media created him in the '80s

brooklyn suicide cult (Dr Morbius), Sunday, 2 August 2020 17:01 (one week ago) link

out of mud and vonnegut's universal symbol for asshole

Fuck the NRA (ulysses), Sunday, 2 August 2020 17:02 (one week ago) link

If Trump is nominated and no one is there to hear it, does it make a sound?

Josh in Chicago, Sunday, 2 August 2020 18:31 (one week ago) link

Perhaps Donald Trump doesn’t like the Postal Service because it delivers.

— Dan Rather (@DanRather) August 2, 2020

TikTok to the (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Sunday, 2 August 2020 22:39 (one week ago) link

that's the frequency

Fuck the NRA (ulysses), Sunday, 2 August 2020 23:35 (one week ago) link

my man

Li'l Brexit (Tracer Hand), Monday, 3 August 2020 08:55 (one week ago) link

https://www.lawyersgunsmoneyblog.com/2020/08/blaming-congress-for-failing-to-pass-a-covid-relief-bill-is-carrying-mitch-mcconnells-water

An accurate report of what’s happening is that a lot of people have just lost a lifeline because Senate Republicans refused to act or even do more than pro forma negotiation. That’s what happened. You don’t have to express your judgment about which side is right, but it’s a serious disservice to your readers to generically blame “Congress.” If a majority of your readers will infer from a straightforward description of what’s going on that Republicans are nihilistic monsters who refused to help suffering people even when it’s in their political self-interest to do so, that’s not your problem.

One of the biggest problems with high-veto-point systems is that they dilute accountability. But that doesn’t mean people whose job is informing the public should make things worse.

sound of scampo talk to me (El Tomboto), Monday, 3 August 2020 15:55 (one week ago) link

https://findsomethingnew.org/
this is a response?

Fuck the NRA (ulysses), Monday, 3 August 2020 16:14 (one week ago) link

Biden gets the crucial Bob Avakian endorsement
https://revcom.us/index.html

Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Monday, 3 August 2020 17:13 (one week ago) link

another deaccelerationist joins the united front

the unappreciated charisma of cows (Aimless), Monday, 3 August 2020 17:24 (one week ago) link

President Trump slams Dr. Birx as “pathetic” for offering public health guidance that went against the official line on Covid. https://t.co/qdz9isCoQ4

— Vivian Salama (@vmsalama) August 3, 2020

brooklyn suicide cult (Dr Morbius), Monday, 3 August 2020 18:28 (one week ago) link

I like the idea of "Dr." being a nickname insult akin to his others. Sleepy Joe! Crazy Nancy! Dr. Brix!

Josh in Chicago, Monday, 3 August 2020 18:30 (one week ago) link

I always read 'Birx' as 'Brix', and I'm not really into The Fall.

"...And the Gods Socially Distanced" (C. Grisso/McCain), Monday, 3 August 2020 18:33 (one week ago) link

Heh, I don't think I've ever noticed it's Birx and not Brix.

Josh in Chicago, Monday, 3 August 2020 18:36 (one week ago) link

wait'll you take a closer look at Senator Berenstain

avellano medio inglés (f. hazel), Monday, 3 August 2020 18:42 (one week ago) link

it bears inspection

Fuck the NRA (ulysses), Monday, 3 August 2020 19:01 (one week ago) link

Dying at Sen. Berenstain, kudos.

Orson Well Yeah (Dan Peterson), Monday, 3 August 2020 19:32 (one week ago) link

ok, it seems clear to me he's calling Pelosi and her criticisms pathetic, not Birx.

akm, Monday, 3 August 2020 20:12 (one week ago) link

So they found a spine at last:

Democrats are warning Republicans not to fill a possible Supreme Court vacancy this year after denying President Barack Obama the chance in 2016, saying it would embolden a push on the left to add seats to the court whenever they regain power.

"We knew basically they were lying in 2016, when they said, 'Oh, we can't do this because it's an election year.' We knew they didn't want to do it because it was President Obama," Sen. Tim Kaine, D-Va., said in an interview.

Kaine, the party's last vice presidential nominee and a lawmaker with a reputation as an institutionalist, said confirming a nominee of President Donald Trump this year could compel Democrats to consider adding seats to the high court.

"If they show that they're unwilling to respect precedent, rules and history, then they can't feign surprise when others talk about using a statutory option that we have that's fully constitutional in our availability," he said. "I don't want to do that. But if they act in such a way, they may push it to an inevitability. So they need to be careful about that."

The draft language, reviewed by NBC News and expected to be approved later this month, denounces Republicans as having "packed our federal courts with unqualified, partisan judges who consistently rule for corporations, the wealthy, and Republican interests" and for "blocking a Democratic president from appointing a justice to the Supreme Court."

Sen. Mazie Hirono, D-Hawaii, said she has been "talking with people who have different ideas about what we can do — including adding to the court, including having certain circuit court judges cycle in and other ideas" like term limits.

"I'm open to those kinds of suggestions," she said.

TikTok to the (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 3 August 2020 20:33 (one week ago) link

47 SCOTUS Justices, 41 of them Democrat.

XVI Pedicabo eam (Neanderthal), Monday, 3 August 2020 20:35 (one week ago) link

a theoretical spine, in the distant future

Give me a Chad Smith-type feel (map), Monday, 3 August 2020 20:35 (one week ago) link

The real point is that it's Tim Goddamn Kaine raising it.

TikTok to the (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 3 August 2020 20:39 (one week ago) link

He don't lie, he don't lie, he don't lie . . . Tim Kaine.

nickn, Monday, 3 August 2020 20:48 (one week ago) link

Kaine, raising?

Doctor Casino, Monday, 3 August 2020 20:48 (one week ago) link

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/republicans-race-to-promote-mail-voting-as-trumps-attacks-discourage-his-own-supporters-from-embracing-the-practice/2020/08/03/9dd1d988-d1d9-11ea-9038-af089b63ac21_story.html

One recent Facebook sponsored post from the Johnston County, N.C., Republican Party exhorted voters not to dismiss a GOP mail piece coming their way: “ATTENTION!!! If you receive an ABSENTEE BALLOT MAILER like shown in this picture, please know that it is legitimate!!!”

“Please don’t confuse North Carolina’s absentee system with other states’ all-mail elections,” read the message from party chairman. “NCGOP and JoCo GOP agrees with the President that our current absentee ballot request system is safe and secure.”

The assurance was met with skepticism from many commenters. “Burned it! I will go in person to vote straight Republican,” wrote one.

𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Monday, 3 August 2020 21:08 (one week ago) link

I'm not sure why they couldn't see that coming from a mile away

shout-out to his family (DJP), Monday, 3 August 2020 21:11 (one week ago) link

He don't lie, he don't lie, he don't lie . . . Tim Kaine.

Straight guffaw from me over here on that one, kudos

Li'l Brexit (Tracer Hand), Monday, 3 August 2020 21:18 (one week ago) link

Same, LOL.

santa clause four (suzy), Monday, 3 August 2020 21:31 (one week ago) link

Hurray for sternly worded letters and all but it's not like Democrats could stop them if the Senate GOP collectively decides that a 6-3 majority for a generation is worth going nuclear.

Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Monday, 3 August 2020 22:31 (one week ago) link

But would Biden and 53 Dem Senators add 4 new judges for a 7-6 majority

Wayne Grotski (symsymsym), Monday, 3 August 2020 22:46 (one week ago) link

lol this guy

"TikTok is not just China’s revenge for the century of humiliation between the Opium Wars and Mao’s revolution. It is the opium — a digital fentanyl, to get our kids stoked for the coming Chinese imperium."

— Niall Ferguson (@nfergus) August 9, 2020

mookieproof, Sunday, 9 August 2020 22:00 (yesterday) link

od'ing on the digital fentanyl that is the first 15 seconds of Lottery

Fuck the NRA (ulysses), Sunday, 9 August 2020 22:53 (yesterday) link

Poor Niall, forced to say crazy bad things just to get noticed on Twitter.

the unappreciated charisma of cows (Aimless), Sunday, 9 August 2020 23:48 (yesterday) link

So if TikTok is digital fentanyl, is twitter honest to goodness old fashioned heroine?

American Fear of Scampos (Ed), Sunday, 9 August 2020 23:58 (yesterday) link

heroin makes you feel good

lukas, Monday, 10 August 2020 00:32 (twenty-one hours ago) link

Finally, some serious action from Speaker Pelosi:

August 9, 2020

Dear Democratic Colleague,

On this Sunday morning as we pray for the American people, I wanted to share “A Responsive Prayer for Justice.”

Pray for those who are hungry.

Pray harder for those who will not feed them.

Pray for those who struggle each week to pay their bills.

Pray harder for the wealthy who do not care.

Pray for those who are homeless.

Pray harder for those who deny them shelter.

Pray for the sick and lonely.

Pray harder for those who will not give them comfort.

Pray for those who cry out for dignity.

Pray harder for those who will not listen.

Pray for those oppressed by unjust wages.

Pray harder for those who exploit them.

Pray for those who bear the yoke of prejudice.

Pray harder for those who discriminate against them.

Pray for those whose basic needs are denied.

Pray harder for the public officials who cater to the greedy and ignore those bound unjustly.

Amen.

best regards, (unsigned)

Steppin' RZA (sic), Monday, 10 August 2020 02:22 (nineteen hours ago) link

Some good-ass legislatin', right there

Why does this relates to Yoda? (Old Lunch), Monday, 10 August 2020 02:55 (nineteen hours ago) link

Finally, some serious action from Speaker Pelosi:

btw, just a reminder that Speaker Pelosi's powers do not extend far enough to pass whatever legislation she or you might consider necessary for the good of the nation. Gestures like this one are something you may have heard about: propaganda designed to strengthen the political basis for taking "serious action".

Or maybe you haven't heard about this kind of political behavior before now.

the unappreciated charisma of cows (Aimless), Monday, 10 August 2020 03:12 (nineteen hours ago) link

I'm familiar with the behaviour of stealing other people's words and pretending that you wrote them, in a completely empty act of ostensible virtue signalling that actually make you look like someone with no appreciation of fairness, sure. (Are... are we going to talk about Shia LeBouef's short films now?)

Steppin' RZA (sic), Monday, 10 August 2020 04:50 (seventeen hours ago) link

Anyway, I don't think this made it onto the thread?:

National Security Advisor Robert O’Brien on @FaceTheNation right now, in response to whether Trump has told Putin to stop meddling in US elections: “Unlike my predecessors, I don’t get involved in conversations the President has with foreign leaders.”

No kidding.

— Rudy Mehrbani (@RudyMehrbani) August 9, 2020

The former director of the CIA and NSA in response:

Holy shit. https://t.co/hrYMthaiJP

— Gen Michael Hayden (@GenMhayden) August 9, 2020

Steppin' RZA (sic), Monday, 10 August 2020 04:56 (seventeen hours ago) link

xp yeah, definitely makes CHOP look pretty bad

btw today there was an anti-mask / pro-Jesus rally on the CHOP site, with hundreds of ppl gathering without masks and publicly baptising each other, and at least one baby, in a grotty tub. The mayor didn't send in one single cop to break them up, let alone hundreds of cops and National Guard to tear-gas them, though, so it'll probably look pretty... good? when the NYT writes it up.

Steppin' RZA (sic), Monday, 10 August 2020 08:41 (thirteen hours ago) link

cripes.

Nhex, Monday, 10 August 2020 09:47 (twelve hours ago) link

Ann Hathaway is Nancy Pelosi in....

PRAY HARD

Li'l Brexit (Tracer Hand), Monday, 10 August 2020 10:52 (eleven hours ago) link

That NYT article on Trump evangelicals in Iowa glosses over a key distinction: these aren't evangelicals, they are an incredibly small group of rural Dutch Calvinists. It mentions Dordt College, the site of Trump's 2016 rally being "named for a major church assembly in 1618 and 1619 that declared salvation was only for God’s chosen ones, and expelled from Dutch territory anyone who disagreed", which is the exact opposite of the American Evangelical belief that people can choose their own salvation and be "born again". What difference does that make? It means that the people interviewed in this article believe that they are "God's chosen people" and live their entire lives attempting to demonstrate evidence that they are part of that chosen in-group, lest they be expelled from it. So, when they talk about their religious freedom being impugned, they're really saying that they've always lived in this insular environment where homogeneity = salvation, and the only way they can continue the faith of their fathers is to keep all outsiders out of it. It's telling that their ancestors fled the Netherlands over this same false sense of "persecution", the Dutch government wouldn't let them kick anyone who disagreed with them out of the country, so they came to these rural Iowa towns where they were left alone for 100 years, and now they're confronting the fact that embracing Trump's racism and misogyny is the closest thing they'll get to preserving their "religious heritage" in 2020.

BrianB, Monday, 10 August 2020 14:36 (seven hours ago) link

That's a v good point.

Li'l Brexit (Tracer Hand), Monday, 10 August 2020 14:48 (seven hours ago) link

I wasn't going to read that article but oh hell yes, Dordt College, I can attest the above is accurate.

There's more Italy than necessary. (in orbit), Monday, 10 August 2020 14:59 (seven hours ago) link

That NYT article on Trump evangelicals in Iowa glosses over a key distinction: these aren't evangelicals, they are an incredibly small group of rural Dutch Calvinists. It mentions Dordt College, the site of Trump's 2016 rally being "named for a major church assembly in 1618 and 1619 that declared salvation was only for God’s chosen ones, and expelled from Dutch territory anyone who disagreed", which is the exact opposite of the American Evangelical belief that people can choose their own salvation and be "born again".

i can see some disagreement about whether that congregation technically counts as "american evangelical" or not. i think their current state (bitter resentment and a false sense of overwhelming persecution) is roughly the same, though.

and i'd also argue that for most evangelicals, there is no contradiction between "belief that people can choose their own salvation and be "born again" and declaring that "salvation was only for God’s chosen ones, and expelled from Dutch territory anyone who disagreed". the way they unify the two is like this: people can choose their own salvation, but god has already chosen who will receive. and on immigration, contemporary god is an angry righteous old testament god who chooses to bless or curse entire nations of evil nonbelievers. get born again or leave.

or...something like that. of course it's a hopeless jumble of contradicting ideas, but that's evangelicalism ime, and if the dordt college people ever feel too over-oppressed, they'd fit right in with thousands of other communities and churches that are virtually indistinguishable from them

The GOAT Harold Land (Karl Malone), Monday, 10 August 2020 15:00 (seven hours ago) link

Also, something that only a former Iowan Dutch Calvinist would likely recognize about that photo of the family praying at the dinner table: all three kids have forks in their food already during the prayer, revealing that they probably started to eat before the parents sat down to pray, which never would've happened when their parents were that age. Just a small detail, but I can tell you, having grown up in it (my sister actually went to Dordt College), those are the kind of things that Iowan Dutch Calvinists obsess about - you had to pray and read the bible at every meal and the church elders would come to your house for "visitation" to observe that your family accurately demonstrated that you were in fact, still part of God's chosen in group. Even this family is not managing to keep the outside world at bay, their kids aren't stopping to pray before touching their dinner. Re-electing Trump is not going to help them with that, and soon enough this tiny, insignificant demographic of Trump voter would go away on its own.

BrianB, Monday, 10 August 2020 15:05 (seven hours ago) link

Oh god I clicked on it, and the article just clowns itself and its subjects over and over.

“I guess the biggest concern for me is trying to keep our country the way it was. Conservative. The values. For us, I mean, this is as good as it gets. We can do whatever we want,” said Mr. Driesen

They want the Christian education for their children “so we don’t have to have them indoctrinated with all these different things,” he said. “We are free to teach them our values.”

She worried that the school might be forced to let in students who were not Christian, or hire teachers who were gay.

“People in my circles, you don’t really hear about racism, so I guess I don’t know too much about it,” Mr. Driesen said of the protests.

There's more Italy than necessary. (in orbit), Monday, 10 August 2020 15:11 (seven hours ago) link

I don't think either the CRC or the RCA are evangelical denominations, that is, I don't think they're committed either doctrinally or habitually to spreading awareness of salvation by conversion. They would probably be offended to be compared to Baptists, for example.

There's more Italy than necessary. (in orbit), Monday, 10 August 2020 15:13 (seven hours ago) link

yeah baptists are total heretics! you think YOU can choose whether to be in god's elect?? pah!

calvinism has this real crazy edge of anxiety and paranoia to it. how will i know if i'm in the elect?? i mean, i can't, but surely someone in the elect would behave in a certain way.. so let's look for those outward signs.. in others... in myself... AAAGGGGHHH

Li'l Brexit (Tracer Hand), Monday, 10 August 2020 15:14 (seven hours ago) link

and i'd also argue that for most evangelicals, there is no contradiction between "belief that people can choose their own salvation and be "born again" and declaring that "salvation was only for God’s chosen ones, and expelled from Dutch territory anyone who disagreed". the way they unify the two is like this: people can choose their own salvation, but god has already chosen who will receive. and on immigration, contemporary god is an angry righteous old testament god who chooses to bless or curse entire nations of evil nonbelievers. get born again or leave.

Uh I think most evangelicals, particularly liberal ones, would loudly call bullshit on the idea that God would willingly exclude anyone who chose salvation.

shout-out to his family (DJP), Monday, 10 August 2020 15:23 (six hours ago) link

Yeah but the point is these are Calvinists not evangelicals

treeship., Monday, 10 August 2020 15:27 (six hours ago) link

Yes, and Karl's arguing that there isn't a difference between them.

shout-out to his family (DJP), Monday, 10 August 2020 15:29 (six hours ago) link

Wait nevermind

treeship., Monday, 10 August 2020 15:30 (six hours ago) link

Yeah i agree with you. Evangelicals evangelize—spreading the faith and saving souls is as important or more than personal virtue, the sole concern of the predestination folks

treeship., Monday, 10 August 2020 15:31 (six hours ago) link

I attended a CRC church for several years (but that was 20 years ago, I married rather than was born into it, etc). The denomination reiterated repeatedly that it is an evangelical denomination, the church does mission work at a denominational level, etc. That's in obvious tension with its ethnocentrism, and this ethnocentrism will be the death of the denomination in a few years (my f-i-l is longtime C@lv1n faculty and has commented on declining enrollment, particularly of their "traditional" student, for many years).

Joey Corona (Euler), Monday, 10 August 2020 15:41 (six hours ago) link

Yeah, I've seen plenty of commentary over the past few years that these sorts are fighting for their way of life because their way of life is literally dying out.

Josh in Chicago, Monday, 10 August 2020 15:43 (six hours ago) link

My favorite part of the article is the mom talking about how she likes living in a bubble where she doesn't have to worry about her kids going outside to play with the neighbor kids, even though they go to another church, and then catches herself, "I don't know, maybe that's naive." - Yes, you absolutely need to be more concerned about your kids mixing it up with kids from other denominations, they might put dangerous ideas in their heads like it's okay to browse the Internet on Sundays.

BrianB, Monday, 10 August 2020 15:49 (six hours ago) link

Uh I think most evangelicals, particularly liberal ones, would loudly call bullshit on the idea that God would willingly exclude anyone who chose salvation.

― shout-out to his family (DJP), Monday, August 10, 2020 10:23 AM (thirty-two minutes ago)bookmarkflaglink

Yeah but the point is these are Calvinists not evangelicals

― treeship., Monday, August 10, 2020 10:27 AM (twenty-nine minutes ago)bookmarkflaglink

Yes, and Karl's arguing that there isn't a difference between them.

― shout-out to his family (DJP), Monday, August 10, 2020 10:29 AM (twenty-seven minutes ago)

i'm not arguing there isn't a difference between them. i'm arguing that to the outsider observer, in terms of actions and political beliefs, there is little to distinguish between the Dordt College crowd and white evangelicals.

i must admit i have never seen the words "liberal" and "evangelical" side-by-side, so i guess that speaks to my lack of perspective, for real. (i have to admit i googled it and found 18,500 results, heh). and not for the first time, i've said "evangelicals" when I really meant "white evangelicals". the overwhelming majority of white evangelicals i've known have been very conservative (and many are homophobic white nationalists to boot).

the seemingly incompatible doctrine thing is something else. i don't expect anyone to agree with me (a good indicator that i'm wrong), and my opinion on it is largely driven by my personal experiences with white evangelicals. all i can say is that in my experience, it is very, very possible to believe that anyone can be saved, and also that god knows who is going to be saved and counts them among his Chosen people.

The GOAT Harold Land (Karl Malone), Monday, 10 August 2020 16:10 (six hours ago) link

and i'd also argue that for most evangelicals, there is no contradiction between "belief that people can choose their own salvation and be "born again" and declaring that "salvation was only for God’s chosen ones, and expelled from Dutch territory anyone who disagreed". the way they unify the two is like this: people can choose their own salvation, but god has already chosen who will receive. and on immigration, contemporary god is an angry righteous old testament god who chooses to bless or curse entire nations of evil nonbelievers. get born again or leave.

I grew up in an evangelical church in S. Illinois and agree 100% with Karl's take. Ime evangelical congregations believe in the doctrine that you choose your own salvation, but they have to square that with a totally omniscient god who already knows the choices you are going to make, so evangelicals get to profess that they are opening and welcoming to anyone choosing to join while at the same time critical and judging of anyone who has not. At least in my experience the prevailing mood for evangelicals is a sort of early-Christian New Testament belief in the end times and that they are a persecuted minority. A certain kind of paranoia justifying the other-ing of outsiders.

I mean in grade school I was lead to believe Catholics were a fringe religious cult that might steal your children.

Mom jokes are his way of showing affection (to your mom) (PBKR), Monday, 10 August 2020 16:18 (six hours ago) link

tbf i think dutch calvinists in 1618 taught their kids the same thing

Li'l Brexit (Tracer Hand), Monday, 10 August 2020 16:43 (five hours ago) link

this is reminding me how much of my information about evangelicals comes from Chick tracts

Doctor Casino, Monday, 10 August 2020 16:59 (five hours ago) link

Imagine growing up in Chick tract. My parents threw out an RPG book of mine when I was in high school because it discussed witches' spells" in it. I was quoted a bible verse about not suffering witches. This was in 1987, not 1697.

Mom jokes are his way of showing affection (to your mom) (PBKR), Monday, 10 August 2020 17:17 (five hours ago) link

my dad make me quit taekwondo because there was a yin-yang patch on my uniform

The GOAT Harold Land (Karl Malone), Monday, 10 August 2020 17:18 (five hours ago) link

sad lol, I think you have me beat. I'm sorry Karl, but that is cracking me up.

Mom jokes are his way of showing affection (to your mom) (PBKR), Monday, 10 August 2020 17:20 (five hours ago) link

heh, there's a lot more where that came from! but yeah, it doesn't prove anything, of course, and i know my experience isn't and can't be typical of white evangelicalism. i would just say that the liberal evangelicals are getting absolutely CRUSHED in the "influence on real life" department, compared to their white nationalist peers.

The GOAT Harold Land (Karl Malone), Monday, 10 August 2020 17:23 (four hours ago) link

Sorry for turning the US Politics thread into a discussion on Theology but I guess it makes sense that these old protestant factions are now coming together with evangelicals under a shared persecution complex based on the exclusion of others. Obviously, Christianity has become more of a political than a religious movement in America, so I guess it no longer matters to them whether they think that they believe they are going to heaven because God chose them or because they chose God, the most important thing that they can all agree on is that LGBT people are an abomination so horrible that being forced to bake a cake for them is tantamount to being burned in a fiery furnace or fed to hungry lions. From there, they can break into religious factions again over the rest of their political views. My parents told me that they went to church this past weekend for the first time since covid hit, and they had to have separate services, one with masks and one without masks because their congregation is so divided on that issue.

BrianB, Monday, 10 August 2020 18:00 (four hours ago) link

tempted to put this in batshit cartoons or trenchant but in any case
http://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=5gGonq-e0gY

Fuck the NRA (ulysses), Monday, 10 August 2020 18:03 (four hours ago) link

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gGonq-e0gY

Fuck the NRA (ulysses), Monday, 10 August 2020 18:04 (four hours ago) link

Would love to see this fucker take a header off Little Round Top on national tv.

Mom jokes are his way of showing affection (to your mom) (PBKR), Monday, 10 August 2020 18:59 (three hours ago) link

TRUMP EVACUATED from White House press briefing room by US Secret Service. An agent locked the briefing room doors from the exterior. pic.twitter.com/El9Xi4lAlE

— Jennifer Jacobs (@JenniferJJacobs) August 10, 2020

would hate to think reason for this is the same reason they pulled the basketball guys (sp?) during their march 11 press conference!!!!

𝔠𝔞𝔢𝔨 (caek), Monday, 10 August 2020 22:10 (ten minutes ago) link

Emergency #2.

"...And the Gods Socially Distanced" (C. Grisso/McCain), Monday, 10 August 2020 22:14 (six minutes ago) link

A private flight from South Bend to Wilmington, Delaware, landed an hour and five minutes ago, per FlightAware. pic.twitter.com/l3XJjDFsVG

— Adam Wren (@adamwren) August 10, 2020

Donald Trump Also Sucks, Of Course (milo z), Monday, 10 August 2020 22:14 (six minutes ago) link

oh god no not pete

Give me a Chad Smith-type feel (map), Monday, 10 August 2020 22:18 (three minutes ago) link

Remember slow news days?

Is that tweet supposed to imagine Mayo Pete meeting with Joe?

soaring skrrrtpeggios (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Monday, 10 August 2020 22:18 (two minutes ago) link


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